Lukewarm believers and faith

[RBDERRICK]

Yes, it is. If one has to do works to ensure their justification, then their justification is incomplete and relies on their works. That is adding works.

No, that is complete election and justification remaining complete, by adding works to our faith.

Once again, righteous works are evidence of having been justified; they do not justify.

Yes, they do. But only for the righteous. The unrighteous are not justified by their works.

Do not call anyone a sinner and imply they are not a saint.

Are you a sinner?

I don't read any Scriptures for sinners that are saints, nor for saints that are sinners.

Psa 1:5 Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous. For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.

What you are teaching is a false gospel that requires works for justification.

No. It requires works to keep wholly sanctified and justified in Christ Jesus.

Col 2:6As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him: Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving.

Needing no works to be justified by faith, is the false gospel of being justified by faith alone, apart from works, including while doing unrighteousness.

Any Christ justifying the person by faith alone, while doing evil, is not Jesus Christ the righteous.

 

[RandyK]

Neither the Father nor the Son was parent to them crucifying Him, nor is parent to them crufiying Him to themselves today.

The point was, it is at the person's "death" that the will becomes active.

No man is born again before His resurrection.

What? Where do you get this stuff? Peter said we are already "born again!"

Adoption and election are by His resurrection from the dead, not before.

No, it is at the death of Jesus on the cross, when just prior he had said, "It is finished." That is, his ensuing death was the beginning of a New Covenant.

 

[Free]

No, that is complete election and justification remaining complete, by adding works to our faith.

Same difference. If works are needed to continue to ensure our justification is complete, then that is adding works to justification.

Yes, they do. But only for the righteous.

No, they do not. Ample biblical evidence has been provided to you repeatedly, yet you not only do not address it, you continue to argue as though it doesn't exist.

Tit 3:4 But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior appeared,
Tit 3:5 he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,
Tit 3:6 whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
Tit 3:7 so that being justified by his grace we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life. (ESV)

This is exactly what I'm saying. You're saying the opposite.

The unrighteous are not justified by their works.

Of course not, no one is justified by their works.

No. It requires works to keep wholly sanctified and justified in Christ Jesus.

Yes, you are teaching a false gospel. Works do not justify. Period. Works are done out of obedience and love for Christ and so are evidence that a person is justified. In so doing, they play a part in our sanctification.

Needing no works to be justified by faith, is the false gospel of being justified by faith alone, apart from works,

That is the true gospel, given throughout the NT, and posted to you ad nauseam and which you have ignored just as many times. Why have you yet to actually directly address the passages given to you?

 

[RandyK]

We don't undo what is not done. I reject your false atonement made by Jesus Christ, before His resurrection.

Your choice. Atonement is made by the sacrifice--not by the resurrection.

The only atonement made by God before the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ, was that of blood of bulls and goats slain and sprinkled by the priests of God.

Yes, that atonement did not require that the animals who were sacrificed be "raised from the dead" before they became a "real atonement!"

You are talking about an atonement made by His death alone.

You stop preaching an atonement made by Jesus' death, before His resurrection, and I'll stop calling it an atonement made by killing the sactifice alone.

No, I'm not going to stop stating that atonement came by Jesus' blood, by Jesus' death. The terminal point of the Old Covenant was the beginning point of the New Covenant. It did not require Jesus' resurrection to apply the blood of Jesus before the throne of God, to make atonement for the people. God saw Jesus' blood immediately, and not only after the resurrection.

Thank you. You preach your own faith alone, not the faith of Jesus Christ.

I only preach the faith of Jesus Christ, and not my own alone.

Jesus' faith was his own. If you don't have your own faith, you can't have faith in anything.

Luke 7.50 Jesus said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.”

Are you going to say that this woman had no faith of her own, that she was saved only because she had "Jesus' faith?" Your view is really weird.

The faith of Jesus Christ is to do His righteousness, which is without spot. The faith of man alone is to do our own righteousness, which is spotty at best.

Proper application of faith in our life requires that we direct our faith to Christ alone to put on his righteousness. We do not have a righteousness of our own apart from this endowment from him to us.

Scriptural faith alone, is being without works.

Having an object of faith, without works, is idolatry.

I've told you that "Faith Alone" expresses a theology, using extra-biblical words to express biblical truth. You can't get that, and end up in heresy.

"Faith Alone" places a premium on directing our Faith to Christ alone for our Justification. That means we can't even produce acceptable righteousness on our own, apart from Christ.

We must trust in Christ's grace alone for our Justification, being that we cannot earn this on our own by Works. Christ's Atonement is available to our Faith by our Faith Alone, and not earned by our Works.