Spiritual gifts: Unconfusing them

[hawkman]

What do you mean by this? Why do you suggest this?

Because he said this .

We now have the bible to guide us and no longer need the piece meal parts of the body.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Because he said this .

It’s interesting when someone assumes something is confusing to many people is the hope out of the mess. When we propose we aren’t at all confused, it throws a monkey wrench in the works.

 

[Elijah777]

I guess you like to yell loudly as well attack people personally when you have no answer.

Adieu

Jesus wasn't kind to hypocrites. Amazing Iconoclats' mocking tongues = a real tongue. Do you think God is trying to tell him/her something ???

Paste Iconoclast's tongues into Google translate ... detect language and see what you get. Maye God is trying to get through your hard heart and thick spirit ???

roko mokoshondi..koo kooo balon ey

 

[hawkman]

Some who despise scripture create stories.

True .

They speak of moving in the gifts, moving in the Spirit, none of which is described in the bible.

Can there be a movement of the Holy Spirit , sure . Yes you are right , moving in the Spirit is not right .

Some of them have posted they do not attend any local assembly in direct disobedience to scripture.

Hebrews10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

The real issue is many have turned from the safety of the word of God, and have invented fables, about all manner of things.

True .

You and millions of other Christians are discounted because you question these claims and the foolish noises . Have you seen the videos where the people eat grass? Others where they jump around and make animal noises? laugh like fools? crawl around while the guy on the platform tells them, follow me sheep?

This is why I share my past experiences , they line up with God's word . The ones you just mentioned do not line up with God's word .

 

[Iconoclast]

Hey Hidden in Him,

I can tell you another time, I saw someone get SAVED and BAPTIZED in HOLY SPIRIT, with tongues immediately following.

I walked home from Church one day. A neighbor's 8 year old boy was sitting on a trash can in the alley across from my house. I walked over and said: so you're mad at your Mom ... eh ? The boy was surprised ... asking how I knew ? I said, God told me. We talked a bit about how God wanted him to obey his Mom ! Then I preached Jesus to him ... and he said he believe all that. So I asked if he'd like to say a prayer with me. I led him into/thru a "sinner's prayer !" Bang ! I could see a real move of the Spirit ! The boy explained, it felt like a REAL BIG RAIN ... but none hit the ground ... but filled him up ! Wow ! So I said to the boy ... you hear a language inside you. Again, he said, how do you know ? I said, God showed me. So, then I encourage the little guy to speak out the words he was hearing. Bingo ! He began speaking in tongues.

Really, I was concerned that Mom might not be so excited. The next thing that happened, there was someone at my front door. Mom maybe ??? Yikes ??? No, it was the little guy's sister. She wanted the tongues. So, I sat with the kids in the yard and preached Jesus to her. She believed ... prayed sinners prayer. Nothing ! She was disappointed. I said, don't worry, I know it happened ... we asked God for the same gift ... go your way and it will happen. About 1/2 hour later, she was at my front door ... demonstrating her gift of other tongues. MAGNIFICENT GOD !

Through that interaction, several other kids in the district also gave their lives to the Lord and received the Baptism of HS.

As best as I can recount the above ... God my witness ... this is what happened ! Later I found out the Mom was a Christian !

Yeah...i am sure this is what happened.

 

[Iconoclast]

True .

Can there be a movement of the Holy Spirit , sure . Yes you are right , moving in the Spirit is not right .

Hebrews10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

True .

This is why I share my past experiences , they line up with God's word . The ones you just mentioned do not line up with God's word .

Thank you for your offer to answer any questions HM.

 

[Iconoclast]

Jesus wasn't kind to hypocrites. Amazing Iconoclats' mocking tongues = a real tongue. Do you think God is trying to tell him/her something ???

Paste Iconoclast's tongues into Google translate ... detect language and see what you get. Maye God is trying to get through your hard heart and thick spirit ???

roko mokoshondi..koo kooo balon ey

You can make accusations all day . That does not change anything. Nothing I said is hypocritical so you are committing a ninth-commandment violation. maybe you are so busy with story telling that you forget the commandment,
Maybe God did not "tell you" His commandments are in effect. Maybe wait 30 minutes and the message will find you!

 

[Iconoclast]

https://duckduckgo.com/?t=piriform&...=https:%2/www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQgjKOBWPQ8

of course this is why we want to bring people to church;

 

[Hidden In Him]

It’s interesting when someone assumes something is confusing to many people is the hope out of the mess. When we propose we aren’t at all confused, it throws a monkey wrench in the works.

Yes. There are two people in this thread who, while they are actually deeply confused, are nevertheless assuming everyone else is. One of them is a game-player who would never actually answer any direct line of questioning if his life depended on it. The other is simply teaching the standard fare of the Cessationists, but he too has refused to answer me directly after asking him three times now a direct question. That is the MARK of confusion when people have no answer. They're not electing to refrain from answering in keeping with 2 Timothy and Titus, they simply don't have one.

