[__ Science __ ] one reason that abortion is acceptable to us

[Riven]

We live in a world that teaches that we evolved from chickens.

No. That's not what is taught in science class. Lol.

So the logic, of course I'm speaking for those who don't believe that a supernatural being created us in His image, taking the egg from a woman really, morally, isn't any different than going out to the henhouse and collecting eggs.

This is true. There is no moral standard without God. It's merely opinion.

We need to teach and proclaim that we, human beings, did not evolve from some other life form for whom God really doesn't care for, as He cares for us.

Why?

Evolution is a lie, as it has any relation to human beings.

Then how do you explain away all the evidence in the fossil record?

Now, there may be cases that some change in an animal was caused by some change in DNA or whatever over the last 6,000 years.

No. That's not enough time. These creatures evolved over millions of years.

But honestly, I would say only very, very small changes. As far as there being some whole new 'kind' of animal evolving from some other animal, no, that's never happened. Sure, a fish, still as a fish, may have evolved some adaptation to its fins or scales or something. But for a fish to become a dog ever... Nah!

So evolution isn't a lie? You seem to be contradicting yourself a bit. No one is saying a fish evolved into a dog.

But, in denial of God's truth, we teach that the universe and the earth and all that is on it has existed for millions and billions of years. That allows us to make up all these ideas. But if we stick with what God's word tells us, less than 10,000 years is not enough time for much evolution to take place.

The earth has existed for billions of years. Plenty of time for evolution. Even putting evolution aside, why aren't the dinosaurs ever mentioned in Genesis? I think it's fairly straight forward: the writers of Genesis had no idea that dinosaurs ever existed because. Just like 99% of every creature that has ever lived on this planet, they had gone extinct by the time Genesis was written.

The same can be said for the Neanderthals. They are also conspicuously absent from the creation story. Another species that had gone extinct before Genesis was written.

However, as the Scriptures seem to pretty clearly explain, the vast majority of the people who pass by in life on this earth, aren't going to have that worldview. Why not? Because science has 'proven' that it just can't be so.

That's correct. It's one thing to believe in God. It's quite another to believe that the stories within the bible are literal truth or an account of history about what really happened. If you are truly interested in what evolution actually is and what evidence exists, I will link a video below that you may find interesting.

 

[miamited]

Hi Uncle J

I posted it to support what I'd said earlier, namely that all religions have their version of prophecies, miraculous dreams/visions, unexplained events, revealed advanced knowledge, etc., that they point to as evidence that their beliefs are true.

Yes, I suppose we did. I don't remember my ask being quite so long. So maybe I can't spell or speak well.

Like I said, all the major religions have "accurate and fulfilled prophecies", so I don't see this as much different. Plus, it's a Jewish book, so if I found what you posted compelling, logically I should become a Jew.

Now your claim of what your statement said, or what I asked is pretty long. It now includes miracles, dreams/visions, unexplained events, and finally revealed advanced knowledge (prophecy). And I responded to you that what you're reading is nothing more than the hundreds of NDE's that we now find in many books and other people's personal accounts of temporarily 'dying'. I suppose you see a connection there, but honestly, I don't.

As far as prophecies from other religions, like I said earlier it's been decades since I looked at any, so if you're interested all I can suggest is to do what I did....go look. The main thing I remember about them is that their believers are just as confident as you are about their accuracy and divine origin.

Yes, I read that, and now you're position is that if I want to prove 'your' claim, I've got to go look. Gosh that sounds so much like what I hear turned back on you when you ask people to support some political claim.

Here's what I believe because....

Well, what evidence can you provide to support that?

Hey, go find it for yourself! I don't have to prove that what I'm saying has any basis in truth to you. And no, you certainly don't, but I do hope that you understand that you're now using the same argument that seems to frustrate you so much in many of your political posts.

