Three person God identified in the Bible?

[Randy]

I never said anything about Hebrews contradicting himself.

Jesus, the Son stretched out the heavens and laid the foundation of the earth.

But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And:
“You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Hebrews 1:8-10

• You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth, and the heavens are the work of Your hands. Hebrews 1:10

The burden of the word of the LORD against Israel. Thus says the LORD, who stretches out the heavens, lays the foundation of the earth, and forms the spirit of man within him: Zechariah 12:1

• Thus says the LORD, who stretches out the heavens, lays the foundation of the earth, and forms the spirit of man within him: Zechariah 12:1

The prophet Zechariah was speaking by the Spirit of Christ; the Spirit of the LORD God; YHWH






JLB

You believe only Jesus created by Himself? I have given testimony that states otherwise.
Jesus speaks of the Spirit as another. How else did you reason the distinct person of God the Spirit?
Jesus has spoken to me Via the Spirit because the Spirit of God conveys what He hears. But it is the Spirit of the one and only true God. The Father.




Have you read the Fathers promise? Who did Jesus receive that Spirit from?
In the last days I will pour out "My Spirit"

This reads like the Lord to me. (The Firstborn)-before all things
Proverbs 8
The Lord created me at the beginning of his work,[c]
the first of his acts of old.
23 Ages ago I was set up,
at the first, before the beginning of the earth.
24 When there were no depths I was brought forth,
when there were no springs abounding with water.
25 Before the mountains had been shaped,
before the hills, I was brought forth;
26 before he had made the earth with its fields,[d]
or the first of the dust[e] of the world.
27 When he established the heavens, I was there,
when he drew a circle on the face of the deep,
28 when he made firm the skies above,
when he established[f] the fountains of the deep,
29 when he assigned to the sea its limit,
so that the waters might not transgress his command,
when he marked out the foundations of the earth,
30 then I was beside him, like a master workman
rejoicing before him always,
31 rejoicing in his inhabited world
and delighting in the sons of men.
32 And now, my sons, listen to me:
happy are those who keep my ways.
33 Hear instruction and be wise,
and do not neglect it.
34 Happy is the man who listens to me,
watching daily at my gates,
waiting beside my doors.
35 For he who finds me finds life
and obtains favor from the Lord;
36 but he who misses me injures himself;
all who hate me love death.”

 

[Cooper]

There is simply no way a person can come to such a erroneous conclusion after all that I’ve repeatedly stated.

Not, means Not.

 

[Randy]

Which of these following statements do you disagree with?


Jesus is I AM.

The Angel of the LORD is God.

Moses was looking at the Angel of the Lord.

Moses was looking at God.


Moreover He said, “I am the God of your father—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” And Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God. Exodus 3:6


The Angel of the LORD is I AM.


And God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM.” And He said, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel, I AM has sent me to you.’ ”
Exodus 3:14


Jesus is I AM.


Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.” Then they took up stones to throw at Him;… John 8:58-59


Jesus is the Son; God the Son.

Jesus is LORD; YHWH the LORD God.

Jesus is I AM.





JLB

The Father is I am that which I am for the God and Father of Jesus is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob
The Angel is unidentified in name. I don't believe the Angel was either the Father or Jesus. I believe God the Father was there by His Spirit.
Jesus was alive before Abraham was born. Correct context.

 

[Free]

Not, means Not.

Of course not means not, but context is everything. You’ve ignored the context so your conclusion is false. It’s like you haven’t even understood a word I have said this entire discussion.

 

[Cooper]

Of course not means not, but context is everything. You’ve ignored the context so your conclusion is false. It’s like you haven’t even understood a word I have said this entire discussion.

If Jesus is not the Father, and the Father is not the Holy Spirit, and the Holy Spirit is not Jesus, then who or what is God?
.

 

[JLB]

You believe only Jesus created by Himself?

No sir.

I believe Jesus created all things according to the will of His Father.

He creates by speaking the Word; the will of the Father.

Jesus expresses the will of the Father.

His word is manifested, that is to say, comes into being by the power of the Spirit.

 

[Free]

If Jesus is not the Father, and the Father is not the Holy Spirit, and the Holy Spirit is not Jesus, then who or what is God?
.

