No Pretrib Rapture

[Exeter]

Rev 17:3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.

Nowhere in that verse does it say riding the beast from the sea.

Implied, like many things in Scripture:

Rev 17:7 And the angel said to me, Why did you marvel? I will tell you the mystery of the woman and of the beast that carries her, that has the seven heads and ten horns.

 

[for_his_glory]

Implied, like many things in Scripture:

That's the problem that leads to misunderstanding the word of God as when one implies something that is not written without other supporting scripture then it causes one to add to or take away from truth.

BTW, this thread is about no pretrib Rapture. If you would like to start a new thread about mystery Babylon tag me in and will discuss it in full there.

 

[for_his_glory]

About the content above, the Word of GOD explains very well who is the red dragon. What matters and prevails is the Word of GOD, the Word is GOD, GOD Himself, self-executing, understand?

Apocalypse (Revelation) 12:9 reveals : -And the great dragon was (will be)cast out,
that old serpent,
called the Devil,
and Satan,
which deceiveth the whole world:(as we can see, including by Internet)
he was (will be) cast out (from heaven-Ephesians 1:3-8) into the earth,
and his messengers (2Corinthians 11:13-15) were (will be) cast out with him.


I disagree . First, in John 8:44 my Lord JESUS describes Him specifically as a liar, saying to the Jews: Ye are of your father the Devil(the MAN of sin, a Jewish MAN, the son of perdition), and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning (killed Abel-Matthew 23:33-35), and abode not in the Truth, because there is no Truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. It's it.

OTOH, "the dragon being great and red" as you said, it is not only because his malign nature, but he is great as is written in Luke 4:5-7:
5 The Devil taking JESUS up into an high mountain,shewed unto JESUS all the kingdoms of the world, 6 saying unto JESUS: All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it. 7 If thou therefore wilt worship me, all shall be thine. It's it.

Finally, regarding dragon be red , linking "red" as "the nature and character of the dragon being fierce and murderous. In fact it is his SPIRIT as is showed when Cain killed his bother-Genesis 4. We are talking of the Word of GOD, not of the storytellers. In fact, biblically speaking, it is the Hebrew word Edom means "red", and the Hebrew Bible relates it to the name of its founder, Esau, the elder son of the Hebrew patriarch Isaac, because he was born "red all over". As a young adult, he sold his birthright to his brother Jacob.

FURTHERMORE, in this current moment the dragon still has not 7 heads, it will be added to his satanic body only after he stealthy manifest himself as a lamb(a false lamb, a false messiah-John 5:43-47), an esoteric, and kabbalistic, and spiritist messiah, and he will speak as dragon, as is written in Revelation 13:11. In fact he is at door, he was born decades ago, and as soon as he declares himself as the messiah of the Jews-John 5:43-47, he will sit in the holy city of Jerusalem shewing himself that he is God.-2 Thessalonians 2.

Get ready

Here is the mind which hath wisdom. What does the Word of GOD say? The 7 heads are 7 mountains, on which the woman sitteth-Revelation 17:9. Now, now, it already has lasted 2000 years the woman sits on 7 mountains. Which are these mountains? Who is the woman? Do you know? Do you have the answers? Please, tell us.
The 7 heads is linked with 7 kings. Who are them? 5 are fallen, is, the seventh still will be manifest ahead.

What does the Word of GOD say? The 7 heads are 7 mountains, on which the woman sitteth-Revelation 17:9. Now, now, it already has lasted 2000 years the woman sits on 7 mountains. Which are these mountains? Who is the woman? Do you know? Do you have the answers? Please, tell us.
The 7 heads is linked with 7 kings. Who are them? 5 are fallen, is, the seventh still will be manifest ahead.
continue a short space.

I stop in this point for now.

The subject about mystery Babylon is derailing the intentions of the OP. If you want to make a new thread about the dragon and mystery Babylon please tag me in and will discuss it in full.

 

[Exeter]

That's the problem that leads to misunderstanding the word of God as when one implies something that is not written without other supporting scripture then it causes one to add to or take away from truth.

BTW, this thread is about no pretrib Rapture. If you would like to start a new thread about mystery Babylon tag me in and will discuss it in full there.