Finally, it's important to remember another thing I posted to you earlier in this thread. Prophecies, accurate or not, were not at all a factor in my decision to not be a Christian. As I explained, it was mostly due to how the general outline of Christianity's story made no sense to me, and how when I sought clarification and answers from Christian leaders and the like, I found their answers completely unsatisfying (and they got just as frustrated with me).

I did expect that you weren't familiar with the prophecy that I was about to discuss. And I honestly don't remember you posting to me this information that you're talking about that prophecy wasn't a factor in your decision to not be a christian. And I don't remember reading a post where you explained to me about the frustrations you had with getting answers when you were seeking before. If you did, I don't remember and I'm sorry. If you want to redirect me to the post, I'll take a look.

But the fact that you had a frustrating time getting answers in your previous seeking really doesn't have any bearing on the reality, that the Scriptures say, will be the destiny of all. Jesus speaks of the reality of eternal life without him is going to be of weeping and gnashing of teeth where the worm doesn't die. Friend, I'm just making an effort to keep you safe from that, which is a command that Jesus has given me. He tells those of us who would follow after him to go and preach the gospel to all the world and for those who would believe to then baptize them and also teach them all that he has commanded us.

But in Israel there were millions of Jews who didn't get it even as he was dying on the cross. So, if you're not interested that's ok. I'm really only supposed to tell people about the hope that I have if they ask, which is why I asked for permission.

Yes, everything is now clear about your situation. Sometimes, those who claim to be of God are more dangerous to God's purposes than those who don't. So, in your situation that seems to be the case. Rather than giving you the answers and teaching you the truths about God, His Son and His word, in some way they frustrated you in your seeking. I'm truly sorry.

God bless,
Ted

 

[miamited]

Hi Riven

No. That's not what is taught in science class. Lol.

Oh yes, it may not say chickens, but it does declare that the animal kingdom, which includes man in their thinking, evolved from some pre-existing creature. I just pick chicken because we do do the chicken dance. LOL

Why?

Because my premise is that a lot of the abortion issue likely stems from our believing that we aren't made in the image of God, but are just evolved animals. I believe that if we were to be able to hold the line in our schools and colleges that we are, in fact, creatures made in the image of God, it may quell the flood. That's all.

Then how do you explain away all the evidence in the fossil record?

What evidence? I mean yes, I know there are fossils. My position is that in dating things we use a flawed understanding which immediately dismisses the power of God and His ability to do that which is impossible.

Example: The Scriptures tell us that Jesus was born of a virgin. Now we know that's impossible. But if we believe the Scriptures, they say that it did happen. The Scriptures speak of time that a sea, referred to as the Red Sea parted for several thousand people to pass walking on dry ground. The claim is that there was a wall of water on both their right hand and on their left. That describes a fully parted body of water that is at least deep enough we later find, to drown soldiers in chariots. If the description of the sea is correct, Red Sea, it would have been several hundred feet in places. That's impossible. Everyone knows that water seeks level and couldn't possibly have a chasm in it. I mean the tide might go out or in and the sea on one side of someone be lower or higher, but that's not how the description is in the Scriptures.

Another account tells of a time that God was offering a proof to a man that something he was going to do would happen. God asks if the man would rather see the shadow cast by the sun on a flight of steps should go forward or backward. The man replied backwards. He know that forward just meant you could wait 30 minutes and the shadow would have gone forward. But for a shadow cast by the sun to go backwards? Well he knew that would be an impossibility and only God could do that!

Now again, I'm not saying that fossils don't exist. My position is that we've been wrong in extrapolating their ages.

So evolution isn't a lie? You seem to be contradicting yourself a bit. No one is saying a fish evolved into a dog.

Ok, fine. So where did dogs come from? Where did roosters come from? Where did toads and fish and all the other animals that we see walking on the earth...come from? Were they all here the moment the earth coalesced from space dust billions of years ago?