Go back to my post #1,386 or just look at the diagram more closely.

 

[Cooper]

Go back to my post #1,386 or just look at the diagram more closely.

It is wrong. End of. The Father IS God. The Son IS God, the Holy Spirit IS God.
One God.
.

 

[Free]

It is wrong. End of. God IS Father. God IS Son. God IS Holy Spirit.

Which shows that you haven’t understood the diagram nor what I have said. You’re taking things out of context.

God IS One.
.

And, as I have pointed out repeatedly and every anti-trinitarian has failed to address, there is not a single verse in the entire Bible that clearly or directly states that God is a single person, an absolute unity. The Bible gives no reason whatsoever to believe the Oneness view of God.

 

[Cooper]

Which shows that you haven’t understood the diagram nor what I have said. You’re taking things out of context.


And, as I have pointed out repeatedly and every anti-trinitarian has failed to address, there is not a single verse in the entire Bible that clearly or directly states that God is a single person, an absolute unity. The Bible gives no reason whatsoever to believe the Oneness view of God.

You are wrong. The Bible says God is One.
.

 

[Randy]

No sir.

I believe Jesus created all things according to the will of His Father.

He creates by speaking the Word; the will of the Father.

Jesus expresses the will of the Father.

His word is manifested, that is to say, comes into being by the power of the Spirit.

God spoke to us these last days "by" His Son.
God created "by" His Son.

The Father by whom all things came.
The Son through whom all things came.

 

[Free]

You are wrong. The Bible says God is One.
.

Statements like “you are wrong” are not helpful and do nothing to further or enhance the discussion. If I’m wrong then show me, as I have been doing, but you have to do so without continuing to confuse monotheism with the nature of God.

 

[Randy]

Could you go over Acts 2 please?
I don't know what you mean by THE SPIRIT IS GIVEN BY JESUS.


Is God's spirit the same as The Holy Spirit?
I don't think so...not sure.

I think that at the time of the filoque offense, the east was still under the authority of the Pope.
You could confirm that.

I believe that was the last straw and the schism became official.

In addition to what I already stated it is my belief Peter states the source of the "gift of God" as from the Father. But it is clear Paul's theology holds in this matter. The Father from whom all things came. The Son through whom all things came.
Of Importance to all Christ -"through whom we live"

Peter defends/ explains his actions from Jewish, (circumcised), believers Ref Cornelius's salvation by Gods decree.​

the circumcised believers criticized him, “You went into the house of uncircumcised men and ate with them.”

Acts 11:17​

17 If then God gave the same gift to them as he gave to us when we believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could stand in God’s way?”

 

[Cooper]

Statements like “you are wrong” are not helpful and do nothing to further or enhance the discussion. If I’m wrong then show me, as I have been doing, but you have to do so without continuing to confuse monotheism with the nature of God.

This is from notes I made years ago. See if you can combine the one God into your belief system.

1. God is everywhere (omnipresent): Mk 5:10; Jude 6; Rev 20:1-3; 1 Ki 8:27; 2 Chron 2:6; 6:18; Isa 66:1; Acts 7:49; 17:27-28; Ps 139:7-13

2. God is all knowing (omniscient): Ps 139:1-6; Job 42:2; Acts 2:23; 1 Tim 1:17

3. God is all powerful (omnipotent): Gen 17:1; 35:11; Rom 13:1; 1 Tim 6:15; Rev 19:6

4. God is a Spirit, without flesh and bones: Luke 24:39; John 4:24; Matthew 16:17

5. God is invisible: Ex 33:20; John 1:18; 1 John 4:12; 1 Tim 6:16; Col 1:15; 1 Tim 1:17; Heb 11:27

6. God is immutable (unchangeable) in his nature: Mal 3:6; But God can change his mind: Jonah 3:10; Gen 6:6

7. God is love: 1 Jn 4:8,16

8. God is Light (truth): 1 Jn 1:5; John 17:17

9. God is holy: 1 Pet 1:16

10. God is merciful: Ps 103:8

11. God is gentle: Ps 18:35

12. God is righteous: Ps 129:4

13. God is good: Rom 2:4

14. God is perfect: Matthew 5:48

15. God is just: Isaiah 45:21

16. God is faithful: 1 Corinthians 10:13

17. God is graciousness: Psalm 103:8
.

 

[Free]

This is from notes I made years ago. See if you can combine the one God into your belief system.

