Can sinning be overcome?

[Highway54]

Don’t we all!! But God doesn’t and he doesn’t consider one who committed a sin immediately dead.

1 Cor 6:9,10 May I ask what "will not inherit the Kingdom of God" means to you maam?

 

[Dorothy Mae]

1 Cor 6:9,10 May I ask what "will not inherit the Kingdom of God" means to you maam?

Sir, the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God. Doesn’t mean He hates them. Did you think God has to hate sinners to send them to hell otherwise He wouldn’t? Notice human judges. They don’t hate perpetrators.

 

[Hopeful]

Sir, the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God. Doesn’t mean He hates them. Did you think God has to hate sinners to send them to hell otherwise He wouldn’t? Notice human judges. They don’t hate perpetrators.

It is written..."The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity." (Psa 5:5)

 

[Highway54]

Sir, the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God. Doesn’t mean He hates them. Did you think God has to hate sinners to send them to hell otherwise He wouldn’t? Notice human judges. They don’t hate perpetrators.

God doesn't send people to hell maam, that happens as a result of Adam's sin. The good news is hell will be emptied because all will be resurrected from it, and then no longer being needed it will be cast into the lake of fire, and death will be no more, neither mourning nor outcry nor pain be any more as the former things will have passed away. This is the good news the Bible presents Rev 20:13,14; 21:3,4. We pray for this Dorothy whenever we pray for God's Kingdom to come Mat 6:9,10

 

[Dorothy Mae]

God doesn't send people to hell maam, that happens as a result of Adam's sin.

Read Revelation 20:12. Adam’s sin is never mentioned. We are judged by the deeds done in the body as recorded in the books. Adam’s sun led to physical death, not hell. That we do for ourselves.

The good news is hell will be emptied because all will be resurrected from it, and then no longer being needed it will be cast into the lake of fire, and death will be no more, neither mourning nor outcry nor pain be any more as the former things will have passed away.

Where do you get that idea from?

This is the good news the Bible presents Rev 20:13,14; 21:3,4. We pray for this Dorothy whenever we pray for God's Kingdom to come Mat 6:9,10

And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Those in hell will not escape judgement as you suppose. They will live on in the lake of fire. That’s not the end of suffering.

And Jesus said to pray his kingdom come here and now, not merely after the resurrection for which we have no influence nor responsibility.

 

[Highway54]

Read Revelation 20:12. Adam’s sin is never mentioned. We are judged by the deeds done in the body as recorded in the books. Adam’s sun led to physical death, not hell. That we do for ourselves.

Where do you get that idea from?

And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Those in hell will not escape judgement as you suppose. They will live on in the lake of fire. That’s not the end of suffering.

And Jesus said to pray his kingdom come here and now, not merely after the resurrection for which we have no influence nor responsibility.

Read Revelation 20:12. Adam’s sin is never mentioned. We are judged by the deeds done in the body as recorded in the books. Adam’s sun led to physical death, not hell. That we do for ourselves.

We will be judged from those books maam, hell was gone when all were resurrected from it.

Those in hell will not escape judgement as you suppose. They will live on in the lake of fire. That’s not the end of suffering.

No suffering, God defined the lake of fire being the second (permanent) death maam. How will you torture death or hell that are cast into it? Would you torture people eternally in a lake of fire? Why then do you think you have more love than God?

 

[Dorothy Mae]

We will be judged from those books maam, hell was gone when all were resurrected from it.

The lake of fire is still there. But you admit we’re not judged by what Adam did, right?

No suffering, God defined the lake of fire being the second (permanent) death maam.

Those in hell are dead. They still suffer. The first death and second death don’t mean no suffering ….where the worm dies not and the fire is not quenched.

How will you torture death or hell that are cast into it?

Same way they are tortured now. Jesus talked about it and I believe it.

Would you torture people eternally in a lake of fire?

Not my choice. I don’t do anything and cannot prevent what is to be done.

Why then do you think you have more love than God?

Love that refuses justice is just cowardice.

 

[Fastfredy0]

Premise 1: “There is no one righteous, not even one." (Romans 3:10)
Premise 2: This is Paul himself writing Romans 3:10 after he has been regenerated and he is NOT RIGHTEOUS according to God
Premise 3: World population around 50 A.D. = 300 million (per wikipedia)
Conclusion: Highly unlikely we have a person living a sinless life. Maybe mankind has improved since then

Aside: Yet, we are fortunate enough to have at least two such people making such a claim on the forum. So, doing quick math and assuming there was even 1 in 300 million who was righteous/sinless back 2000 thousand years ago then the chances of us being blessed with at least 2 such people on this site assuming 200 active participants would be ... ...
300M to the power of 2 divided by 200 divided by 2 = one in 2,250,000,000,000,000 ... or 2.25 quadrillion to 1
Aside: My math skills may be rusty. Order doesn't matter so divide by 2 I a recall for combination rather than permutation. Also, a bias as a Christian website more likely to attract sinless personage. Anyways, last time we had this more righteous men on earth per the Bible was at the transfiguration ... .Moses, Elijah and Christ though the first two may have been cleaned up after death... well, Elijah never died but I assume he was also 'cleaned up'.

