Should women teach in the church?

[JLB]

Most of the NT is an instructive guide to pastors.

Please post the passages that teach us about the role of Pastors in the Church.

 

[JLB]

OK, again...We have posted scriptures many times saying women are not to have authority over men.

LOL.

We all agree that women are not to teach over a man.


Please post the scriptures that teach us the role of a Pastor in the church, since you claim is women are FORBIDDEN to be Pastors.





JLB

 

[JLB]

I would hope so, until he is old enough for the father takes over.

Is it right for a mother to each her teenage son?

How about her twenty year old son?


At what age is a mother forbidden to teach her son?

 

[JLB]

So why do you think they can, over and above that dominion, to teach a whole church?

You have me mixed up with someone else.

I stated that a woman is not to teach OVER a man.

However, if her husband the Pastor, gives her permission to release a word to the church then she certainly isn’t teaching OVER her husband but actually submitting to him.



JLB

 

[JLB]

They can't, so your point is moot.

Please show me in the scriptures where a woman can’t have godly character?


Where does it say a woman can not be reverent, or not double tongued, not given to much wine, not greedy for money, or not
holding the mystery of the faith with a pure conscience, or not
being found blameless…

Again, I was stating that the women who are given a place of authority or children or youth should first meet the same qualifications of godly character as a man.

It would be shameful for you to think women can not have godly character.


Who can find a virtuous wife?
For her worth is far above rubies.
The heart of her husband safely trusts her;
So he will have no lack of gain.
She does him good and not evil
All the days of her life.
She seeks wool and flax,
And willingly works with her hands.
She is like the merchant ships,
She brings her food from afar.
She also rises while it is yet night,
And provides food for her household,
And a portion for her maidservants.
She considers a field and buys it;
From her profits she plants a vineyard.
She girds herself with strength,
And strengthens her arms.
She perceives that her merchandise is good,
And her lamp does not go out by night.
She stretches out her hands to the distaff,
And her hand holds the spindle.
She extends her hand to the poor,
Yes, she reaches out her hands to the needy.
She is not afraid of snow for her household,
For all her household is clothed with scarlet.
She makes tapestry for herself;
Her clothing is fine linen and purple.
Her husband is known in the gates,
When he sits among the elders of the land.

 

[JLB]

These qualifications in these verses are for males only. There is nothing about a woman in the verses. A woman is not a man and is disqualified from the calling. If you are looking for verses about "forbidding women from being pastors" in those exact words, you will not find it. Just like you find no examples of woman pastors in the Bible or qualification's for them to be a pastor. This is exactly what satan wants, for the church to go against Gods design and calling of His men.

So you believe it is Satanic for women to be teachers and instructors over children and youth?


Ok, please give me some examples of how Pastors (men) are to serve in the church leadership structure.



JLB

 

[JLB]

You mentioned a few in your earlier post. I believe it was, Kathryn Kuhlman and Joyce Myers (I forget the other one) both false teachers that mix truth with error.

I didn’t mention Joyce Meyers.

I believe many men mix truth with error both in the church and in this Forum.


Does that disqualify men from being teachers?



JLB

 

[electedbyHim]

So you believe it is Satanic for women to be teachers and instructors over children and youth?


Ok, please give me some examples of how Pastors (men) are to serve in the church leadership structure.



JLB

JLB​

So you believe it is Satanic for women to be teachers and instructors over children and youth?

I never even implied that.

JLB​

Ok, please give me some examples of how Pastors (men) are to serve in the church leadership structure.

There is a distinct pattern for church leadership in the New Testament, although the pattern seems to be assumed rather than specifically prescribed. The New Testament mentions two official positions in the church: deacons and elders (also called pastors or overseers).

The words elder (sometimes translated “presbyter”), pastor (which may be translated “shepherd”), and overseer (sometimes translated “bishop”) are used interchangeably in the New Testament. Even though these terms often mean different things among various churches today, the New Testament seems to point to one office, which was occupied by several godly men within each church. The following verses illustrate how the terms overlap and are used interchangeably:

In Acts 20:17–35, Paul is speaking to leaders from the Ephesian church. They are called “elders” in verse 17. Then in verse 28 he says, “Pay careful attention to yourselves and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to care for the church of God.” Here the elders are called “overseers” and their pastoral/shepherding duties are implied as the church is called the “flock.”