1. God is everywhere (omnipresent): Mk 5:10; Jude 6; Rev 20:1-3; 1 Ki 8:27; 2 Chron 2:6; 6:18; Isa 66:1; Acts 7:49; 17:27-28; Ps 139:7-13

2. God is all knowing (omniscient): Ps 139:1-6; Job 42:2; Acts 2:23; 1 Tim 1:17

3. God is all powerful (omnipotent): Gen 17:1; 35:11; Rom 13:1; 1 Tim 6:15; Rev 19:6

4. God is a Spirit, without flesh and bones: Luke 24:39; John 4:24; Matthew 16:17

5. God is invisible: Ex 33:20; John 1:18; 1 John 4:12; 1 Tim 6:16; Col 1:15; 1 Tim 1:17; Heb 11:27

6. God is immutable (unchangeable) in his nature: Mal 3:6; But God can change his mind: Jonah 3:10; Gen 6:6

7. God is love: 1 Jn 4:8,16

8. God is Light (truth): 1 Jn 1:5; John 17:17

9. God is holy: 1 Pet 1:16

10. God is merciful: Ps 103:8

11. God is gentle: Ps 18:35

12. God is righteous: Ps 129:4

13. God is good: Rom 2:4

14. God is perfect: Matthew 5:48

15. God is just: Isaiah 45:21

16. God is faithful: 1 Corinthians 10:13

17. God is graciousness: Psalm 103:8
.

The fact you're even asking this shows that you do not understand the nature of the problem, what I have said, or what I am asking. Not a single verse you just posted has anything at all to do with this discussion. This not a discussion about the attributes of God, but of how he exists in and of himself, as the self-existing, necessary being. That is, whether or not, prior to all creation, there were three people in the Godhead or there was just one.

Having said that, the one attribute listed in your verses--"God is love"--cannot apply to the God of Oneness theology. It outright contradicts it. But it does support the Trinity, as I have shown several times in this thread.

 

[Cooper]

The fact you're even asking this shows that you do not understand the nature of the problem, what I have said, or what I am asking. Not a single verse you just posted has anything at all to do with this discussion. This not a discussion about the attributes of God, but of how he exists in and of himself, as the self-existing, necessary being. That is, whether or not, prior to all creation, there were three people in the Godhead or there was just one.

Having said that, the one attribute listed in your verses--"God is love"--cannot apply to the God of Oneness theology. It outright contradicts it. But it does support the Trinity, as I have shown several times in this thread.

Father means the creator or originator. Galileo is the "father of science." Hippocrates is the father of medicine.

As Jesus created the Heaven and Earth he is the Father of all things visible and invisible. Father and Son are 1 God.

Here is the creator, the One God.

John 1:1-3
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.

Colossians 1:16-17
For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist.

Hebrews 1:1-2
God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds;

Genesis 1:26-27
Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth." So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.

Genesis 1:1
In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

Isaiah 44:24
Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer,
And He who formed you from the womb:
“ I am the LORD, who makes all things,
Who stretches out the heavens all alone,
Who spreads abroad the earth by Myself;


Psalm 104:29-30
You hide Your face, they are troubled;
You take away their breath, they die and return to their dust.
You send forth Your Spirit, they are created;
And You renew the face of the earth.

1 Corinthians 8:6
yet for us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and through whom we live.

Ephesians 3:9
and to make all see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the ages has been hidden in God who created all things through Jesus Christ;
.

 

[Free]

Father means the creator or originator. Galileo is the "father of science." Hippocrates is the father of medicine.

It also means he is a Father that has a child, in this case, the Son. He always been the Father because the Son has always existed.

As Jesus created the Heaven and Earth he is the Father of all things visible and invisible. Father and Son are 1 God.