God bless,
Ted

 

[Uncle J]

Now your claim of what your statement said, or what I asked is pretty long. It now includes miracles, dreams/visions, unexplained events, and finally revealed advanced knowledge (prophecy). And I responded to you that what you're reading is nothing more than the hundreds of NDE's that we now find in many books and other people's personal accounts of temporarily 'dying'. I suppose you see a connection there, but honestly, I don't.

Yes, I read that, and now you're position is that if I want to prove 'your' claim, I've got to go look. Gosh that sounds so much like what I hear turned back on you when you ask people to support some political claim.

Here's what I believe because....

Well, what evidence can you provide to support that?

Hey, go find it for yourself! I don't have to prove that what I'm saying has any basis in truth to you. And no, you certainly don't, but I do hope that you understand that you're now using the same argument that seems to frustrate you so much in many of your political posts.

Wait, are you actually disputing that non-Christian religions claim to have accurate prophecies?

I did expect that you weren't familiar with the prophecy that I was about to discuss.

No, I'm familiar with it. Like I said, I grew up around Christianity and have read the Bible.

And I honestly don't remember you posting to me this information that you're talking about that prophecy wasn't a factor in your decision to not be a christian.

The end of Post #28.

And I don't remember reading a post where you explained to me about the frustrations you had with getting answers when you were seeking before. If you did, I don't remember and I'm sorry. If you want to redirect me to the post, I'll take a look.

That may have been in another discussion. My apologies.

But the fact that you had a frustrating time getting answers in your previous seeking really doesn't have any bearing on the reality, that the Scriptures say, will be the destiny of all.

Actually it does. Before I can be persuaded that it's "reality", it has to at least make sense first.

Jesus speaks of the reality of eternal life without him is going to be of weeping and gnashing of teeth where the worm doesn't die. Friend, I'm just making an effort to keep you safe from that, which is a command that Jesus has given me. He tells those of us who would follow after him to go and preach the gospel to all the world and for those who would believe to then baptize them and also teach them all that he has commanded us.

I'm familiar with Christianity.

But in Israel there were millions of Jews who didn't get it even as he was dying on the cross.

Well as I explained earlier, Jesus didn't meet the criteria to be the Jewish Messiah. The Messiah was supposed to be a man (not a god or demi-god), return all Jews to the homeland, rebuild the Temple, conquer the enemies of Israel and reign over global peace, etc.

So, if you're not interested that's ok. I'm really only supposed to tell people about the hope that I have if they ask, which is why I asked for permission.

I've heard all this countless times before, so it's fine.

Yes, everything is now clear about your situation. Sometimes, those who claim to be of God are more dangerous to God's purposes than those who don't. So, in your situation that seems to be the case. Rather than giving you the answers and teaching you the truths about God, His Son and His word, in some way they frustrated you in your seeking. I'm truly sorry.

Well to be honest, a lot of what's gone on in this thread is pretty typical of the responses I used to get. I've posted to you about how Jesus didn't meet the criteria to be the Jewish Messiah, how Christianity's outline doesn't make sense to me, how all religions claim to have accurate prophecies, how if Daniel is divine then since it's Jewish that would mean I should become a Jew, and a few other things....

.....and honestly, from my POV you either didn't reply to them or did so in a very shallow and unsatisfactory way (e.g., by basically saying Jews aren't saved in reply to my pointing out the Daniel is a Jewish prophecy).

That's been my experiences with Christian apologetics. It seems merely giving an answer is good enough, regardless of whether it's actually a decent, meaningful answer. As one of my old friends used to say, apologetics are for reaffirming the faith of the already faithful, not for converting non-believers.

So don't think you've not done well or anything like that. You've done about as well as every other person who's tried to persuade me. I think what it mostly boils down to is that we have different ways of thinking.

 

[Uncle J]

Because my premise is that a lot of the abortion issue likely stems from our believing that we aren't made in the image of God, but are just evolved animals. I believe that if we were to be able to hold the line in our schools and colleges that we are, in fact, creatures made in the image of God, it may quell the flood. That's all.

