No Charges against God's Elect !

[savedbygrace57]

Rom 8:

31What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?


32He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?

33Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

This too is the Gospel ! We talk much about God's Love and rightly so, for He Loved the world of His own People so much that He sacrificed His Only begotten Son per Jn 3 16 & 1 jn 4 9

Jn 3:

16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

1 jn 4

9In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.

In doing this, He [ God the Father] laid to His Son's charge all the legal condemnation that His sinful People had incurred and rightly deserved, in order that He [ Jesus Christ] would pay the death penalty, the curse, and condemnation on their behalf, that He would satisfy His righteousness and strict Justice.

Christ having done this, God in Justice and Righteousness cannot in all Fairness hold any charges of legal condemnation against any for whom Christ died, namely vs 33 God's elect..

So it is in the scheme of Salvation, that none of those Christ died for, can be legally condemned by God, though they are oft times by others and even themselves, because of the obedience [meaning His Death phil 2:8]. Because of this, it will be given to each of them, and them only to believe on His name per phil 1:

29For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

It is given to some [ who Christ died for and took upon Himself their condemnation] to believe upon His Name..

Those who do believe in Christ through His Gospel, are making manifest that they are not condemned before God [ Christ having taken their condemnation upon Himself], hence it is written,

Jn 3:18a

He that believeth on him is not condemned: Yes, Believing on Him indicates that they are not in a condemned state, why ? Because Christ has been condemned for them..

but next He that believeth not:

but he that believeth not is condemned already: meaning, being in a condemned state already, he cannot believe. Those who reject the True Gospel and its doctrines, make manifest that they are remaining in a condemned state, Christ having not bore their sin penalty, so it is not given to them in behalf of Christ to believe on Him..

because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

In other words, not believing on the only begotten Son is evidence that one is in a already condemned state..

Those who come to believe on Christ are giving evidence of having been given the Faith of Gods elect, and that they never had [as Gods elect] charges laid upon them by God, because God laid them on their Surety and Shepherd His Son Jesus Christ, and it is He that had died for them already..

Those whose sins never being charged to Christ, they cannot believe as indicated by Jn 12:39

Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,

This means too that they were not of God's elect..

 

[savedbygrace57]

Rom 8:

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

This is a scripture that among other things, it teaches us who Christ died for, the elect !

Notice " Who shall lay a charge against God's elect or chosen " of course the answer is no one can bring a charge with any avail against them. Now lets look at the reasons Why !

#1. Because it is God that Justifieth, and that by grace rom 3:

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

#2. It is because Christ hath died ! vs 34, that is it is Christ that hath died for them , the elect in vs 33..

And thats why they cannot be condemned.

Please notice, that Paul gives no reason that the elect done themselves, i.e repent or believe or ect..but rather because Christ hath died, so the inference is that Christ died for their sins as per 1 cor 15:3.

That means Christ was condemned and charged in their stead, and God's wrath towards them has been propitiated, for having been condemned for all their sins, transgressions, trespasses and iniquities and unrighteousness, yes every one of them, past, present and future..

 

[elijah23]

The Lord will withhold blessings from selfish people, whether they are among the elect or not.

 

[savedbygrace57]

Its quite simple, no charges can be laid on the elect of God, because they were laid on the elect of God Christ Jesus..The elect bore the sins of the elect..

 

[savedbygrace57]

Are the elect under God's condemnation for their sins before they repent and believe the Gospel ?

 

[savedbygrace57]

The answer is NO, the elect are never under God's condemnation for their sins, that is legally, because Legally, Christ became their surety before the world began in the Everlasting Covenant. You see Christ blood was shed according to the stipulations of a everlasting covenant heb 13:

20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

As the Surety in that Covenant, He represented only the Sheep..thats why it says He , the Great Shepherd of the Sheep was brought again from the dead..

According to that Covenant, The Shepherd of the Sheep was Liable for all the Transgressions of those Sheep, God the Father never laid their liabilities on the Sheep, but on thew Shepherd of the Sheep..

This is another way of saying rom 8:

33Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect [sheep]? It is God that justifieth.

34Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ [The Shepherd] that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Notice He is risen again, cp with heb 13 20 where it says "brought again from the dead, the Great Shepherd of the Sheep" or it could read, Brought again from the Dead the Great Shepherd of the Elect..

 

[savedbygrace57]

If one who Christ died for in 33 ad, be born in 1950, If God laid all their sins on Christ, and condemned and punished Christ for them in 33 ad, is that one being born 1950 a sinner, born condemned by God for the sins that God condemned Christ already for ?

 

[savedbygrace57]

The Surety of the Covenant Heb 7:



22By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.



