Can You Fall?

[Deborah13]

Galatians 2:20-21

King James Version (KJV)

20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
21I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Galatians 5:3-4

King James Version (KJV)

3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.
4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

Ephesians 1:6-7

King James Version (KJV)

6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
Hebrews 10:29

King James Version (KJV)

29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

"counted the blood of the covenant ....an unholy thing."

I believe that the only way a true believer in Christ could lose their salvation would be to totally reject the blood of the covenant. To despise it and to reject Jesus Christ as their Savior.

 

[Butch5]

You are twisting the scriptures. How can one be a Christian without the Holy Spirit? Either you are a Christian or you are a non Christian.

How exactly am I twisting the Scriptures when I haven't given any? I simply asked you a question. Are you saying the Spirit will never leave a person who has at one point believed, yet may not later on?

 

[iLOVE]

How exactly am I twisting the Scriptures when I haven't given any? I simply asked you a question. Are you saying the Spirit will never leave a person who has at one point believed, yet may not later on?

My answers was posted in block #13. We all must step back and let God be God, and let God judge. I gave another example how Satan wanted Moses. Did the Holy Spirit leave Moses? As we see Satan wants souls...as many as possible.

 

[Mitspa]

The ONLY biblical way to fall, or to be cut off from Christ is to turn from salvation by grace through faith back unto the law of moses. This is made very clear in scripture! It seems the ones who are always warning others about falling are these very ones who have turned back into law.

No one can sin away the savlation of Christ, but they can in fact reject salvation by attempting to earn by works of law that which God says they cannot earn.

FOR THE LAW IS NOT OF FAITH. you who are under law, HAVE FALLEN FROM GRACE. YOU ARE CUT OFF FROM CHRIST!

 

[BornAgain]

The ONLY biblical way to fall, or to be cut off from Christ is to turn from salvation by grace through faith back unto the law of moses. This is made very clear in scripture! It seems the ones who are always warning others about falling are these very ones who have turned back into law.

No one can sin away the savlation of Christ, but they can in fact reject salvation by attempting to earn by works of law that which God says they cannot earn.

FOR THE LAW IS NOT OF FAITH. you who are under law, HAVE FALLEN FROM GRACE. YOU ARE CUT OFF FROM CHRIST!

What law are you under?

 

[iLOVE]

The ONLY biblical way to fall, or to be cut off from Christ is to turn from salvation by grace through faith back unto the law of moses. This is made very clear in scripture! It seems the ones who are always warning others about falling are these very ones who have turned back into law.

No one can sin away the savlation of Christ, but they can in fact reject salvation by attempting to earn by works of law that which God says they cannot earn.

FOR THE LAW IS NOT OF FAITH. you who are under law, HAVE FALLEN FROM GRACE. YOU ARE CUT OFF FROM CHRIST!

Thank you! Mitspa, can you please explain in the supernatural why Satan won't allow Michael to take Moses Spirit? Michael had to call God for help.

 

[Butch5]

My answers was posted in block #13. We all must step back and let God be God, and let God judge. I gave another example how Satan wanted Moses. Did the Holy Spirit leave Moses? As we see Satan wants souls...as many as possible.

I'm not sure what Satan has to do with the question.

 

[Butch5]

The ONLY biblical way to fall, or to be cut off from Christ is to turn from salvation by grace through faith back unto the law of moses. This is made very clear in scripture! It seems the ones who are always warning others about falling are these very ones who have turned back into law.

No one can sin away the savlation of Christ, but they can in fact reject salvation by attempting to earn by works of law that which God says they cannot earn.

FOR THE LAW IS NOT OF FAITH. you who are under law, HAVE FALLEN FROM GRACE. YOU ARE CUT OFF FROM CHRIST!

You should look at Paul's words to the Hebrews.

6 But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end.
7 Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice,
8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.
10 Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.
11 So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)
12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
13 But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.
14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;

(Heb 3:6-14 KJV)

 

[Osgiliath]

Christ's sacrifice for our sins entails repentance. As long as we are unrepentant, it is impossible to be renewed to repentance, until judgment and fiery indignation has consumed the lies of the briers and thorns and until that same fiery indignation has devoured the false spirits, doctrines and adversaries within us. It is only through our destruction that we will be saved.