The problem there is, we teach science, not religion, in science classes. And the science is unambiguously clear....humans evolved from non-human ancestors. We can prove that via the same comparative genetic methods that are used to establish relatedness in courts.

Plus, women have been aborting since....well, about forever, and certainly well before any notion of human evolution came along. So reality doesn't match up with the cause-effect relationship you're asserting.

Ok, fine. So where did dogs come from? Where did roosters come from? Where did toads and fish and all the other animals that we see walking on the earth...come from? Were they all here the moment the earth coalesced from space dust billions of years ago?

This is a good example of what I meant by you and I just thinking differently. To me, the answers to those questions are best derived by scientifically studying the earth and its life, whereas I'm betting you see the best way is to go with what the Bible teaches.

 

[miamited]

Hi again Uncle J

Wait, are you actually disputing that non-Christian religions claim to have accurate prophecies?

Well, I've asked you to post some and so far you haven't. What have you got? And before we go to far into it, I did request a prophecy that was at least 100 years in its fulfillment. I mean, I'm not interested that some guy wrote in a religious tome that tomorrow.... or next year.... . And let me also say that the prophecies that are held to be true in the muslim faith that are also in the Jewish Scriptures wouldn't count. I think everyone agrees that before Abraham the muslim and christian writings are pretty much in alignment.

The end of Post #28.

I went back and read post #28. My apologies, I did see in that last paragraph that you referenced it not being the reason for your position. I'm sorry, it just didn't register or I glossed over it and didn't remember.

That may have been in another discussion. My apologies.

Kind of the same thing that happened to me in missing your claim in #28.

Anyway, you asked me not to proselytize and so I don't want this to become some head bashing argument, although I am fine to continue if you would like. As I've said, I always read your posts and feel like you're a person of reasonable understanding and I wouldn't want that to change, nor disturb our discussions in the future.

God bless,
Ted

 

[Uncle J]

Hi again Uncle J
Well, I've asked you to post some and so far you haven't. What have you got? And before we go to far into it, I did request a prophecy that was at least 100 years in its fulfillment.

I guess then I did misread you. I didn't realize you were disputing that prophetic claims in other religions exist. Okay then, here are the search results I get....

Islamic prophecies

Hindu prophecies

Buddhist prophecies

I mean, I'm not interested that some guy wrote in a religious tome that tomorrow.... or next year.... .

I'm not really sure why you're interested in them at all. I simply noted that they exist; I made no claims as to their accuracy, validity, origins, or anything else.

And let me also say that the prophecies that are held to be true in the muslim faith that are also in the Jewish Scriptures wouldn't count. I think everyone agrees that before Abraham the muslim and christian writings are pretty much in alignment.

That doesn't matter to me.

I went back and read post #28. My apologies, I did see in that last paragraph that you referenced it not being the reason for your position. I'm sorry, it just didn't register or I glossed over it and didn't remember.

Thanks!

Anyway, you asked me not to proselytize and so I don't want this to become some head bashing argument, although I am fine to continue if you would like. As I've said, I always read your posts and feel like you're a person of reasonable understanding and I wouldn't want that to change, nor disturb our discussions in the future.

Thank you, and I'm fine with leaving this as it is. It's pretty consistent with other experiences I've had, and I'm sure the same is true for you as well.

 

[Riven]

Because my premise is that a lot of the abortion issue likely stems from our believing that we aren't made in the image of God, but are just evolved animals. I believe that if we were to be able to hold the line in our schools and colleges that we are, in fact, creatures made in the image of God, it may quell the flood. That's all.

The problem with your premise is that you're essentially starting with a conclusion and working backwards. I really don't think women that have abortions are thinking about science when they do it.

What evidence? I mean yes, I know there are fossils. My position is that in dating things we use a flawed understanding which immediately dismisses the power of God and His ability to do that which is impossible.

That's one of the reasons why I linked that video that actually goes over the evidence. It's an hour and twenty minutes of your time.

Example: The Scriptures tell us that Jesus was born of a virgin. Now we know that's impossible.

