Christ Jesus came into the world to save ALL sinners

[Hopeful 2]

Not according to scripture, the book of life is opened because some raised up from Hades and Death WERE written the book of life. ONLY those not written were lost:

13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works.
14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. (Rev. 20:13-15 NKJ)

I can clearly see that those judged unworthy of eternal life have had their names blotted out of the book of life.
Whether you are good or bad, you will be judged.

If all raised from Hades were condemned, the book of life would have remained shut.

By their works, they shall be judged.
Condemnation comes after the grave/hades.

 

[Hopeful 2]

Yet, Calvinist’s teach that Jesus Christ died for just the elect.

Were they always elect ?
Or did they have to do something to be called elect ?
I mean, are there a bunch of murderous thieves out there who will someday be called elect ?

I am glad that I elected to follow Jesus.

 

[JLB]

I am glad that I elected to follow Jesus.

Amen.

 

[JLB]

I mean, are there a bunch of murderous thieves out there who will someday be called elect ?

Of which Saul of Tarsus was one of them.

 

[Hopeful 2]

Of which Saul of Tarsus was one of them.

Wouldn't that mean that Calvinists are saved by works ? (GASP !)

 

[JLB]

Wouldn't that mean that Calvinists are saved by works ? (GASP !)

 

[SolaScriptura]

Yet, Calvinist’s teach that Jesus Christ died for just the elect.

John Calvin was not a "Calvinist"!

 

[Alfred Persson]

I can clearly see that those judged unworthy of eternal life have had their names blotted out of the book of life.
Whether you are good or bad, you will be judged.

By their works, they shall be judged.
Condemnation comes after the grave/hades.

13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works.
14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. (Rev. 20:13-15 NKJ)

Anyone not found = Some were found written in the Book of Life and NOT cast into the lake of fire

 

[Alfred Persson]

By their works, they shall be judged.
Condemnation comes after the grave/hades.

Not all are condemned. It is written:

13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works.
14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. (Rev. 20:13-15 NKJ)

Anyone not found = Some were found written in the Book of Life and NOT cast into the lake of fire

To illustrate:
And anyone without a theater ticket was left outside the theater
=
Some had theater tickets and were let in.

And anyone not found sitting at the table was cast out of the banquet.
=
Some were found sitting at the table and left to enjoy the banquet.

Why did John focus on those not written in the Book of Life? Likely because those cast into the Lake of Fire were 1)the majority; 2)The sheer terror on their faces and frightening spectacle of a lake burning with fire into which they were cast, left an indellible impression upon John.

 

[Hopeful 2]

13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works.
14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. (Rev. 20:13-15 NKJ)

Anyone not found = Some were found written in the Book of Life and NOT cast into the lake of fire

Agreed.
The book of life will be used to determine a man's fate.
Everyone will be raised, and judged: but those blotted out of the book of life will be thrown into the lake of fire.

 

[Hopeful 2]

Not all are condemned. It is written:

13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works.
14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. (Rev. 20:13-15 NKJ)

Anyone not found = Some were found written in the Book of Life and NOT cast into the lake of fire

To illustrate:
And anyone without a theater ticket was left outside the theater
=
Some had theater tickets and were let in.

And anyone not found sitting at the table was cast out of the banquet.
=
Some were found sitting at the table and left to enjoy the banquet.

Why did John focus on those not written in the Book of Life? Likely because those cast into the Lake of Fire were 1)the majority; 2)The sheer terror on their faces and frightening spectacle of a lake burning with fire into which they were cast, left an indellible impression upon John.

We all get a life time to cement/insure our future judgement.
Sinners will be burned, and saints will be granted eternal life.

 

[Alfred Persson]

We all get a life time to cement/insure our future judgement.
Sinners will be burned, and saints will be granted eternal life.