 

[Hopeful]

Premise 1: “There is no one righteous, not even one." (Romans 3:10)
Premise 2: This is Paul himself writing Romans 3:10 after he has been regenerated and he is NOT RIGHTEOUS according to God
Premise 3: World population around 50 A.D. = 300 million (per wikipedia)
Conclusion: Highly unlikely we have a person living a sinless life. Maybe mankind has improved since then

Wow!
And all this time I thought Jesus was righteous!
And Joshua, and Enoch, and Elijah, and John the Baptist...
Paul wrote that to show the Jews that despite them having the Law they too still needed a Savior.

Aside: Yet, we are fortunate enough to have at least two such people making such a claim on the forum. So, doing quick math and assuming there was even 1 in 300 million who was righteous/sinless back 2000 thousand years ago then the chances of us being blessed with at least 2 such people on this site assuming 200 active participants would be ... ...
300M to the power of 2 divided by 200 divided by 2 = one in 2,250,000,000,000,000 ... or 2.25 quadrillion to 1
Aside: My math skills may be rusty. Order doesn't matter so divide by 2 I a recall for combination rather than permutation. Also, a bias as a Christian website more likely to attract sinless personage. Anyways, last time we had this more righteous men on earth per the Bible was at the transfiguration ... .Moses, Elijah and Christ though the first two may have been cleaned up after death... well, Elijah never died but I assume he was also 'cleaned up'.

Can you imagine what it would be like if everyone followed the good Shepherd?

 

[Highway54]

The lake of fire is still there. But you admit we’re not judged by what Adam did, right?

Those in hell are dead. They still suffer. The first death and second death don’t mean no suffering ….where the worm dies not and the fire is not quenched.

Same way they are tortured now. Jesus talked about it and I believe it.

Not my choice. I don’t do anything and cannot prevent what is to be done.

Love that refuses justice is just cowardice.

The lake of fire is still there. But you admit we’re not judged by what Adam did, right?

The lake of fire is not hell maam, hell is the abode of the dead. Gehenna is permanent.

Those in hell are dead. They still suffer

Yes they are dead. God defines what death is Dorothy: Ec 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not anything

The dead do not suffer maam.

Love that refuses justice is just cowardice.

I agree! So while you think you cannot do anything about it, you actually can, you can stand on God's side and reveal these God dishonoring doctrines. And if it proves true that He is going to torture people eternally, you can stand in opposition to Him. But I sincerely think that He has more love than I, but in all honesty time will tell.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

The lake of fire is not hell maam, hell is the abode of the dead. Gehenna is permanent.

Pretty sure it doesn’t matter to the inhabitants.

Yes they are dead. God defines what death is Dorothy: Ec 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not anything

Solomon who married foreign women and worshipped demons was despairing. Jesus says the dead suffer and big time. Going with Jesus on this.

The dead do not suffer maam.

Yes, Jesus says they do. Some at least, sir.

I agree! So while you think you cannot do anything about it, you actually can, you can stand on God's side and reveal these God dishonoring doctrines. And if it proves true that He is going to torture people eternally, you can stand in opposition to Him.

He doesn’t torture anyone. Doesn’t mean it doesn’t occur.

But I sincerely think that He has more love than I, but in all honesty time will tell.

Love is not without justice.

 

[Hopeful]

Pretty sure it doesn’t matter to the inhabitants.

Solomon who married foreign women and worshipped demons was despairing. Jesus says the dead suffer and big time. Going with Jesus on this.

Yes, Jesus says they do. Some at least, sir.

He doesn’t torture anyone. Doesn’t mean it doesn’t occur.

Love is not without justice.

So, do you or do you not believe sinning can be overcome?

 

[Deidr]

Well what happen to Enoch and Elijah....they walked with God and did not die.......

 

[Highway54]

Pretty sure it doesn’t matter to the inhabitants.

Solomon who married foreign women and worshipped demons was despairing. Jesus says the dead suffer and big time. Going with Jesus on this.

Yes, Jesus says they do. Some at least, sir.

He doesn’t torture anyone. Doesn’t mean it doesn’t occur.

Love is not without justice.

Pretty sure it doesn’t matter to the inhabitants.

I fully agree.

Solomon who married foreign women and worshipped demons was despairing. Jesus says the dead suffer and big time. Going with Jesus on this.

The Bible does not contradict itself, research gehenna, more than willing to help you with that if you like.