Correct.

But if we believe the Scriptures, they say that it did happen.

Right. Just like the Quaran says Muhammad flew to heaven on a winged horse. But you don't believe that one. So, why believe this one?

The Scriptures speak of time that a sea, referred to as the Red Sea parted for several thousand people to pass walking on dry ground. The claim is that there was a wall of water on both their right hand and on their left. That describes a fully parted body of water that is at least deep enough we later find, to drown soldiers in chariots. If the description of the sea is correct, Red Sea, it would have been several hundred feet in places. That's impossible. Everyone knows that water seeks level and couldn't possibly have a chasm in it. I mean the tide might go out or in and the sea on one side of someone be lower or higher, but that's not how the description is in the Scriptures.

You said it yourself. It's impossible. There's also no evidence that it actually occurred. It's great story, but it's still just a story.

Another account tells of a time that God was offering a proof to a man that something he was going to do would happen. God asks if the man would rather see the shadow cast by the sun on a flight of steps should go forward or backward. The man replied backwards. He know that forward just meant you could wait 30 minutes and the shadow would have gone forward. But for a shadow cast by the sun to go backwards? Well he knew that would be an impossibility and only God could do that!

Yeah, I think that's because people back then thought the earth was the center of the universe and that it was the sun that went around the earth instead of the other way around.

Now again, I'm not saying that fossils don't exist. My position is that we've been wrong in extrapolating their ages.

Why do you think science is correct about the fossil record, but is incorrect when it comes to the dating of the fossils? Flat eathers make the same argument you're making. Most of them will acknowledge gravity exists, but they insist that science is wrong about the earth being round.

 

[miamited]

Hi Uncle J

Islamic prophecies

Hindu prophecies

Buddhist prophecies

Did you read those links? Yes, the Islam prophecies do have some pretty generic claims that the earth will become more corrupt as time goes on.
The Hindu link talks about things that no one would possibly be able to prove as having been fulfilled. (Remember, I'm asking for fulfilled prophecy and not just prophetic things being spoken or written. I mean I can write that one day the moon will turn to cheese, but that hasn't been fulfilled yet so no one could prove me wrong...yet. It speaks that a Brahma's life will be millions of years old. Has anyone got any proof that's true?

The Buddhist prophecy is similar. It speaks in general terms about what's going to happen at some end, but there's yet no proof that it's the truth.

Daniel's prophecy was specific. It mentions a Messiah that is going to come. It tells how long it's going to be before he comes. We now know, now that Jesus has come, and I think that whether or not one believes that Jesus is this Messiah, he was living on the earth in 32 A.D., the end of the prophetic time that Daniel was given.

Like I say, if you read any of your links, I don't think anyone could possibly equate those prophecies with the specificity of God's prophecies. That the Messiah would be born in Bethlehem. A really nowhere place of absolutely no importance in Jesus' day. He would be born of a virgin. Yes, that's one that we can't prove without having known Mary's state of virginity when she became pregnant. But it's fairly well accepted, and maybe only in the christian community that she was a virgin. And it is declared some 500 years later by the gospel writers that she was the virgin with child spoken of in the earlier Scriptures.

As I say, I'm not going to beat you over the head about it, but surely, if you read those links, even you can see the vast difference between the specificity of the prophesy of Daniel and the specificity of the prophecies in your link. And the Scriptures have a whole lot more specific prophecies that point to a specific event. Not something like a generalization that the world is going to wax worse as time continues. Although the Scriptures do tell us that also. But that's why I don't discuss any of them. Those are honestly claims that any Jean Dixon could likely make.

I'm not really sure why you're interested in them at all. I simply noted that they exist; I made no claims as to their accuracy, validity, origins, or anything else.