When did Jesus become a Surety of the better Covenant, the New Covenant which is the bringing forth and establishment of the Everlasting Covenant. A Covenant Established by and in the God Head before the World Began, And so when Christ, the God Man Mediator struck hands as Surety for the Elect, they were in God's Mind Justified; and this was the same time, that the sins of the elect were imputed to His Charge and they were free from any legal condemnation and declared Justified before the foundation, Christ having already purposed to come into the World and die for their sins that were laid to His Charge as Surety and Covenant Head Mediator

 

[savedbygrace57]

Now in light of the Everlasting Covenant, God Eternally Purposed not to punish sin in His People, the Elect, but in His Son their Head and Surety. His Purpose to punish their sins in His Son, and not punish them in the Elect themselves, concludes their Justification from all sin in God's sight from everlasting..God does not lay any charge against His Elect rom 8:

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

This verse proves that non imputation = God's Justification..

 

[savedbygrace57]

Christ Atonement and the bearing of the sins of the elect, the Church, was in the Mind of God from Everlasting as though already accomplished rev 13:

8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain [perfect tense] from the foundation of the world.

So the OT Saints were actually Justified by it [Atonement] that is made righteous as Abel was shown to be heb 11:

4By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

Now if this be True, why should it not be that the elect were not Justified from Eternity, since God had the Atonement of the Lamb then in His Mind ?

Faith therefore is a manifestation and attestation of our Justification before God..

 

[Hawkins]

I do think that you are confusing yourself by introducing the pre-destination concept which actually no humans can truly understand fully.

On the other hand, the theory itself is rather simple IMO. God applies Law to govern freewills. By the old covenants, humans need to obey His Law one way or another in order to pass the judgment to return. They are more like crops of harvest in the field. Yet since at times and gradually they fall short of the Law's requirement, most or even all people, especially modern humans, may not be able to pass the judgment by Law. In God's eye, His field (planet earth) will no longer grow crops. Humans are all the dead in terms of salvation.

Under this circumstance, God's self-sacrifice through Jesus Christ brought us humans a new covenant. In this new covenant, we only need to believe in Jesus Christ by following His teaching to be saved. We are all supposed to be the dead without Jesus. With Jesus Christ, we however have the hope to be saved. Moreover, we are no longer judged by the Law, as in front of the Law we are already the dead. Instead, we follow Jesus Christ's teaching to be holy. We no longer need to filfull what are strictly required by the Law. Instead, we only need to come to Jesus Christ's satisfaction to be saved.

 

[savedbygrace57]

hawk:

I do think that you are confusing yourself by introducing the pre-destination concept which actually no humans can truly understand fully.

You mean you cannot understand,and now you want to divert to a rabbit trail..

 

[savedbygrace57]

Justification before God is before Believing it or receiving it by Faith !

If one is not Justified before God [legally] before the act of faith or believing, then we must infer that our act of believing, though its by grace and the power of the Holy Spirit, has a casual effect on legal Justification before God ! Then this would contributing to our legal standing before God, which means that Justification before God is something man did, believing which is a work ! Let me explain why I say that, you see believing is an action of the renewed mind or New Heart we receive when we are made New Creatures by regeneration or New birth, now what is a work ? The for work is the greek word ergon and means:

business, employment, that which any one is occupied

a) that which one undertakes to do, enterprise, undertaking

2) any product whatever, any thing accomplished by hand, art, industry, or mind

3) an act, deed, thing done: the idea of working is emphasised in opp. to that which is less than work

You see that in def #2 any product or producing whatever and anything accomplished by the mind !

To accomplish is :

To succeed in doing:

This word work ergon is also translated doing rom 2:

7To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

Now is not Faith something that is well pleasing to God ? Heb 11:6
So a work is an act of the Mind, which is what believing is, so to insist that one is Justified legally before God by our act of believing, is admitting [ though perhaps unwittingly] Justification by works, our act of believing, and therefore nullifying, making void the Fact that God legally Justified one by the blood or death of Christ rom 5:

9Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Now listen, that's saying that even though over 2000 yrs ago, when Christ shed His blood, that it had not legally Justified the Justice of God for my sins, yet even His very resurrection evidenced the Justification of all those Christ bore their offences per rom 4:

25Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

That[resurrection] proved that Christ blood legally Justified before God those whose sins He bore Isa 53:11

by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

Friend, those of you who insist that legal Justification before God is a result of an act of believing, you have taken away the Legal value of Christ blood and replaced it with an act of man, and it does not matter if its an act proceeding from regeneration, because all spiritual acts are from that source, so all of them could qualify as casual reasons for legal Justification before God..If one continues to hold that view in light of what is being witnessed to, that means you insist on legal Justification before God based upon ones works.. May God be merciful to His Chosen.
__________________

 

[Eventide]

Mine elect, in whom My soul DELIGHTETH !

May God be merciful to His Chosen.

God has been merciful to His Chosen One.. and has given Him a name that is above every name, and every man shall bow the knee to Him alone and confess that He is LORD to the glory of the Father.. and He hath inherited all things of His Father..

It goes on and on.. but when the focus of election is completely removed from the Lord Jesus Christ and then placed upon condemned men.. then it's a mess of confusion.. and people make thousands of posts talking about the 'elect' without ever mentioning CHRIST..