Yes, Jesus says they do. Some at least, sir.

No maam, research gehenna to find answers putting yourself in the place of those he said it to, how they would understand it.

Love is not without justice.

Exactly, Justice is the key, and one of God's main qualities. We can observe that in His law covenant, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, soul for soul.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

I fully agree.

The Bible does not contradict itself, research gehenna, more than willing to help you with that if you like.

No maam, research gehenna to find answers putting yourself in the place of those he said it to, how they would understand it.

I am sure there are many theories that are more palatable than what Jesus said. Think I’ll stick with Jesus’ descriptions. Very aweful.

Exactly, Justice is the key, and one of God's main qualities. We can observe that in His law covenant, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, soul for soul.

That was a law restricting punishment man could justly give for offenses. It doesn’t apply to God.

 

[Highway54]

I am sure there are many theories that are more palatable than what Jesus said. Think I’ll stick with Jesus’ descriptions. Very aweful.

That was a law restricting punishment man could justly give for offenses. It doesn’t apply to God.

I am sure there are many theories that are more palatable than what Jesus said. Think I’ll stick with Jesus’ descriptions. Very aweful.

Best to know what Jesus said correct? Let me ask you, why would you serve a god like that? Do you think that in the long run he would not turn on you as well? If I ever find out he is evil, I hope I have the gumption to take a stand against him as satan did. He would be the hero would he not?

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Best to know what Jesus said correct? Let me ask you, why would you serve a god like that?

Because He is just and true. He is loving and merciful but hates wrong. I can go on and on.

Do you think that in the long run he would not turn on you as well?

No, that would be unjust.

If I ever find out he is evil, I hope I have the gumption to take a stand against him as satan did.

That’s not the reason Satan rebelled. He wanted to be like God, worshipped. He wanted to steal. Still does.

He would be the hero would he not?

No because no thief is a hero.

 

[Highway54]

Because He is just and true. He is loving and merciful but hates wrong. I can go on and on.

No, that would be unjust.

That’s not the reason Satan rebelled. He wanted to be like God, worshipped. He wanted to steal. Still does.

No because no thief is a hero.

Because He is just and true. He is loving and merciful but hates wrong.

Yet your post indicated otherwise maam. God is either just or He is not, He cannot be both. You have to determine if a god who would torture humans eternally is actually just, loving, and merciful Dorothy. I say he would not be, as would any honest person with compassion. Likely you think hitler to be unjust, but he wouldn't be a pimple on the backside of a god like that.

Would you like to learn more about the God of Jesus maam? Most people believe Jesus displayed all those qualities you said, and he displayed his God's qualities so much that he stated that those who saw him saw his God as well. Be more than happy to discuss Him for sure.

That’s not the reason Satan rebelled. He wanted to be like God, worshipped.

You are absolutely correct Mat 4:8,9 proves that.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Yet your post indicated otherwise maam.

Can you please point out where you see this in my post, thanks.

God is either just or He is not, He cannot be both. You have to determine if a god who would torture humans eternally is actually just, loving, and merciful Dorothy.

He tortures no one. So that’s dealt with.

I say he would not be, as would any honest person with compassion. Likely you think hitler to be unjust, but he wouldn't be a pimple on the backside of a god like that.

Would you like to learn more about the God of Jesus maam?

I’m fairly sure I know Him better than most, sir. He is complex.

Most people believe Jesus displayed all those qualities you said, and he displayed his God's qualities so much that he stated that those who saw him saw his God as well. Be more than happy to discuss Him for sure.

I’d also be very happy to
discuss this and I agree.

You are absolutely correct Mat 4:8,9 proves that.

We agree.

 

[Highway54]

Can you please point out where you see this in my post, thanks.

He tortures no one. So that’s dealt with.

I’m fairly sure I know Him better than most, sir. He is complex.

I’d also be very happy to
discuss this and I agree.

We agree.

Those in hell are dead. They still suffer. The first death and second death don’t mean no suffering ….where the worm dies not and the fire is not quenched.

Those in hell are dead. They still suffer.

Can you please point out where you see this in my post, thanks.

As I said Dorothy, I am a moron, I was intending to put your quotes about this right here in answer but unfortunately they were posted just above maam.

He tortures no one. So that’s dealt with.

You said the dead in the lake of fire suffer, I say it is the second death, see the distinction Dorothy? Do I misunderstand what you are conveying about what that lake is?

He is complex.

Yes maam, I would even say that is an understatement, as none of us will ever know Him fully Ecc 3:11

I’d also be very happy to
discuss this and I agree.

We have been doing this maam, but if there is a particular subject of the Bible you would like to discuss don't hesitate to ask, feel free to send me a personal message as well if you feel it inappropriate to change topic within this thread.