No thanks. I corrected an earlier mistake by commenting that Satan aka the dragon are not mentioned in Rev 17. Job done.

I showed that the beast carries Mystery Babylon the Great which implies she is riding it. Job done.

Jesus didn't know whether His Return was pretrib, midtrib or post-trib so I'm going with that. Job done.

 

[for_his_glory]

No thanks. I corrected an earlier mistake by commenting that Satan aka the dragon are not mentioned in Rev 17. Job done.

I showed that the beast carries Mystery Babylon the Great which implies she is riding it. Job done.

Jesus didn't know whether His Return was pretrib, midtrib or post-trib so I'm going with that. Job done.

Very well. You have a great evening

 

[DavidT]

No thanks. I corrected an earlier mistake by commenting that Satan aka the dragon are not mentioned in Rev 17. Job done.

I showed that the beast carries Mystery Babylon the Great which implies she is riding it. Job done.

Jesus didn't know whether His Return was pretrib, midtrib or post-trib so I'm going with that. Job done.

Sorry to say, but you need to read your Bible more.

Jesus DID... say when His future return will be... so whether you believe Jesus or not on that, that is really where you show your doubt is about it...

Matt 24:29-31
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
KJV

Can't get any more straightforward than that. Jesus comes IMMEDIATELY AFTER... the "great tribulation" to gather His 'faithful' Church.

This Matt.24:31 version is about Paul's mention of Jesus bringing the asleep saints with Him when He comes, as they are resurrected first (1 Thess.4:13-16). The Mark 13:27 version is about Jesus gathering the saints still alive on earth at His return, what Paul called being "caught up" (1 Thess.4:17).

So don't allow any deceiver try and tell you that Lord Jesus was only speaking to Jews there in His Olivet discourse; no, Jesus was speaking to His whole Church, including the believer on Him today.

 

[for_his_glory]

Sorry to say, but you need to read your Bible more.

Jesus DID... say when His future return will be... so whether you believe Jesus or not on that, that is really where you show your doubt is about it...

Matt 24:29-31
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
KJV

Can't get any more straightforward than that. Jesus comes IMMEDIATELY AFTER... the "great tribulation" to gather His 'faithful' Church.

This Matt.24:31 version is about Paul's mention of Jesus bringing the asleep saints with Him when He comes, as they are resurrected first (1 Thess.4:13-16). The Mark 13:27 version is about Jesus gathering the saints still alive on earth at His return, what Paul called being "caught up" (1 Thess.4:17).

So don't allow any deceiver try and tell you that Lord Jesus was only speaking to Jews there in His Olivet discourse; no, Jesus was speaking to His whole Church, including the believer on Him today.

But yet, no one knows the day or the hour as this is only a sign Jesus gave us to watch for.

Mat 24:36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
Mat 24:37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
Mat 24:38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
Mat 24:39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

 

[DavidT]

But yet, no one knows the day or the hour as this is only a sign Jesus gave us to watch for.

And that does what, to what Lord Jesus Christ said there about His coming after the tribulation? Did He give you the day or the hour when that will happen? Nope, He sure did not, and I never proclaimed a certain day or hour either.

The reason why you most likely brought that hour/day topic up from Jesus' Olivet discourse is because the Pre-trib Rapture doctors try... to make something of that topic, to get their deceived believers to stay away from understanding those SIGNS of the 'end' which Jesus gave His faithful Church there in His Olivet discourse. No man knows the day or hour of Christ's future return, like Jesus said. Yet He 'commanded' us to be watching those SIGNS of the end He gave us...

Mark 13:34-37
34 For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.

35 Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:

36 Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.

37 And what I say unto you I say unto all, "Watch."
KJV

Lord Jesus Christ was good to His faithful Church with giving us the SIGNS of the 'end' to be watching for leading up to the time of His future return. He did not give us a specific day or hour of His future return, but He did tell us it would be immediately after... the coming "great tribulation" (Matt.24:29; Mark 13:24). So I choose to listen to Christ on that, and not men's doctrines.

Oh yeah, those 7 SIGNS our Lord Jesus Christ gave in His Olivet discourse are the SEALS of Revelation 6. Even His whole Book of Revelation is more information about those 7 SIGNS He gave His Church leading up to His future return.