The Day of the LORD... The Day of Jesus Christ...

[Sinthesis]

From the Old Testement it is clear that there are many days of The Lord. God always receives His due.

 

[Eugene]

What if people tell us that the Day of the LORD came a long time ago, or that the resurrection is past ?

Many do say just that and it's just not so, and and that’s the purpose of 2 Tim 2:15, 16, 18, Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. Now I realize that just because we all do not agree it’s not an indication some are like Hymenaeus and Philetus subverting the hearers.

2 Tim 2:16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
2 Tim 2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.

I just cannot account for the opinions of others, and I'm told John was taken in spirit to the day of the Lord, told to come up to heaven in Rev 4:1 to see things of the future, and Jesus receiving His own throne in Rev 4:2 is the beginning of that Lord's Day. If I'm wrong He will in time even make that clear to me.

Blessings in Christ Jesus.

 

[reba]

And the future to John started when?

 

[Eugene]

It is not really "His Day" like Mothers day. I always use to think the Day of the Lord was starting Tribulation or something.

Quick thought. The Lord's Day or day of the Lord is a thousand years, there's got to be a starting place, and I believe it's when a throne is set for Him in heaven told us in Rev 4:2. It begins in a peaceful setting and digresses quickly as He takes that all authority and put down nations then ruling in usurpation or rebellion against His rule. The fullness and times of Gentile rule ends and there's a new sheriff is in town so to speak.

 

[Brother Mike]

Quick thought. The Lord's Day or day of the Lord is a thousand years, there's got to be a starting place, and I believe it's when a throne is set for Him in heaven told us in Rev 4:2. It begins in a peaceful setting and digresses quickly as He takes that all authority and put down nations then ruling in usurpation or rebellion against His rule. The fullness and times of Gentile rule ends and there's a new sheriff is in town so to speak

I gave the scriptures above, but If that makes more sense to you, then sounds good to me.

Be blessed.

Mike.

 

[Deborah13]

we shall be under a one world religious system

Are you saying a religion that exists today or something new?

 

[farouk]

we shall be under a one world religious system

Are you saying a religion that exists today or something new?

@Deborah13 ; @n2thelight : I think the question also involves asking, define 'we'...

 

[Watchmen for Christ]

the LORD is coming after the tribulation.. and of course this is absolutely true, within the context of ISRAEL... not the church of God.

And @ Brother Mike, [MENTION=96743]Watchmen for Christ[/MENTION] expounded on my point about the Church being Jew and Gentile (the Messianic body of Christ). So I will not say more about it.

But I have looked through your posts, Eventide, and cannot see where you have given the scriptures that lead you to a belief that the Church will not be around on earth at the Final Coming of the Lord. You believe there will be an early removal of the Church, rapture. This is what I understand you and Mike to be saying.

2 Thess. 2
2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

This scripture alone says that "the day of Christ.. shall not come, except..... first and that man of sin be revealed."

6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

So something withholds the revealing, that must be taken out of the way, correct?
If one believes that the Holy Spirit in the Church is the one withholding the revealing, then there is a problem because we see from verse 3 that the coming of Christ will not happen until after the "revealing" so the Church is still present when the 'revealing' happens.

In order to remove the Church one must use some other scripture, this one doesn't do it.

 

[Eventide]

What if people tell us that the Day of the LORD came a long time ago, or that the resurrection is past ?

Many do say just that and it's just not so, and and that’s the purpose of 2 Tim 2:15, 16, 18, Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. Now I realize that just because we all do not agree it’s not an indication some are like Hymenaeus and Philetus subverting the hearers.

But how do you KNOW ? That's the thing I would emphasize here... is it just study that prevents a person from taking a present truth and turning it into a past event ? Or is it more than that ? Is it false teachers ?

2 Tim 2:16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
2 Tim 2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.

This is a prime example of present truth imo... because if we agree that it's no longer the case, then the holy scriptures are turned from a living and powerful message to nothing more than a history book.

I just cannot account for the opinions of others, and I'm told John was taken in spirit to the day of the Lord, told to come up to heaven in Rev 4:1 to see things of the future, and Jesus receiving His own throne in Rev 4:2 is the beginning of that Lord's Day. If I'm wrong He will in time even make that clear to me.

Blessings in Christ Jesus.