1 Corinthians 3:15 "If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
1 Corinthians 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and [that] the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
1 Corinthians 3:17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which TEMPLE YE ARE."


Remember, YOU AND I ARE THE TEMPLE! We are not "A" Temple - but we are "THE" one and ONLY TEMPLE! Until one believes and understands this, they will remain "carnal babes in Christ" (1 Corinthians 3:1) who can handle only "milk" but not "meat" (Hebrews 5:12-14).



Returning to "our destruction" and repentance:

John 12:24 "Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit."

Matthew 10:39 "He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it."


Faith comes to us twice. It comes when we come to our "first love":

Revelation 2:4 "Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee [church of Ephesus], because thou hast left thy first love.
Revelation 2:5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent."


Faith then comes again when Christ appears "a second time, without sin unto salvation."

Hebrews 9:28 "So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the SECOND TIME without sin unto salvation."


Faith first comes to us as we are "carnal babes in Christ" (1 Corinthians 3:1) who cannot be fed "strong meat" (Hebrews 5:12-14). We then fall prey to all the lies of Babylon (false church system), and we leave our first love for those lies. Then we must repent, and Christ comes to us a second time.

That is what the book of Revelation is about.... the destruction of 'the beast' within us, the destruction of that 'man of sin' who sitteth in the Temple of God (WE ARE the Temple), so that Christ can "appear to us the SECOND TIME without sin unto salvation."

 

[Mitspa]

You should look at Paul's words to the Hebrews.

6 But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end.
7 Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice,
8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
9 When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.
10 Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.
11 So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)
12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
13 But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.
14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;

(Heb 3:6-14 KJV)

What is that confidence? faith! the law of faith. And this is the Fathers commandments? That you believe on His Son and love as He gave commandment.

The context of the "rest" is that we have ceased from own own works!

Verse 19 so we see that they could not enter in because of UNBELIEF. the law is not of faith.

The law of the Spirit of life in Christ.

one cannot just ignore the whole of the New Testament and make a certain verse mean what one wants it to mean.

The word "sin" means to miss the mark or "transgress" the sin mentioned here is the EVIL HEART OF UNBELIEF!

the whole point and warning of the Book of Hebrews is against those who are turning from grace back into law.

This is "willinging" sinning for which one will be judged.

 

[Carolyn]

We are told that God is able to keep us from falling. I do think this means that we may fall but we can rely on God to chasten us and keep our hearts tender toward him.

 

[Deborah13]

What is that confidence? faith! the law of faith. And this is the Fathers commandments? That you believe on His Son and love as He gave commandment.

The context of the "rest" is that we have ceased from own own works!

Verse 19 so we see that they could not enter in because of UNBELIEF. the law is not of faith.

The law of the Spirit of life in Christ.

one cannot just ignore the whole of the New Testament and make a certain verse mean what one wants it to mean.

The word "sin" means to miss the mark or "transgress" the sin mentioned here is the EVIL HEART OF UNBELIEF!

the whole point and warning of the Book of Hebrews is against those who are turning from grace back into law.

This is "willinging" sinning for which one will be judged.

I was trying to answer Butch5 but when I read your post you have left me nothing to say. Well done.

 

[Mitspa]

I was trying to answer Butch5 but when I read your post you have left me nothing to say. Well done.

Thank you Deb13!
You are blessed with every spiritual blessing!

We are told throughout the New Testament that BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH WE STAND!
Grace can never fail, we access grace by faith!
THE LAW IS NOT OF FAITH!
those who are under law have FALLEN from grace.
Cut off from Christ.

 

[Butch5]

What is that confidence? faith! the law of faith. And this is the Fathers commandments? That you believe on His Son and love as He gave commandment.

The context of the "rest" is that we have ceased from own own works!

Verse 19 so we see that they could not enter in because of UNBELIEF. the law is not of faith.

The law of the Spirit of life in Christ.

one cannot just ignore the whole of the New Testament and make a certain verse mean what one wants it to mean.

The word "sin" means to miss the mark or "transgress" the sin mentioned here is the EVIL HEART OF UNBELIEF!

the whole point and warning of the Book of Hebrews is against those who are turning from grace back into law.