In Titus 1:5–9, Paul gives the qualifications of elders (verse 5) and says these qualifications are necessary because “an overseer must be above reproach” (verse 7). In 1 Timothy 3:1–7, Paul gives the qualifications for overseers, which are essentially the same as the qualifications for elders in Titus. In 1 Peter 5:1–4, Peter tells the elders to “shepherd the flock of God.” From these passages, we see that the office of elder/pastor-shepherd/overseer-bishop is one. Those who occupy this office are to lead, teach, and watch over the church like a shepherd.

Furthermore, we see that every church has elders (plural). Elders are supposed to rule and teach (1 Timothy 5:17). The biblical pattern is that a group of men (and elders are always men) is responsible for the spiritual leadership and ministry of the church. There is no mention of a church with a single elder/pastor who is in charge of everything, nor is there any mention of congregational rule (although the congregation plays a part).

While the elders are responsible for teaching and leading the flock, there is still much that needs to be done on the physical level. The office of deacon focuses on the more physical needs of the church. In Acts 6, the church in Jerusalem was meeting the physical needs of many people in the church by distributing food. Some of the widows came to the apostles because they were not getting what they needed. The apostles responded, “It is not right that we should give up preaching the word of God to serve tables” (Acts 6:2). To relieve the apostles, the people were told “pick out from among you seven men of good repute, full of the Spirit and of wisdom, whom we will appoint to this duty. But we will devote ourselves to prayer and to the ministry of the word” (Acts 6:3–4). Although the men chosen here are not called deacons, most Bible scholars see them as the first deacons, or at least prototypical of the position. The word deacon simply means “servant.” Deacons are appointed church officials who minister to the more physical needs of the church, relieving the elders to attend to more spiritual ministry. Deacons are to be spiritually fit, and the qualifications of deacons are given in 1 Timothy 3:8–13.

In summary, elders lead and deacons serve. These categories are not mutually exclusive. Elders serve their people by leading, teaching, praying, counseling, etc.; and deacons may lead others in service. In fact, deacons might be the leaders of service teams within the church. Still, there is the basic distinction between those responsible for spiritual leadership of the church and those responsible for service.

So, where does the congregation fit in to the pattern of church leadership? In Acts 6, it was the congregation who chose the deacons, so many churches today will have the congregation nominate and ratify the deacons of the church. And, of course, the members of the congregation are to be the primary ministers and evangelists reaching out to a lost world. The idea that the congregation hires professional ministers to do the work of the church is unbiblical.

There may be local variations of church leadership because this is only a basic pattern; every detail is not prescribed in Scripture. The basic pattern found in the New Testament is that every church should have a plurality of godly male elders who are responsible for leading and teaching the church and godly deacons who are responsible for facilitating the more physical aspects of church ministry. A plurality of elders protects the church from the weaknesses and possible excesses a single elder might bring. As long as this basic pattern is followed, the church is operating according to the biblical pattern. Having a sole pastor who controls the church is not the biblical pattern, and neither is an arrangement in which the pastor works for the deacons who really run the church. The congregation is to follow the leading of the shepherds who follow Christ. In their wisdom, the elders may request congregational approval of major decisions, but the congregation should not be the final authority. The buck stops with the elders/pastors/overseers, who answer to Christ.

 

[JLB]

I never even implied that.

Well that is what I am discussing.

 

[JLB]

I never even implied that.

Ok, please give me some scriptural examples of how Pastors (men) are to serve in the church leadership structure.

 

[electedbyHim]

Well that is what I am discussing.

If you backtrack, early on in this thread I said the Bible teaches that woman can teach woman and children.

 

[electedbyHim]

Ok, please give me some scriptural examples of how Pastors (men) are to serve in the church leadership structure.

I just did, but you either did not like the answer or just ignored it all together.

Your turn....

Show where the Bible teaches a woman is called to Pastor and why churches (especially the Pentecostal/charismatics) allow it when it is not Biblical.

