Dougcho
Member
The Word was completely God before He became flesh-human-Jesus.
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
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Understanding the Incarnation
- Thread starter Dougcho
- Start date
Dougcho
Member
No, sorry, but Jesus was never God the Son
UNTIL He was miraculously born of the Holy Spirit
and UNTIL the Word became flesh-human-Jesus (John 1:14).
They both were instrumental in the "creation" of Jesus, the Son of God.
Note: He was the Son of God because God the Holy Spirit
played the role of His "father".
You never responded to THIS post.
Dougcho
Member
Sorry, what was the post #?
There is always an overlapping in the Godhead that we can never completely separate. In John 14:16-17 Jesus calls Himself the Spirit of truth and said that He dwells with you (Flesh) and will be in you (Holy Spirit). Here we see the overlapping of the Holy Spirit and Jesus as One. In the Old Testament, Jesus was here as the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of truth. And yet still distinct from the Holy Spirit. Does that loosen or change anything with the question at hand? In other words, could the Holy Spirit ascend and descend before the incarnation? I think so. Would that qualifying as Jesus ascending and descending in the OT?
The OT Jews argued all the time about how impossible it was going to be for the Messiah to fulfill all the conditions needed to fill be be the true Messiah. Maybe they never considered the virgin birth for starters. Sometimes we just don't get to see all the answers yet.
Jesus being born of a virgin, did not inherit a sinful nature. He was both fully God and fully man. His being fully man was not a subtraction to His being fully God, but an addition.
"My food is to do the will of Him who sent Me, and to finish His work" (John 4:34).
"I will be with you a little longer, and then I am going to him who sent me" (John 10:33).
Dave
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Just click the link, it will bring you there.
Dougcho
Member
Yes, ad I apologize for any misunderstanding!
Dougcho
Member
Haven't I explained why I believe Jesus inherited Mary's DNA,
which contained man's inherited sin nature?
(Both parents contribute to a baby's DNA.)
Hi Doug
I meant to post this earlier, but I had a power outage. It gave me more time to think this through. My head is in the clouds because I've been sick for a week and quit coffee since I couldn't stomach it while I was sick anyways. It's an adjustment for sure.
Anyways
I know the evidence of the sinful nature can be seen in the DNA, but how did you come to the conclusion that this is also the conduit by which the sinful nature is passed on?
It seems like a reasonable assumption, but then we can also ask, since mans DNA is different than a woman's, is it possible that God only meant for our sinful nature to be passed on through man only? Then we must ask, if it is passed on through the physical, the spiritual corruption, which is and was complete from the beginning, must also be the result of the physical. That seems backwards.
From the evidence in scripture. I know the sinful nature is passed on through Adam, but is this a once for all, leaving the door open for your interpretation? Also, I see evidence in scripture, that the physical part of our corruption has grown throughout history. Evidenced by how long people lived in the past. And one could argue circumstantially that part of the reason the Law of Moses came to be was to curb the effects of the physical corruption. That is, not marrying close relatives.
And Jewish tradition seems to hold to the idea that it is mans seed is the conduit. It's just tradition, but if true, that does establish the fact that people in the Jewish community seen the sin nature as uniquely passed down through man. Though, even if correct, that could just be a physical picture of a spiritual truth from and OT mind set.
You don't need to answer all this, I was just thinking out loud and wanted to write it down before I lost it. The first question is important though. Thanks.
Dave
I hope you get well quick.
I quit drinking (decaf) coffee a few week ago, and immediately saw how much whiter my teeth seemed.
Silver lining ?
How is a nature seen in DNA ?
Hi Hope.
Thanks, I think I'm over it now.
The coffee was making me irritable. I didn't like that. I feel so much better, but I am missing the caffeine energy.
Do you mean how does nature work within DNA?
I still believe that Adam's headship, who the sin nature was passed down through to all man, was a model that didn't end with Adam. Is their a physical element to it? If so can that physical element somehow pass over women for legal (responsibility of headship), or even physically? Adam's headship, and the sin nature being passed through him, I believe, would have had to be a one time shot and end with Adam for Mary to have passed on her sinful nature to Jesus. The idea of the headship continues all throughout scripture.
Dave