Because this conversation started with me asking permission to share with you what it was that sealed the decision for me that there must be a God in heaven. It's fulfilled prophecy and God even encourages us to use that as a proof. He claims to know the end from the beginning and that things He says will come to pass, will come to pass. As I mentioned, that's one of the reasons that it took 1500 years for the Scriptures to be complete. God wanted us to know that He is truly the only one who does know the end from the beginning and He filled the old covenant writings with hundreds of them. That as far as I know, every one that has been fulfilled has been fulfilled just as God said. There is specificity in God's prophecies.

Isaiah write of several dozen prophecies. The entire books that are considered the books of the prophets are replete with prophecies that we have seen come to fulfillment just as they were told they would.

So, if you're up to it. What's your possible explanation as to how Daniel knew that some 100 years after his death there would be a decree issued to rebuild Jerusalem. How did Daniel come to be so exactly correct that at the end of the period encompassed by the 69 sevens, Messiah would be here...and he was!

God bless,
Ted

 

[miamited]

Hi Riven

The problem with your premise is that you're essentially starting with a conclusion and working backwards. I really don't think women that have abortions are thinking about science when they do it.

Your post is duly noted and I'm in agreement that women likely don't consider science when deciding on an abortion. I'm saying that it's easier to consider having one, if you don't see the fetus growing in your womb as being another being created in the image of God. And no, that's not working backwards.

That's one of the reasons why I linked that video that actually goes over the evidence. It's an hour and twenty minutes of your time.

Fair enough. But I've been through most of evolutionary theory so I'm not willing to give up that much time to listen to what I already know that people believe about evolution and the fossil record. As I say, my contention is that we're all going to find out one day, that they were wrong.

Right. Just like the Quaran says Muhammad flew to heaven on a winged horse. But you don't believe that one. So, why believe this one?

Again, fair enough.

You said it yourself. It's impossible. There's also no evidence that it actually occurred. It's great story, but it's still just a story.

Yes I did. But then I followed up that nothing is impossible for God. Yes, it's impossible for man to work out that a woman can have a child without any human sperm. Yes, it's impossible for man to part a sea. Yes, it's impossible for man to turn back a shadow cast by the sun. So that's going to boil down to whether or not you believe God's word, which was the basis for starting this with prophecy. As I was explaining to Uncle J, the reason I came to believe the word of God and wanted to seriously look into the practice of christianity, which then led me to believe all of these 'stories', was because of the amazing accuracy, beyond any accuracy in prophecy that any other person or religion can offer, of the prophecies of the Scriptures that appear to have all come true. I mean, we do have extrabiblical sources that confirm many of the prophecies being realized.

So the first step for me in my walk of faith, was that I heard about these prophecies and began looking into them Once I did that, and found the amazing specificity with which hundreds of them had been fulfilled, my heart and soul rejoiced that there is a God in heaven. It must be so, because it's impossible for a man to know, with such specificity the things that God's word prophesies.

And that understanding was what started this entire discussion between @uncJ and I.

Hey guys! Did you know that there's also a prophecy in the Scriptures that works out to exactly May 1948 for the restoral of the Jews?

God bless,
Ted

 

[Uncle J]

Did you read those links?

Not one bit.

I think we have another disconnect here, so I'll reiterate a couple of things. First, my decisions about whether or not to believe in the stories of various religions had nothing to do with prophecies. And second, I only mentioned that they exist in other religions. If they're all a load of hooey, okay then....it makes absolutely no difference to me (see my first point above).

Because this conversation started with me asking permission to share with you what it was that sealed the decision for me that there must be a God in heaven.

Okay, I appreciate you taking the time to share and write up all the info in your posts.

So, if you're up to it. What's your possible explanation as to how Daniel knew that some 100 years after his death there would be a decree issued to rebuild Jerusalem. How did Daniel come to be so exactly correct that at the end of the period encompassed by the 69 sevens, Messiah would be here...and he was!

It's not something I've ever specifically looked into at all, and that's because it simply doesn't interest me.

 

[miamited]

Hey Uncle J

Well I do appreciate you being open to listen. The Scriptures say that we plant the seed, God provides the harvest.

