The Simple Key to Interpreting Revelation

[Shilohsfoal]

Once again only hear say without proof as where does Paul say anything about the king of the north in 2Thessalonians 2:1-12. You evade showing the sources you study from as in who teaches you these things. Yes, I know you give Daniel 11, but again taking it out of context with carnal understandings. In all reality you are mixing parts of scriptures to support what you say, but nothing lines up with Rev 11 in who the two witnesses are as being sent by God.

It's like you haven't studied any prophecies.If you had read Daniel 11 and 2 these 2 then you should have remembered something about him.

Daniel 11
36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.



2 these 2
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.



He is the one who gives his power to the two witnesses of Christ so that they should kill amd torment other people.He will cause them to rule over many and they shall rule from Jerusalem.

Daniel 11
39 Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.


During the time of the two witnesses,the saints in Israel are persecuted and killed.

Daniel 11
33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.

34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries.

35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Shilohsfoal seems to refuse to give us the website or the name of the person who teaches the two witnesses are evil and kills those who are Christ own. This is defiantly a preaching from another gospel. Never in my 68 years have I ever heard anyone teach this.

Jesus said they are evil in the gospel.


Mathew 24:48
But if that evil servant says in his heart, ‘My master is not coming for a long time,’
and begins to beat his fellow servants, and eat and drink with drunkards,
the servant’s master will come on an unexpected day and at an unknown hour
and will punish him severely and assign him a place with the hypocrites, where there will be wailing and grinding of teeth.


Jesus said they are his servants.

 

[for_his_glory]

I've already told you.
The only thing I really do is read different translations.I compare about 20 translations and I sometimes use a strong's concordance.

Whatever translations that say the two witnesses of Rev 11 are evil and kills those who are Christ own are teaching a false doctrine of devils. Why can you not give us the Bible translation you use and the scripture for the two witnesses being evil. It shouldn't be that hard to do.

 

[for_his_glory]

It's like you haven't studied any prophecies.If you had read Daniel 11 and 2 these 2 then you should have remembered something about him.

Daniel 11
36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.



2 these 2
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.



He is the one who gives his power to the two witnesses of Christ so that they should kill amd torment other people.He will cause them to rule over many and they shall rule from Jerusalem.

Daniel 11
39 Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.


During the time of the two witnesses,the saints in Israel are persecuted and killed.

Daniel 11
33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.

34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries.

35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.

Once again, where does it say the king of the north is the son of perdition in the end of days described in 2Thessalonians 2:1-12 as it's not found in Daniel 11.

Daniel 11 is Daniels vision that chronicles the coming kings of Persia and Greece and the wars between the Ptolemies of Egypt and the Seleucids of Syria and the persecution led by Antiochus. You need to study the four different Empires to see how each one conquered the one before it

Babylonian Empire:
(Iraq) The lion represents the winged lions that guarded the royal places of Babylon. This Empire ran from 2000BC - 1759BC

Medo – Persian Empire:
(Iran) The ribs of the bear are part of the consuming greed that devours the first empire.

Grecian Empire:
(Greece, Turkey, Syria, Egypt) Four wings of the leopard described the swiftness of this empire that ran from 334-331BC. It wrestled world dominion from Medo-Persia. After the death of Alexander the Great the kingdom was divided into four minor kingdoms that continued as prominent factors in world politics until the Roman Empire gathered it back as one kingdom.

Roman Empire: (little horn, Daniel 8:9-14, 23-27)
Iron represents the stronghold this nation had. Daniel chapter 2 mentions the iron element of this empire that it to will be divided and broken as God will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed.
This Empire ran from 753BC -27BC

 

[for_his_glory]

Jesus said they are evil in the gospel.
You should read the gospel of Jesus Christ sometime.Its very educational.

Mathew 24:48-51

But if that evil servant says in his heart, ‘My master is not coming for a long time,’
and begins to beat his fellow servants, and eat and drink with drunkards,
the servant’s master will come on an unexpected day and at an unknown hour
and will punish him severely and assign him a place with the hypocrites, where there will be wailing and grinding of teeth.


Jesus said they are his servants and they are evil.


oh wait
You said this is the doctrine of devils.You might be the first person I've heard say the gospel of Christ was the doctrine of devils.

Why do you read into scripture something that is clearly not there. Where does it say anything about the two witnesses of Rev 11 in Matthew 24:48-51. It doesn't even use the words two witness, but is talking about good and evil servants. You are not going to convince anyone that God gave power unto His two witnesses and sent them out to kill His own.

Rev 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 11:4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

You really need to go back to Zechariah 4:1-6; 4:11-14 which explains that these two witnesses are the word of God in all power and might and the Holy Spirit which is the oil that is poured out on those who God anoints with His Holy Spirit.

 

[for_his_glory]

oh wait
You said this is the doctrine of devils.You might be the first person I've heard say the gospel of Christ was the doctrine of devils.