 

[Iconoclast]

I can tell you another time, I saw someone get SAVED and BAPTIZED in HOLY SPIRIT, with tongues immediately following.
I walked home from Church one day. A neighbor's 8 year old boy was sitting on a trash can in the alley across from my house. I walked over and said: so you're mad at your Mom ... eh ? The boy was surprised ... asking how I knew ? I said, God told me.

We talked a bit about how God wanted him to obey his Mom ! Then I preached Jesus to him ... and he said he believe all that. So I asked if he'd like to say a prayer with me. I led him into/thru a "sinner's prayer !" Bang ! I could see a real move of the Spirit ! The boy explained, it felt like a REAL BIG RAIN ... but none hit the ground ... but filled him up ! Wow ! So I said to the boy ... you hear a language inside you. Again, he said, how do you know ? I said, God showed me. So, then I encourage the little guy to speak out the words he was hearing. Bingo ! He began speaking in tongues.

Maybe you heard this;

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Yes. There are two people in this thread who, while they are actually deeply confused, are nevertheless assuming everyone else is. One of them is a game-player who would never actually answer any direct line of questioning if his life depended on it. The other is simply teaching the standard fare of the Cessationists, but he too has refused to answer me directly after asking him three times now a direct question. That is the MARK of confusion when people have no answer. They're not electing to refrain from answering in keeping with 2 Timothy and Titus, they simply don't have one.

Excellent evaluation!! You’ve identified the situation superbly.

 

[Elijah777]

https://duckduckgo.com/?t=piriform&...=https:%2/www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQgjKOBWPQ8

of course this is why we want to bring people to church;

You and Dorothy Mae, remind me of those mocking Jews of Acts 22. 11 - 13

vs 11 “Cretans and Arabs—we hear them speaking in our own tongues the wonderful works of God.”
vs 12 So they were all amazed and perplexed, saying to one another, “Whatever could this mean?” = the tongues, speaking wonderful words of God
vs 13 Others mocking [ = Iconoclast & Dorothy Mae ] said, “They are full of new wine.” = drunk ! God says they were WRONG !

Like the 'mockers' then, and now [ = Iconoclast & Dorothy Mae ], we can conclude, those mockers never received the Joel promise [ John Baptist promise of Baptism of HS by Jesus Lk 24.49 and Jesus promise Acts 1.5 ], with the ONLY logical evidence [ = tongues ] ... which was observed by the 3000+ Jews, who asked for the GIFT !

God doesn't give the gift of tongues to mockers ... because, they couldn't stand to think they were extolling the wonderful works of God, in a language their brains cannot comprehend ! Too bad !

Jesus the same yesterday today and forever. Jesus is the Baptizer in HS !

 

[Elijah777]

You can make accusations all day . That does not change anything. Nothing I said is hypocritical so you are committing a ninth-commandment violation. maybe you are so busy with story telling that you forget the commandment,
Maybe God did not "tell you" His commandments are in effect. Maybe wait 30 minutes and the message will find you!

You know Iconoclast,,You really can't look at evidence correctly. You mockingly try to write Gibberish roko mokoshondi..koo kooo balon ey ... and it turns out half your so-called Gibberish is translated by Google as Lingala.

What are the odds of that happening = 1 out of 133 = pretty wild, considering thousands not available ? Google only has approx. 133 languages it translates ... the first half of your so-called Gibberish ... could be one of the thousands of languages in the world ... or even angelic language ! You haven't a clue ... when a Christian is correctly using the gift of other tongues ... what language it might be.

Your mocking Gibberish is a slap in your face.

I don't accuse you of anything ... sorry thinking you were either male/female ... i didn't see the profile tag. Anyways ...if I was fabricating ( lying ) about my experiences ... only God and I know the truth ! Why don't you tell God I'm lying about the incident with the 8 year old boy and other testimonies. God is my Witness ... He knows ... to the best of my recollection ... the general gist of the story and key points is truthful !

I don't care if you use some example from the internet ... where people MAY BE CONTRAVENING Paul's/God's instructions. 1st Cor. 14.2 says ... the real tongue talkers ... speak to God, not men, who doesn't understand !

 

[Iconoclast]

You know Iconoclast,,You really can't look at evidence correctly. You mockingly try to write Gibberish roko mokoshondi..koo kooo balon ey ... and it turns out half your so-called Gibberish is translated by Google as Lingala.

What are the odds of that happening = 1 out of 133 = pretty wild, considering thousands not available ? Google only has approx. 133 languages it translates ... the first half of your so-called Gibberish ... could be one of the thousands of languages in the world ... or even angelic language ! You haven't a clue ... when a Christian is correctly using the gift of other tongues ... what language it might be.