 

[jaybo]

A person with the gift of the Holy Ghost won't go against the Holy Ghost.
Do you actually think they will somehow have different ideas that counter each other?
I don't.

Not I.
God made the rules/laws.

Amen to that.
But as men can't have babies, there is nothing in common except our standing in Christ Jesus.
Those in Christ Jesus won't ever fight against scripture.
If a woman wants authority over men, she is not in Christ Jesus.

So there has always been unity in the church? Try reading your Bible more carefully. Here is a single example: "When Cephas came to Antioch, I opposed him to his face, because he stood condemned." Galatians 2:11 Which one of those two apostles weren't filled with the Holy Ghost? And another, "My brothers and sisters, some from Chloe’s household have informed me that there are quarrels among you. What I mean is this: One of you says, “I follow Paul”; another, “I follow Apollos”; another, “I follow Cephas[a]”; still another, “I follow Christ.” 1 Corinthians 1:11-12 If you don't think that there are different ideas held by Spirit-filled people, you are oblivious to the truth.

You wrote that God made the rules/laws, but Christians are not governed by rules/laws, but by the Holy Spirit. I am shocked that you don't understand this most basic fact of Christianity!

You keep referring to men having babies. What does that have to do with anything relevant to Christianity? It is silly! Men have beards, women have breasts, etc. Physical differences are irrelevant in Christianity. You writing "But as men can't have babies, there is nothing in common except our standing in Christ Jesus" is nonsense! Women and men are equal in the eyes of God!!!

We agree that those in Christ Jesus won't ever fight against scripture, so why do you fight against Scripture?

"If a woman wants authority over men, she is not in Christ Jesus" is complete nonsense. God calls whomever He chooses to whatever role He wants them to fulfill. It is not gender-dependent, and never will be. You are just making an excuse to dominate women, which is contrary to Scripture and the will of God.

 

[electedbyHim]

So there has always been unity in the church? Try reading your Bible more carefully. Here is a single example: "When Cephas came to Antioch, I opposed him to his face, because he stood condemned." Galatians 2:11 Which one of those two apostles weren't filled with the Holy Ghost? And another, "My brothers and sisters, some from Chloe’s household have informed me that there are quarrels among you. What I mean is this: One of you says, “I follow Paul”; another, “I follow Apollos”; another, “I follow Cephas[a]”; still another, “I follow Christ.” 1 Corinthians 1:11-12 If you don't think that there are different ideas held by Spirit-filled people, you are oblivious to the truth.

You wrote that God made the rules/laws, but Christians are not governed by rules/laws, but by the Holy Spirit. I am shocked that you don't understand this most basic fact of Christianity!

You keep referring to men having babies. What does that have to do with anything relevant to Christianity? It is silly! Men have beards, women have breasts, etc. Physical differences are irrelevant in Christianity. You writing "But as men can't have babies, there is nothing in common except our standing in Christ Jesus" is nonsense! Women and men are equal in the eyes of God!!!

We agree that those in Christ Jesus won't ever fight against scripture, so why do you fight against Scripture?

"If a woman wants authority over men, she is not in Christ Jesus" is complete nonsense. God calls whomever He chooses to whatever role He wants them to fulfill. It is not gender-dependent, and never will be. You are just making an excuse to dominate women, which is contrary to Scripture and the will of God.

You are so far from the truth as others have pointed out.

 

[jaybo]

You are so far from the truth as others have pointed out.

Simply your opinion, for which I have no respect.

 

[electedbyHim]

Simply your opinion, for which I have no respect.

Many have shown where you take Scripture out of context and use it for you own theology.

Can you show anywhere in Scripture where woman are called to the Pastorate?

 

[Hopeful]

Wicked macho men.

Wicked unGodly men.

 

[Hopeful]

The fake Toronto experience.
.

Never been there.

 

[Hopeful]

Please post the passages that teach us about the role of Pastors in the Church.

No, as there are too many.
Think of a pastor like this..."shepherd".

 

[Hopeful]

LOL.

We all agree that women are not to teach over a man.


Please post the scriptures that teach us the role of a Pastor in the church, since you claim is women are FORBIDDEN to be Pastor.

If your church has men in it, women can't be the pastor. (1 Tim 2:12)