No, I said what you are trying to teach being the doctrines of devils as who it is that is teaching you this stuff that goes against the word of God, but you go right ahead believing something that is not written in Rev 11 no matter how hard you try to make scripture line up with what you say.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Antichrist yes. Last great one before the Lord's return? Perhaps.

I wouldn't doubt every heresy ever preached in the name of Christ, will be included in the last great false gospel ever preached on earth.

Lots of harlots have contributed to it.

We differ on our eschatological views, so you know. I think there were antichrists mentioned by John in his letter and the Beast in Revelation is a totally different matter.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Being born again agrees with being made alive, as opposed to still being dead. Too much scripture to post.

I understand our mortal bodies being transformed hasn't happened yet.

Only people who don't like the way God is ruling (and has always ruled) feel that way. Some people think things are so bad God doesn't even exist.

I agree with all of the above. Well put.

When our King returns he says,

those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. Lk.19:27

This is nicely matched to God’s judgement on Israel in 70AD. He “came” in judgement as he said he would and killed those who killed Jesus. None of those guys are left now.

Also when the bodily resurrection occurs, the last enemy death is deatroyed, so it's very important to recognize just Who is in charge now.

Amen!!

The likeness of Jesus is also seen now in people who follow him. If Christ isn't seen in us now, we can forget about looking like him later.

Well, to many who preached in his name he'll deny knowing them, so be careful.

Amen!

You seem to think Jesus isn't ruling his creation because he's merciful, or that we as Ambassadors for the King over all aren't ruling because he instructed us to rule in love over our enemies. I think people who believe in Jesus better understand the Jesus spoken of in the Bible.

amen!

He defeated the whore who thought she killed him.

Amen!!!

He defeated this beast who thought he killed him.

Actually, the Bible shows many places where God himself is a consuming fire,

the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: 2Thes.2:8

Here, the beast is destroyed by Jesus' presence.

He said the harvest is ready now.

Amen!!

 

[eddif]

You believe how you want in your understanding and I will believe how I understand the scriptures.

BTW, still waiting for the website or sites you use as I really want to read them.

I will insert this and run for cover.

for_his_glory you look in the new covenant for the new heart and living water.

Others see the scripture engraved on stony hearts. There are scriptures engraved on stone.

The old Jerusalem stone foundation had to be split (earthquake). To take out heart of stone. The rubble ground up stone (dirt) that fills the valley will grow crops. Just like the new heart of flesh gives life. We leave the old Jerusalem on the life giving sacrifice Jesus provided. The new Jerusalem comes down from heaven.

Symbolism is everywhere, but the reality is you must be born again. Jewels are found near fault lines. Repentance brings about a need for Jesus.

Did I say anything?

Mississippi redneck
eddif

 

[for_his_glory]

Revelation was given to John in visions as prophecies that had their beginnings in the Old Testament, being fulfilled in the New Testament and yet much to be fulfilled in future events before the great and terrible day of the Lords return.

Revelations is given to all nations and tongues that live throughout the whole world as in Jew and Gentile. Israel is mainly mentioned, but not all of Israel is Gods chosen people. Those who are washed in the blood of the Lamb are joined as a branch with Israel as God is the root of that branch and those who are sealed by His Holy Spirit are His own who find favor in Him, Romans 11:11-31. Therefore, our attention needs to be on those things that are happening in Israel especially Jerusalem as being Gods Holy City.

Within Gods final chastisement on man He continues to call them to repentance and one has to take into consideration during the time of the seven trumpets sounding what God pours out that destroys man will be a third part of every nation simultaneously being destroyed unless they repent and turn back to God. This also includes those who call themselves a Christian, but by name only as they have not Gods Holy Spirit dwelling in them and will also be destroyed, Matthew 7:21.

Revelations is full of symbolism that is literal where it needs to be and Spiritual where it needs to define that of the literal. These revelations are given as a warning to those who have yet to accept Jesus as Messiah. Gods chastisements are to draw those back to him in repentance before that door of salvation is closed forever when Jesus returns and Gods true Church is gathered up to be with the Father forever.

The focus in Revelations would seem to center around Israel only and the nations that come against her for this is how John would recognize it to be since all other nations were not yet developed in his time. Revelations is about all of us, Jew and Gentile, past, present and future that by faith keep Gods commandments. We are Gods witnesses that testify of His mercy and grace as we take His word out into the world to those who have ears to hear.

 

[Highway54]

Going to enlighten us? Or you don't know either?

I think I do sir, they have been given the assignment to feed Jesus' sheep. I believe they are the governing body of Jehovah's people, do you believe they fit the assigned role RB? Mat 24:45-47

 

[journeyman]

This is nicely matched to God’s judgement on Israel in 70AD. He “came” in judgement as he said he would and killed those who killed Jesus. None of those guys are left now.