This is "willinging" sinning for which one will be judged.

The rest is God's rest. It is the promised seventh day. Their evil heart of unbelief wasn't that they didn't have faith in God. They had seen the miracles in Egypt, seen the Red Sea parted, seen the Cloud by day and fire by night. Their evil heart of unbelief what that they took their gold and formed it into an image and said this is God, and declared a feast unto the Lord as the pagans did. That's why Paul tells his readers not to be deceived by the deceitfulness of sin. It is sin that leads to the evil heart of unbelief. They wanted to go back to Egypt when things got hard. That is why Paul is encouraging his readers to press on and not turn back as those in the wilderness wanted to do.

 

[Butch5]

Thank you Deb13!
You are blessed with every spiritual blessing!

We are told throughout the New Testament that BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH WE STAND!
Grace can never fail, we access grace by faith!
THE LAW IS NOT OF FAITH!
those who are under law have FALLEN from grace.
Cut off from Christ.

The Law was for the Jews, that was 2000 years ago.

 

[Davies]

The Law was for the Jews, that was 2000 years ago.

Hi Butch,

We should acknowledge this Scripture too.

Romans 2:14

New King James Version (NKJV)

14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves,


- Davies

 

[Mitspa]

The rest is God's rest. It is the promised seventh day. Their evil heart of unbelief wasn't that they didn't have faith in God. They had seen the miracles in Egypt, seen the Red Sea parted, seen the Cloud by day and fire by night. Their evil heart of unbelief what that they took their gold and formed it into an image and said this is God, and declared a feast unto the Lord as the pagans did. That's why Paul tells his readers not to be deceived by the deceitfulness of sin. It is sin that leads to the evil heart of unbelief. They wanted to go back to Egypt when things got hard. That is why Paul is encouraging his readers to press on and not turn back as those in the wilderness wanted to do.

Well not sure what point you are making? But the scriptures are describing the sin of unbelief and the Whole book of Hebrews is speaking to certain "hebrews" who are turning from grace back into law. THE LAW IS NOT OF FAITH. so the "sin" descibed here and throughout the book of Hebrews is not sin against the law of moses, but in fact the sin against the law of faith in Christ, by TURNING BACK into the bondage of law. Thus Paul uses the examples of those who wanted to TURN BACK INTO BONDAGE of egypt.

This is very clear to all who understand the gospel.

 

[Butch5]

Hi Butch,

We should acknowledge this Scripture too.

Romans 2:14

New King James Version (NKJV)

14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves,


- Davies

Hi Davies,

I agree, however, I don't see you're point. The Law is not an issue today, Christ fulfilled it almost 2000 years ago. Even then it was the Jews who were under the Law, as you pointed out the Gentiles did not have the Law.

 

[Butch5]

Well not sure what point you are making? But the scriptures are describing the sin of unbelief and the Whole book of Hebrews is speaking to certain "hebrews" who are turning from grace back into law. THE LAW IS NOT OF FAITH. so the "sin" descibed here and throughout the book of Hebrews is not sin against the law of moses, but in fact the sin against the law of faith in Christ, by TURNING BACK into the bondage of law. Thus Paul uses the examples of those who wanted to TURN BACK INTO BONDAGE of egypt.

This is very clear to all who understand the gospel.

Mitspa,

Those in the desert that Paul is speaking of did not have the Law. Their sin was turning away from God and desiring to go back to Egypt. Paul is warning his readers not to turn from God and go back to the Law. Their going back to the Law is a rejection of faith, thus an evil heart of unbelief. Paul clearly states that sin leads to a heart of unbelief.

 

[Mitspa]

Hi Butch,

We should acknowledge this Scripture too.

Romans 2:14

New King James Version (NKJV)

14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves,


- Davies

Who show the work of the LAW WRITTEN ON THEIR HEART.
this is speaking of Born-again "gentile" believers who have the Holy Spirit.
Read on and this is made very clear in the end of that very chapter.

2:27 And will not the physically uncircumcised, if he fulfills the law, judge you who, by the written code and circumcision, are a trangressor of the law.

This is very clear!