Your mocking Gibberish is a slap in your face.

I don't accuse you of anything ... sorry thinking you were either male/female ... i didn't see the profile tag. Anyways ...if I was fabricating ( lying ) about my experiences ... only God and I know the truth ! Why don't you tell God I'm lying about the incident with the 8 year old boy and other testimonies. God is my Witness ... He knows ... to the best of my recollection ... the general gist of the story and key points is truthful !

I don't care if you use some example from the internet ... where people MAY BE CONTRAVENING Paul's/God's instructions. 1st Cor. 14.2 says ... the real tongue talkers ... speak to God, not men, who doesn't understand !

No one speaks in tongues today.
Many make foolish rhyming noises, making believe it is some secret language.
It is not. Listen...I would love to be an Apostle or prophet but that is not what God has ordained. The Apostles and prophets have given us all we need for life and Godliness.
I posted some big-name guys doing foolish things that cause the name of God to be evil spoken of. You wrongly assume many things in this discussion. You think I am not familiar with the teaching, and yet you are wrong with this. I have gone and been in the front row of some big name faith healers who were frauds. I know all the teaching, I know the verses they are going to try and foist upon everyone. I could teach it, but i do not want to be guilty of being a lying ,false teacher claiming all manner of supernatural claims that in the long run show to be lies.

 

[Elijah777]

No one speaks in tongues today.
Many make foolish rhyming noises, making believe it is some secret language.
It is not. Listen...I would love to be an Apostle or prophet but that is not what God has ordained. The Apostles and prophets have given us all we need for life and Godliness.
I posted some big-name guys doing foolish things that cause the name of God to be evil spoken of. You wrongly assume many things in this discussion. You think I am not familiar with the teaching, and yet you are wrong with this. I have gone and been in the front row of some big name faith healers who were frauds. I know all the teaching, I know the verses they are going to try and foist upon everyone. I could teach it, but i do not want to be guilty of being a lying ,false teacher claiming all manner of supernatural claims that in the long run show to be lies.

Sorry, you're wrong ! Why don't you tell God your false doctrine !

The Corinthians and the Ephesians of Acts 19, were not apostles or prophets either, yet the scriptural proof is clear ... they spoke in other tongues. Clearly, 1 Cor. 12 also indicated they ( Corinthians ) could also receive other spiritual gifts, besides the tongues they were incorrectly using according to Paul ( God ) in 1 Cor. 14.

1 Cor. 12 and 14 applies to 21st century Christians ! Why would God give ME and other believing Christians, these instructions ... if the gift does not manifest today ... or passed away, like some unbelievers teach. You cannot justify or explain why these instructions don't apply !

I've seen many things done wrong in churches. However, I've seen so many real miracles ... I know God still heals today ( men only pray ). For example, a young 8 (?) year old Russian speaking girl had deteriorating eye sight. ophthalmologists told her she'd likely be blind by her early teens ... she was wearing very thick glasses. Less than 5 minutes after prayer, she said her eyes were tickling and approx. 10 minutes later she said her eyes were watering ... first time ever ( not real sure on this, but watering ). By the time the family left for home, the girl took off her glasses forever ... she's never needed glasses since and her eye sight is somewhat supernatural ... able to read smallest type and see long distances ( other don't seem to be able to do ). To many other examples to tell ... where doctors were stunned by the changes in the persons who were healed by God !

Oh well Iconoclast, you won't change my experiences and knowledge of scriptural proofs.

You go ahead with your stance.

One day, we'll both find out who was correct in their biblical doctrinal understanding and practice !

 

[Iconoclast]

Sorry, you're wrong ! Why don't you tell God your false doctrine !

The Corinthians and the Ephesians of Acts 19, were not apostles or prophets either, yet the scriptural proof is clear ... they spoke in other tongues. Clearly, 1 Cor. 12 also indicated they ( Corinthians ) could also receive other spiritual gifts, besides the tongues they were incorrectly using according to Paul ( God ) in 1 Cor. 14.

1 Cor. 12 and 14 applies to 21st century Christians ! Why would God give ME and other believing Christians, these instructions ... if the gift does not manifest today ... or passed away, like some unbelievers teach. You cannot justify or explain why these instructions don't apply !

I've seen many things done wrong in churches. However, I've seen so many real miracles ... I know God still heals today ( men only pray ). For example, a young 8 (?) year old Russian speaking girl had deteriorating eye sight. ophthalmologists told her she'd likely be blind by her early teens ... she was wearing very thick glasses. Less than 5 minutes after prayer, she said her eyes were tickling and approx. 10 minutes later she said her eyes were watering ... first time ever ( not real sure on this, but watering ). By the time the family left for home, the girl took off her glasses forever ... she's never needed glasses since and her eye sight is somewhat supernatural ... able to read smallest type and see long distances ( other don't seem to be able to do ). To many other examples to tell ... where doctors were stunned by the changes in the persons who were healed by God !