Gods' judgement on sinners is seen throughout the Bible. Paul said they were examples of people who heard Gods' word but continued to live ungodly.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Gods' judgement on sinners is seen throughout the Bible.

Jesus said there was to be unique judgement on those who murdered the son of God. He has special judgements for sin now and again.

Paul said they were examples of people who heard Gods' word but continued to live ungodly.

Yes, that’s true. But the coming in judgement to slay those who slayed the son of God before that generation died out was unique.

 

[journeyman]

Jesus said there was to be unique judgement on those who murdered the son of God. He has special judgements for sin now and again.

Yes, that’s true. But the coming in judgement to slay those who slayed the son of God before that generation died out was unique.

The parable shiows the time of judgement as that of also rewarding his servants. That seems to be when all the dead are raised.
I don't doubt the 1st century destruction of the temple is fulfillment of prophecy. but that and all the other warnings throughout scripture that weren't heeded show the unrepentant dying in sin. So being cast into the lof is the flip side, or how we should now think of what we see every day through a mirror darkly.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

The parable shiows the time of judgement as that of also rewarding his servants. That seems to be when all the dead are raised.

Except the parable specifies those who murdered the son. That was in 70AD. Jesus said the blood of all the prophets would be required of THAT generation and no other. That’s a different judgement.

I don't doubt the 1st century destruction of the temple is fulfillment of prophecy. but that and all the other warnings throughout scripture that weren't heeded show the unrepentant dying in sin.

Yes but that is not connected to that parable. There are clear no parable statements regarding the Judgement of all are there?

So being cast into the lof is the flip side, or how we should now think of what we see every day through a mirror darkly.

Not sure I follow.

 

[journeyman]

Except the parable specifies those who murdered the son. That was in 70AD.

I'm sorry Dorothy Mae.
I thiught you were talking about the man who went into a far country and left servants in charge.

Jesus said the blood of all the prophets would be required of THAT generation and no other. That’s a different judgement.

Yes but that is not connected to that parable. There are clear no parable statements regarding the Judgement of all are there?

Maybe not, but since another area of scripture says,

in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth. Rev.18:24

So it's past, present and future.

Not sure I follow.

I simply mean mankind sees history repeating itself over and over and wonders why things are the way they are. But since the Messiah came, we understand how angels fell, tempting humans to fall and Who the cure is,

And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. Isa.25:7

The mountain is Jesus.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

I'm sorry Dorothy Mae.
I thiught you were talking about the man who went into a far country and left servants in charge.

I was. He first sent servants which they killed. Then he sent his son whim they killed. So He came and killed them.

Maybe not, but since another area of scripture says,

in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth. Rev.18:24

That’s that generation. How can it possibly be a current one?

So it's past, present and future.

No, Jesus it wouldn’t happen again. That’s one time.

I simply mean mankind sees history repeating itself over and over and wonders why things are the way they are.

History is linear and doesn’t repeat itself. That’s the biblical view. Jesus doesn’t come again and again to be crucified, for example. Nations aren’t being discovered. I can go on and on.

Men make similar foolish choices as in previous generations and the same outcome occurs. That’s why it looks similar.

But since the Messiah came, we understand how angels fell, tempting humans to fall and Who the cure is,

True.

And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations. Isa.25:7

The mountain is Jesus.

Yes, I agree. He has done so and is continuing to do so.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

The parable shiows the time of judgement as that of also rewarding his servants.

Are you referring to the talents parable?

That seems to be when all the dead are raised.
I don't doubt the 1st century destruction of the temple is fulfillment of prophecy. but that and all the other warnings throughout scripture that weren't heeded show the unrepentant dying in sin. So being cast into the lof is the flip side, or how we should now think of what we see every day through a mirror darkly.

 

[Anaphora]

The seals align with Luke chapter 21, the 7 signs Jesus gave end times. Revelation chapter 20 doesn't align with Ezekiel chapter 38. Thier different subjects. Revelation chapter 20, satan gathers those who reject Jesus and defy jesus. They go with satan into lake of fire. Ezekiel chapter 38, were in the flesh, when Russia and Islamic brotherhood invaded America through Alaska and God destroys them at Canadian mountains. GOG means two different things in both Ezekiel and revelation. At the 7th trump Jesus destroy Russia and allies attack America. In the millennium, at the end, satan gathers those who reject Jesus and mount attack against Jerusalem. They go into lake of fire.

 

[journeyman]

History is linear and doesn’t repeat itself. That’s the biblical view. Jesus doesn’t come again and again to be crucified, for example. Nations aren’t being discovered. I can go on and on.

Men make similar foolish choices as in previous generations and the same outcome occurs. That’s why it looks similar.

I know Jesus doesn't come again to be sinned against over and over. He will come and destroy the unrepentant for sinning against him.
Our Lord said that generation would be held responsible for the deaths of prophets they never met. Prophets that were killed before they were born on earth.