I agree that we cannot account for other opinions.. and isn't it because if we did that we would also downgrade the scriptures to nothing more than some history of the past ? What I wonder is how this can happen to a person who is born again by the incorruptible word of God which LIVES and abides for ever.

You bring up another prime example imo... if the word says that these things shall be hereafter, and others insist that they're a thing of the past, or even the present, then isn't that a severe error ?

This brings me back to John 3:13.. is it true, or was it true and now it's something of the past..?

 

[Watchmen for Christ]

Then if I'm not mistaken n2thelight... you outright deny the literal resurrection of the dead. Your comment in another thread was something like.. "there are no bodies to be resurrected"..

THEN after I asked you questions concerning that... nothing..

How come ?



This is a very dangerous place to be imo... for it's the very foundation of the gospel of God concerning His Son.. and the Apostle to the GENTILES makes it abundantly clear that this is vital knowledge to the body of Christ.

Will address post 44 later,as for now,never did I say I didn't believe in the resurrection.....The point I was making about there will be no body to come back to,was simply that at death this flesh body goes back to the dust from whence it came,never ever to be used again......That's my point!!!!!

When a person dies they go straight to Heaven,Those who do not die before Christ returns will be changed to those same bodies that the people who have died have,at the 7th trump.....Paul can explain it better so I shall let him....

I Corinthians 15:16 "For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:"

I Corinthians 15:17 "And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain, ye are yet in your sins."

I Corinthians 15:35 "But some man will say, "How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?"

We are talking about the physical body and it's change. In other words, what happens to the flesh after death, and the soul after it has departed from the body?

I Corinthians 15:44 "It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body."

There is a natural body, which is your flesh body, and there is also a spiritual or soul body. The two are different and when the natural body, or flesh body dies the spiritual body is "raised", or in the Greek text "egiro, awakened, become active from its death". You have two bodies, one natural body contains your spiritual body, and that spiritual body is awakened to a new life, when the flesh or natural body dies and releases your soul. Your spirit and your soul are together, for the spirit is your "self", "the intellect of your soul" which houses your spirit within you.

It just can't be made any clearer than Paul has made it here. You have two bodies, the flesh and the spiritual bodies. When the flesh body dies, then the spiritual body is awakened and come alive within itself. It starts to live a life without the baggage of the flesh body confining it to the limits of the flesh.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 "Then [at death] shall the dust [flesh body] return to the earth as it was: and the spirit [spiritual body] shall return [instantly] to God [Father] Who gave it."

Ecclesiastes 9:5 "For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten."

This is written by Solomon to the flesh man that walks under the sun, and when the life of the flesh is over, it has no more knowledge or thought than a stick or rock. It is useless, but the soul that is within it is gone and with the Father.

The flesh(dust)shall never be used again.......................

:amen

 

[Eventide]

And the future to John started when?

IMO Reba this doesn't even matter...

Case in point... the OT Prophets wrote quite a bit concerning the Day of the LORD, and the Apostles also teach without a doubt that the DAY of the LORD shall come... not that it has come. And that was thousands of years ago.

The point is that if the living and powerful word of God says that these things are future, does it matter what the future was to them ?

Because imo if we think that the bible is just a history lesson and not living and powerful in its declarations... then it becomes powerless to speak to us in that living way, doesn't it.

If John 3:13 says that no man hath ascended to heaven (written thousands of years ago by the inspiration of the Spirit), is it ok to suggest that this is no longer true today ?

 

[Eventide]

From the Old Testement it is clear that there are many days of The Lord. God always receives His due.

It may be clear to you although it's certainly not clear according to what you post. Are blanket statements without any support useful here ?

Feel free to show us the many 'past tense' days of the LORD which are clear to you.

 

[Eventide]

The Day of the Lord is the Day of Christ.

I agree JLB, and I also believe that this is the LAST DAY, the 7th day, the Day of His rest... which shall be a thousand years.

 

[Eugene]

Case in point... the OT Prophets wrote quite a bit concerning the Day of the LORD, and the Apostles also teach without a doubt that the DAY of the LORD shall come... not that it has come. And that was thousands of years ago.

Please don't allow this to turn into a Preterism debate.