Sad isn't it ?

 

[savedbygrace57]

Christ Suretyship !



Heb 7:

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament or Covenant.

When was Jesus made a Surety and What Covenant ? The Lord Jesus Christ was made a Surety before the world began of the everlasting Covenant, this Covenant is where it was determined that He would in the fulness of time shed His Blood, and so its[His Blood] termed the blood of the everlasting covenant heb 13:

20Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

Now Christ by His being made a Surety, there was laid or imputed upon Him all the debt of sin for His Sheep, the Chosen People of God, the Elect, and this made Him solely responsible for it. Thats why Paul writes in 2 cor 5:

19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

Now this world is the World of the elect rom 8:33-34 or the world of the Sheep, of which He was the Great Shepherd of heb 13:20 and since He was made a surety for them, There trespasses cannot and did not were imputed to them. God the Father no longer expected satisfaction from the Sheep, but from their Shepherd and Surety, and they the actual sinners and guilty parties, must be set free as pictured here Job 33:

24Then he is gracious unto him, and saith, Deliver him from going down to the pit: I have found a ransom.

So, Who can lay any charge against God's elect ? It is Christ that died..

 

[Elijah674]

Christ Suretyship !



Heb 7:

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament or Covenant.

When was Jesus made a Surety and What Covenant ? The Lord Jesus Christ was made a Surety before the world began of the everlasting Covenant, this Covenant is where it was determined that He would in the fulness of time shed His Blood, and so its[His Blood] termed the blood of the everlasting covenant heb 13:

20Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

Now Christ by His being made a Surety, there was laid or imputed upon Him all the debt of sin for His Sheep, the Chosen People of God, the Elect, and this made Him solely responsible for it. Thats why Paul writes in 2 cor 5:

19To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

Now this world is the World of the elect rom 8:33-34 or the world of the Sheep, of which He was the Great Shepherd of heb 13:20 and since He was made a surety for them, There trespasses cannot and did not were imputed to them. God the Father no longer expected satisfaction from the Sheep, but from their Shepherd and Surety, and they the actual sinners and guilty parties, must be set free as pictured here Job 33:

24Then he is gracious unto him, and saith, Deliver him from going down to the pit: I have found a ransom.

So, Who can lay any charge against God's elect ? It is Christ that died..

Great Eternal Truths! That is what it is ALL ABOUT, God IS PROVING TO THE UNIVERSE [Who Their Elect are!] They have always known, and it will not be long now, before both the Saved & the Lost will also know.

---Elijah

PS: I just went to post on another site which has a daily verse come up. It seemed providential? so I brought it back for here.

In this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while you may have had to suffer grief in all kinds of trials. These have come so that your faith--of greater worth than gold, which perishes even though refined by fire--may be proved genuine and may result in praise, glory and honor when Jesus Christ is revealed. </B>

1 Pet 1:6-7

 

[childeye]

I do think that you are confusing yourself by introducing the pre-destination concept which actually no humans can truly understand fully.

On the other hand, the theory itself is rather simple IMO. God applies Law to govern freewills. By the old covenants, humans need to obey His Law one way or another in order to pass the judgment to return. They are more like crops of harvest in the field. Yet since at times and gradually they fall short of the Law's requirement, most or even all people, especially modern humans, may not be able to pass the judgment by Law. In God's eye, His field (planet earth) will no longer grow crops. Humans are all the dead in terms of salvation.

Under this circumstance, God's self-sacrifice through Jesus Christ brought us humans a new covenant. In this new covenant, we only need to believe in Jesus Christ by following His teaching to be saved. We are all supposed to be the dead without Jesus. With Jesus Christ, we however have the hope to be saved. Moreover, we are no longer judged by the Law, as in front of the Law we are already the dead. Instead, we follow Jesus Christ's teaching to be holy. We no longer need to filfull what are strictly required by the Law. Instead, we only need to come to Jesus Christ's satisfaction to be saved.

Many people understand predestination. You don't because your adherence to the theory of freewill stands in the way. Those who choose to disobey God do not know Him and are therefore not free in their wills, but lost in their souls.

 

[Eventide]

Many people understand predestination. You don't because your adherence to the theory of freewill stands in the way. Those who choose to disobey God do not know Him and are therefore not free in their wills, but lost in their souls.

So how do you understand the biblical doctrine of predestination.. ?

 

[Eventide]

All you need to do is read what the bible says about predestination... that we are predestined to the ADOPTION OF CHILDREN by Jesus Christ.. not complicated at all... and Romans 8 teaches us that we are waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our bodies.

Now I would suppose that the Calvinist version is a little more geared to how God unconditionally chose them and then enabled them to repent and believe, and take up their cross..

 

[Elijah674]

Many people understand predestination. You don't because your adherence to the theory of freewill stands in the way. Those who choose to disobey God do not know Him and are therefore not free in their wills, but lost in their souls.

So are you teaching me that every one that believes as your post reads is saved?
--Elijah