So, let's go save the world over in the politics forums. But I still hold that our understanding of evolution has a lot to do with our attitudes about abortion.

God bless,
Ted

 

[Riven]

Fair enough. But I've been through most of evolutionary theory so I'm not willing to give up that much time to listen to what I already know that people believe about evolution and the fossil record. As I say, my contention is that we're all going to find out one day, that they were wrong.

Well the thing is, we have a mountain of evidence for evolution and no evidence for the biblical stories of Noah's Ark and the Garden of Eden. There's no evidence of snakes talking, nor virgin births, nor men walking on water, nor raising people from the dead, and so forth.

Now, if when we we die, we get to meet this creator, then it will not mean that science was wrong. Primarily because this deity kept itself absolutely hidden from the living. If it then condemns us to an eternity of torture and torment for not believing it existed or remaining indifferent to it's existence, it will demonstrate that it never was worthy of worship, and that it is nothing more than a cosmic dictator. A celestial Kim Jong Un, if you will.

 

[Riven]

Look, Harry Potter evolved into an Asian.

 

[miamited]

Hi Riven

Well the thing is, we have a mountain of evidence for evolution and no evidence for the biblical stories of Noah's Ark and the Garden of Eden.

Yes, that appears to be what a lot of people believe. Which is why I referenced that it's a very likely candidate for the delusion that God said that He would send upon mankind. As for the rest...well, we'll see whether you're right or not about the nature of God. If He does exist.

They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness.

God bless,
Ted

 

[Riven]

As for the rest...well, we'll see whether you're right or not about the nature of God. If He does exist.

I hope I'm wrong.

They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.

None of them refuse. They just can't believe it. Just like you can't force yourself to believe that the moon is made of cheese.

 

[Barbarian]

In my humble opinion, it's just wonderful to know that the universe was created as a singularity,
that it's fine tuned, that physics could be proven by mathematics, and that the heart beats and we don't really know why,

We know that pretty well. As a very recent recipient of a pacemaker, I took the time to find out how it all works (or in my case didn't). I always had a very low heart rate, which I assumed was from being an athlete in HS. To avoid being too technical, the pacemaker node in the right atrium was not communicating effectively with the node that activates Perkinje fibers (modified muscle tissue that acts as nerves in the heart), slowing my beats to about 30 from my usual 55 or so. So walking a block tired me out badly. A little device under my skin (with leads into my heart) now make things work great. What's cool is that an app on my phone now interrogates the device and relays any issues to the manufacturer to make sure I'm safe. Technology can be a wonderful thing.

 

[Barbarian]

I hope I'm wrong.


None of them refuse. They just can't believe it. Just like you can't force yourself to believe that the moon is made of cheese.

Truth is, it's not anything that has anything to do with one's salvation. God doesn't care what we think about evolution. He cares if we love Him and love our neighbors. Do that, and you're assured of salvation.

 

[miamited]

Hi Riven

None of them refuse. They just can't believe it. Just like you can't force yourself to believe that the moon is made of cheese.

Touche'

God bless,
Ted

 

[Tenchi]

Hi folks,

This morning I was cooking up some eggs for breakfast. Eggs are the embryos of chickens, right?

We live in a world that teaches that we evolved from chickens. So the logic, of course I'm speaking for those who don't believe that a supernatural being created us in His image, taking the egg from a woman really, morally, isn't any different than going out to the henhouse and collecting eggs.

I think the monstrously heinous business of baby murder - infanticide - that some refer to as "pro choice," or "protecting the health of women," or "bodily autonomy," depends on bad reasoning rather than evolutionary theory. By means of very slippery and specious "logic," and the use of dehumanizing terminology, murdering unborn babies (and born ones, now, too) has become commonplace. Greg Koukl's website, Stand To Reason (www.str.org) has some excellent videos and articles on the matter of abortion (aka baby murder). I would urge all Christians interested in properly arming themselves for discussion on this issue to check out his material!