The Son was involved in creation, and so was the Holy Spirit, but the Father is the originator. There is very much a reason why Gen 1 says that God created by speaking and why John 1:1 says that the divine logos was in the beginning "with God." As Vern S. Poythress says:

"Logos in the Greek has a range of meaning, including reason, law, word, speaking, declaration. The meaning "reason" explains why the study of reasoning came to be called logic. The meanings related to communication and discourse are mot pertinent to understanding the word logos in John 1:1. In John 1:1 the phrase "In the beginning" alludes to Genesis 1:1. And John 1:3 explicitly says that "all things were made through him," alluding to God's work of creation in Genesis 1.
. . .
John 1:1-3, by reflecting back on Genesis 1, indicates that the particular speeches of God in Genesis 1 have an organic relation to a deeper reality in God himself. The particular speeches derive from the One who is uniquely the Word, who is the eternal speech of God. God has an eternal speaking, namely, the Word who was with God and who was God. Then he has also a particular speaking in acts of creation in Genesis 1. This particular speaking harmonizes with and expresses his eternal speaking."

To that I will add what I have stated several times already--that John 1:1 speaks of plurality within the one God, just as Gen 1:26-27 do so as well. John was not only very specific in his grammar, as I have pointed out, he was intentional in bringing Genesis 1 to bear on his description of who the Word is.

When people speak of Father and Son they are speaking of the 1 God.

.

Together, along with the Holy Spirit, they are the one God, but they are not one person.

 

[Cooper]

It also means he is a Father that has a child, in this case, the Son. He always been the Father because the Son has always existed.


The Son was involved in creation, and so was the Holy Spirit, but the Father is the originator. There is very much a reason why Gen 1 says that God created by speaking and why John 1:1 says that the divine logos was in the beginning "with God." As Vern S. Poythress says:

"Logos in the Greek has a range of meaning, including reason, law, word, speaking, declaration. The meaning "reason" explains why the study of reasoning came to be called logic. The meanings related to communication and discourse are mot pertinent to understanding the word logos in John 1:1. In John 1:1 the phrase "In the beginning" alludes to Genesis 1:1. And John 1:3 explicitly says that "all things were made through him," alluding to God's work of creation in Genesis 1.
. . .
John 1:1-3, by reflecting back on Genesis 1, indicates that the particular speeches of God in Genesis 1 have an organic relation to a deeper reality in God himself. The particular speeches derive from the One who is uniquely the Word, who is the eternal speech of God. God has an eternal speaking, namely, the Word who was with God and who was God. Then he has also a particular speaking in acts of creation in Genesis 1. This particular speaking harmonizes with and expresses his eternal speaking."

To that I will add what I have stated several times already--that John 1:1 speaks of plurality within the one God, just as Gen 1:26-27 do so as well. John was not only very specific in his grammar, as I have pointed out, he was intentional in bringing Genesis 1 to bear on his description of who the Word is.


Together, along with the Holy Spirit, they are the one God, but they are not one person.

Jesus was the Word. He was there in the beginning, and consequently, like Hippocrates, Jesus was Father of heaven and earth. Both are ONE

Spin as you like but be careful.

Where do you want to go from here. Ask me a question.
.

 

[Free]

Jesus was the Word. He was there in the beginning,

Yes, Jesus was the pre-incarnate Word, the eternally existing Son of God.

and consequently, like Hippocrates, Jesus was Father of heaven and earth. Both are ONE

No, the Word never was the Father. Again, as I have repeatedly stated and shown with scripture, the Word cannot be the Father. It is a logical impossibility, which makes it impossible that "both are one."

Spin as you like but be careful.

I have spun nothing.

Where do you want to go from here. Ask me a question.

Are you going to address all the difficulties I've presented for your position? You've left all of them unaddressed so far, and until you do, there is simply nowhere we can go, as is evident by this continual going in circles.

 

[Cooper]

Yes, Jesus was the pre-incarnate Word, the eternally existing Son of God.


No, the Word never was the Father. Again, as I have repeatedly stated and shown with scripture, the Word cannot be the Father. It is a logical impossibility, which makes it impossible that "both are one."


I have spun nothing.


Are you going to address all the difficulties I've presented for your position? You've left all of them unaddressed so far, and until you do, there is simply nowhere we can go, as is evident by this continual going in circles.

What difficulties are those?
.