Oh well Iconoclast, you won't change my experiences and knowledge of scriptural proofs.

You go ahead with your stance.

One day, we'll both find out who was correct in their biblical doctrinal understanding and practice !

Your experiences do not trump scripture. You do not have a grasp on the biblical teaching. I have interacted with a few others who claim all manner of experiences, but none have been shown to be true. I will stick with the biblical teaching and you can keep your stories.

 

[Iconoclast]

Sorry, you're wrong ! Why don't you tell God your false doctrine !

The Corinthians and the Ephesians of Acts 19, were not apostles or prophets either, yet the scriptural proof is clear ... they spoke in other tongues. Clearly, 1 Cor. 12 also indicated they ( Corinthians ) could also receive other spiritual gifts, besides the tongues they were incorrectly using according to Paul ( God ) in 1 Cor. 14.

1 Cor. 12 and 14 applies to 21st century Christians ! Why would God give ME and other believing Christians, these instructions ... if the gift does not manifest today ... or passed away, like some unbelievers teach. You cannot justify or explain why these instructions don't apply !

I've seen many things done wrong in churches. However, I've seen so many real miracles ... I know God still heals today ( men only pray ). For example, a young 8 (?) year old Russian speaking girl had deteriorating eye sight. ophthalmologists told her she'd likely be blind by her early teens ... she was wearing very thick glasses. Less than 5 minutes after prayer, she said her eyes were tickling and approx. 10 minutes later she said her eyes were watering ... first time ever ( not real sure on this, but watering ). By the time the family left for home, the girl took off her glasses forever ... she's never needed glasses since and her eye sight is somewhat supernatural ... able to read smallest type and see long distances ( other don't seem to be able to do ). To many other examples to tell ... where doctors were stunned by the changes in the persons who were healed by God !

Oh well Iconoclast, you won't change my experiences and knowledge of scriptural proofs.

You go ahead with your stance.

One day, we'll both find out who was correct in their biblical doctrinal understanding and practice !

Your experiences do not trump scripture. You do not have a grasp on the biblical teaching. I have interacted with a few others who claim all manner of experiences, but none have been shown to be true. I will stick with the biblical teaching and you can keep your stories.

 

[hawkman]

Your experiences do not trump scripture.

This is true , I do not look for my experiences to ever trump scripture , and so far (I don't look for this to change) my experiences line up with the way I understand God's word . We should use God's word as the final say on the validity of our experiences . That being said I will share this with you .
I was praying outside at night in my usual spot and you could say I had an experience . I am not going to give specifics but one facet of the experience involved one of God's "calling cards" if you will . It was through my knowledge of the Old Testament as to how I came to this understanding . If I only knew the New Testament I would not have understood . So yes indeed , make sure your experience does line up with God's word !

 

[Elijah777]

This is true , I do not look for my experiences to ever trump scripture , and so far (I don't look for this to change) my experiences line up with the way I understand God's word . We should use God's word as the final say on the validity of our experiences . That being said I will share this with you .
I was praying outside at night in my usual spot and you could say I had an experience . I am not going to give specifics but one facet of the experience involved one of God's "calling cards" if you will . It was through my knowledge of the Old Testament as to how I came to this understanding . If I only knew the New Testament I would not have understood . So yes indeed , make sure your experience does line up with God's word !

Hawkman, you seem to be nice, sincere Christian, who has had the Pentecost experience of speaking in tongues ... is that correct ? If so, Iconoclast says that's basically a lie ... saying nobody speaks in tongues today.

Nobody ... including me ...claims or intimates ... personal testimonies of how God has moved in situations in my life or those of others ... trump scripture ! But the testimonies are either true or a lie. God knows, not Iconoclast or anyone else, unless they were part of the testimony.

However, for example read Acts 26.1-23, plus Acts 27.9-44 and Acts 28.1-10. Basically this is not doctrinal text ... rather it tells the story of Paul's journey(s) with Jesus ... which I am sure he shared to many other people ... after the event happened. Today we call it Paul's testimony. I dare say, people like Iconoclast would not have believe Paul telling his conversion and/or his harrowing journey to Malta.

Did God stop intervening into people's lives in the 21st century ? Do people not have REAL testimonies today ?

 

[Rookie]

My thing is, I have rarely if ever seen true spiritual gifts, I believe they still exist, but don't know of a real representation of them (with one exception).

For example: tongues

It seems like everyone and anyone can speak tongues but there is never an interpreter (which is why I feel that is manipulated because it's the easiest gift to pretend at). I can name about 50 people who can speak tongues that I know, and research in 10 minutes and find 200 more, but not one of them have I ever seen have an interpretor (because I believe you can't quite manipulate that as easily)