There is an alternative to trinitarianism/ non-trinitarianism.

[Mustard Seed]

I believe “I am what I am” refers to the immutability of God. The same as He was, He still is, and always will be.

Well, lets just name it. You believe that the Son is a favored Angel?

 

[LeviR]

Well, lets just name it. You believe that the Son is a favored Angel?

Jesus is the one man who is exalted above all his fellow man.

 

[Mustard Seed]

Jesus is the one man who is exalted above all his fellow man.

Do you see Him as composed of the same substance that Moses saw? As in, the "Angel of the Lord", that Moses saw?

 

[LeviR]

Do you see Him as composed of the same substance that Moses saw? As in, the "Angel of the Lord", that Moses saw?

It’s referred to as the divine nature. It is a nature that is immortal and never dies.
The first nature Jesus partook was the mortal nature. When raised from the dead he now has the divine nature.

 

[Mustard Seed]

It’s referred to as the divine nature. It is a nature that is immortal and never dies.
The first nature Jesus partook was the mortal nature. When raised from the dead he now has the divine nature.

Do you believe that Christ was demonstrating what we can accomplish, if we submit to God as fully as He did?

 

[LeviR]

Do you believe that Christ was demonstrating what we can accomplish, if we submit to God as fully as He did?

Christ needed to be saved himself from death. As he was a son of Adam. He resisted all temptation to sin. The Lamb without fault. And therefore God accepted his sacrifice as the means whereby we may partake of the same nature he now does.

 

[Mustard Seed]

@Da

Could you elaborate on the difference between the Son and Jesus?

I had referenced a post earlier... this text is a link to it. I would love to hear your opinion on it. <-

 

[Mustard Seed]

Christ needed to be saved himself from death. He resisted all temptation to sin. The Lamb without fault. And therefore God accepted his sacrifice as the means whereby we may partake of the same nature he now does.

Hmmmmm.... are you Sabbatarian?

 

[LeviR]

Hmmmmm.... are you Sabbatarian?

No.

 

[Mustard Seed]

No.

Do you believe that we are under the New Covenant?

 

[LeviR]

Do you believe that we are under the New Covenant?

Yes.

 

[Hopeful 2]

I've become lost on the way to the bakery!
Sorry Hopeful.

(Follow the aroma !) LOL

Doesn't FORESEE mean that you know something that is definitely going to happen?

It can also mean "envision", which requires no definity. (?)
With Abraham, he could "envision" what was to eventually happen, without proof. (John 8:56)
That is why it is accounted to faithfulness.

I know it means this but I've lost the gist of our discussion.
Sorry....

No prob'.
Threads have a way of getting "frayed" over the span of several days.

 

[Hopeful 2]

Could you elaborate on the difference between the Word and Jesus?

The Word, which was with God and was God (John 1:1), existed only before the Word took on flesh and was birthed of a woman.
The Word became Jesus at conception.

 

[LeviR]

The Word, which was with God and was God (John 1:1), existed only before the Word took on flesh and was birthed of a woman.
The Word became Jesus at conception.

You might say the man Jesus became identified as Mighty God, Everlasting Father….

 

[LeviR]

The Word, which was with God and was God (John 1:1), existed only before the Word took on flesh and was birthed of a woman.
The Word became Jesus at conception.

What better way to identify the man Jesus with the Father than to say all things were created by him.

 

[Hopeful 2]

You might say the man Jesus became identified as Mighty God, Everlasting Father….

Yes, indeed.
Though quite a few scriptures hint at Jesus being God, your Isaiah 9:6 citing is (I think) the only one that I can't refute.
Though Isa 9:6 may be referring to Jesus, it may be dong so either pre or post Jesus.
God and the Word were once one, and will be again one day.
1 Cor 15:28 makes mention of that time..."And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all."
It is then that Jesus will again be God.

 

[Hopeful 2]

What better way to identify the man Jesus with the Father than to say all things were created by him.

God created all things BY the Word...pre-Jesus.
Their names are often used interchangeably.

1. Ephesians 3:9
   And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
2. Colossians 1:16
   For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

 

[LeviR]

Yes, indeed.
Though quite a few scriptures hint at Jesus being God, your Isaiah 9:6 citing is (I think) the only one that I can't refute.
Though Isa 9:6 may be referring to Jesus, it may be dong so either pre or post Jesus.
God and the Word were once one, and will be again one day.
1 Cor 15:28 makes mention of that time..."And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all."
It is then that Jesus will again be God.

Someone might say, “How can it be said of a man that he created all things if he actually didn’t ?”
In this way:
The Father created all things by His Spirit. So, in order to say Jesus created all things the Father did, Jesus must be given fully and without limit to time of Father’s Spirit. So that it might be said, “in him dwells all the fullness of Deity.”
Pretty simple actually.

 

[Hopeful 2]

Someone might say, “How can it be said of a man that he created all things if he actually didn’t ?”
In this way:

But Jesus did, in His prior identity.

The Father created all things by His Spirit.

Scripture, please.

So, in order to say Jesus created all things the Father did, Jesus must be given fully and without limit to time of Father’s Spirit. So that it might be said, “in him dwells all the fullness of Deity.
Pretty simple actually.

I agree, and Jesus did have unlimited access to God, who is the Spirit.
In fact, they were all one !

 

[LeviR]

God created all things BY the Word...pre-Jesus.
Their names are often used interchangeably.

1. Ephesians 3:9
   And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
2. Colossians 1:16
   For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

The Word which is the breath of His mouth. Not actually wind or air but His Spirit.