 

[Eventide]

Case in point... the OT Prophets wrote quite a bit concerning the Day of the LORD, and the Apostles also teach without a doubt that the DAY of the LORD shall come... not that it has come. And that was thousands of years ago.

Please don't allow this to turn into a Preterism debate.

Believe you me, that's the last thing I would want... although the points being made here are certainly applicable to that realm of thinking.

With respect to the resurrection of the dead, John 3:13 is an important piece of it imo. If we assume this is past and now no longer true, then we're opening up that can of worms imo.

 

[Eugene]

With respect to the resurrection of the dead, John 3:13 is an important piece of it imo.

Give this a thought brother. What do you suppose finally happened to them that rose when Jesus died? Did they have real bodies but rotted looking something like zombies. Did they stink as them present when Jesus called Lazarus forth thought? After they wandered around a bit did they receive orders “Back where you came from?â€

May I ask just what do you suppose paradise is at this time; Paul did say it was up. 2 Cor 12:4. Do you remember the cloud of witnesses of Heb 12:1. Do you figure 1 Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, and Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds have anything to do concerning some with the Lord when He takes His throne on the Lord's Day? :dunno

Mat 27:51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

Mat 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies (Not all) of the saints which slept arose,

Mat 27:53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

 

[Eventide]

The marriage of the Lamb...

Let's shift gears and think upon a most glorious thought..

The marriage of the Lamb to His wife...

Who could begin to comprehend that ?

If I think in terms of the resurrection of the dead, and that we shall each have our own body... likened unto His glorious body.. just think of the multitudes this encompasses.

How is one resurrected and glorified man (The Bridegroom), going to present a glorious church comprised of literally multitudes of resurrected and glorified bodies (the Bride), to Himself ?

I can't even begin to imagine.. but I do believe it shall be.. hereafter, in that Day, the Day of Jesus Christ..

 

[Eventide]

With respect to the resurrection of the dead, John 3:13 is an important piece of it imo.

Give this a thought brother. What do you suppose finally happened to them that rose when Jesus died? Did they have real bodies but rotted looking something like zombies. Did they stink as them present when Jesus called Lazarus forth thought? After they wandered around a bit did they receive orders “Back where you came from?”

May I ask just what do you suppose paradise is at this time; Paul did say it was up. 2 Cor 12:4. Do you remember the cloud of witnesses of Heb 12:1. Do you figure 1 Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, and Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds have anything to do concerning some with the Lord when He takes His throne on the Lord's Day? :dunno

Mat 27:51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

Mat 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies (Not all) of the saints which slept arose,

Mat 27:53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Most awesome thoughts brother ! I'm going to workout and I'll share some thoughts after that.

 

[Eventide]

Give this a thought brother. What do you suppose finally happened to them that rose when Jesus died? Did they have real bodies but rotted looking something like zombies. Did they stink as them present when Jesus called Lazarus forth thought? After they wandered around a bit did they receive orders “Back where you came from?”

Once again, I can only imagine... but my present thinking is that the accounts of men being resurrected in the gospels are showing signs of the power of God.. Israel required a sign.. and I would believe that men like Lazarus were raised back to their first Adamic state, not their glorified state... if that makes any sense. IOW, Lazarus was raised to show the power and miraculous work of God but not ultimately raised to his 'regenerated' and glorified body, if you will...

I could be way off here.. but again, I don't believe that they would have had glorified bodies before the resurrection of the LORD. Christ the firstfruits, and then those who are His at His coming.

May I ask just what do you suppose paradise is at this time; Paul did say it was up. 2 Cor 12:4. Do you remember the cloud of witnesses of Heb 12:1. Do you figure 1 Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, and Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds have anything to do concerning some with the Lord when He takes His throne on the Lord's Day? :dunno

Mat 27:51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

Mat 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies (Not all) of the saints which slept arose,

Mat 27:53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Once again, I couldn't say one way or the other that these men are glorified now (or not) in their resurrected bodies, but I would think not.

It brings me back to David's Tomb.. is it here to this day or not ?

 

[Eugene]

Once again, I couldn't say one way or the other that these men are glorified now (or not) in their resurrected bodies, but I would think not.

It brings me back to David's Tomb.. is it here to this day or not ?

Do you think David's bones remain in the grave? Going back to a question I asked: where do you think paradise is today and who might be in it even if it's only in spirit? Thanks.