Some get more than a lifetime, deathtime is added so all get a fair shot at the prize:

For this reason the gospel was preached also to those who are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. (1 Pet. 4:6 NKJ)

 

[Hopeful 2]

Some get more than a lifetime, deathtime is added so all get a fair shot at the prize:

For this reason the gospel was preached also to those who are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. (1 Pet. 4:6 NKJ)

That gospel was preached to them while they still lived.
"Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.
12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven;" (1 Peter 1:10-12)
".... but quickened by the Spirit:
19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
20 Which sometime were disobedient, when..." (1 Peter 3:18-20)

The dead, in prison, heard the prophesies during their lives.

 

[Alfred Persson]

That gospel was preached to them while they still lived.
"Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.
12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven;" (1 Peter 1:10-12)
".... but quickened by the Spirit:
19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
20 Which sometime were disobedient, when..." (1 Peter 3:18-20)

The dead, in prison, heard the prophesies during their lives.

1 Peter 4:6 is years after 1 Peter 3:18, when Christ was crucified. Peter was speaking about the mockers of the gospel, not spirits in prison:

4 In regard to these, they think it strange that you do not run with them in the same flood of dissipation, speaking evil of you.
5 They will give an account to Him who is ready to judge the living and the dead.
6 For this reason the gospel was preached also to those who are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. (1 Pet. 4:4-6 NKJ)

These details exist in scripture put there by the Holy Spirit, that the prophets weren't aware of but the apostles saw them and they reveal things previously unknown:

11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.
12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven;" (1 Peter 1:10-12)

Therefore, Peter knew the gospell is preached ALSO to the dead, from details in the OT scriptures the prophets themselves were unaware of. Perhaps some of those details are in these verses:

A Survey of Scriptures where Postmortem Opportunity for Salvation may be taught:

Dt. 32:39 [#A]; 1Sam. 2:6 [#B]; 2Sam. 22:5-7 [#C]; Ps. 16:10-11 [#D]; Ps. 30:1-4 [#E]; Ps. 40:1-3 [#F]; Ps. 49:12-15 [#G]; Ps. 56:13 [#H]; Ps. 68:18-20 [#I]; Ps. 69:13-18 [#J]; Ps. 71:19-23 [#K]; Ps. 86:13 [#L]; Ps. 102:18-22 [#M]; Ps. 116:1-9 [#N]; Hos. 13:14 [#O]; Jon. 2:1-10 [#P]; Zec. 9:9-11 [#Q]; Mt. 12:30-32[#R]; John 5:28-29[#S]; Rm. 11:25-36[#T]; 1 Pt. 3:18-22[#U]; 1 Pt. 4:6[#V]; 1 Cor. 5:5[#W]; Eph. 4:8-10[#I]; Heb. 9:27-28[#X]; Rev. 20:11-15[#Y];Luke 16:19-31[#Z]; John 3:16-18[#ZA]

 

[Dyonisius the Areopagite]

1 Peter 4:6 is years after 1 Peter 3:18, when Christ was crucified. Peter was speaking about the mockers of the gospel, not spirits in prison:

4 In regard to these, they think it strange that you do not run with them in the same flood of dissipation, speaking evil of you.
5 They will give an account to Him who is ready to judge the living and the dead.
6 For this reason the gospel was preached also to those who are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. (1 Pet. 4:4-6 NKJ)

These details exist in scripture put there by the Holy Spirit, that the prophets weren't aware of but the apostles saw them and they reveal things previously unknown:

11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.
12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven;" (1 Peter 1:10-12)

Therefore, Peter knew the gospell is preached ALSO to the dead, from details in the OT scriptures the prophets themselves were unaware of. Perhaps some of those details are in these verses:

A Survey of Scriptures where Postmortem Opportunity for Salvation may be taught:

Dt. 32:39 [#A]; 1Sam. 2:6 [#B]; 2Sam. 22:5-7 [#C]; Ps. 16:10-11 [#D]; Ps. 30:1-4 [#E]; Ps. 40:1-3 [#F]; Ps. 49:12-15 [#G]; Ps. 56:13 [#H]; Ps. 68:18-20 [#I]; Ps. 69:13-18 [#J]; Ps. 71:19-23 [#K]; Ps. 86:13 [#L]; Ps. 102:18-22 [#M]; Ps. 116:1-9 [#N]; Hos. 13:14 [#O]; Jon. 2:1-10 [#P]; Zec. 9:9-11 [#Q]; Mt. 12:30-32[#R]; John 5:28-29[#S]; Rm. 11:25-36[#T]; 1 Pt. 3:18-22[#U]; 1 Pt. 4:6[#V]; 1 Cor. 5:5[#W]; Eph. 4:8-10[#I]; Heb. 9:27-28[#X]; Rev. 20:11-15[#Y];Luke 16:19-31[#Z]; John 3:16-18[#ZA]

Isn't the intercession for the dead also in the so called apocrypha, which was and still is a part of the Septuagint and would have been considered Scripture by St. Peter?

 

[Alfred Persson]

Isn't the intercession for the dead also in the so called apocrypha, which was and still is a part of the Septuagint and would have been considered Scripture by St. Peter?

Everything I believe is in the 66 book canon accepted as scripture by all of Christendom. I reject the apocryphal books.

 

[Dyonisius the Areopagite]

Everything I believe is in the 66 book canon accepted as scripture by all of Christendom. I reject the apocryphal books.

I am curious as to what grounds you have for rejection? A 66 book Canon is an invention of the Reformation. The Apostles used the Septuagint and so did their successors.

 

[Alfred Persson]

I am curious as to what grounds you have for rejection? A 66 book Canon is an invention of the Reformation. The Apostles used the Septuagint and so did their successors.

1 What advantage then has the Jew, or what is the profit of circumcision?
2 Much in every way! Chiefly because to them were committed the oracles of God. (Rom. 3:1-2 NKJ)

The Jewish OT canon is correct.

 

[Dyonisius the Areopagite]

1 What advantage then has the Jew, or what is the profit of circumcision?
2 Much in every way! Chiefly because to them were committed the oracles of God. (Rom. 3:1-2 NKJ)

The Jewish OT canon is correct.

The Church is the continuation of Judaism. Unbelieving Jews are not the oracles of God. That passed to the Church. St. Paul also said "The Church is the Pillar and Ground of the Truth". The Church Canonised the Septuagint. That is what is Holy Scripture, by the ruling of the Holy Spirit....period!

 

[Hopeful 2]

1 Peter 4:6 is years after 1 Peter 3:18, when Christ was crucified. Peter was speaking about the mockers of the gospel, not spirits in prison:

The years between Jesus' resurrection and Peter's writings are of no matter.
The same Spirit that raised Jesus from the dead also was in the prophets of yore.
They were both "by the Spirit".

These details exist in scripture put there by the Holy Spirit, that the prophets weren't aware of but the apostles saw them and they reveal things previously unknown:
11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.
12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven;" (1 Peter 1:10-12)

Your scrip' shows that it was revealed unto them.

Therefore, Peter knew the gospell is preached ALSO to the dead, from details in the OT scriptures the prophets themselves were unaware of. Perhaps some of those details are in these verses:

It was indeed preached to those who were already dead during Peter's life.
But that preaching happened during their lives !
"Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:" (1 Peter 1:10)

A Survey of Scriptures where Postmortem Opportunity for Salvation may be taught:

Dt. 32:39 [#A]; 1Sam. 2:6 [#B]; 2Sam. 22:5-7 [#C]; Ps. 16:10-11 [#D]; Ps. 30:1-4 [#E]; Ps. 40:1-3 [#F]; Ps. 49:12-15 [#G]; Ps. 56:13 [#H]; Ps. 68:18-20 [#I]; Ps. 69:13-18 [#J]; Ps. 71:19-23 [#K]; Ps. 86:13 [#L]; Ps. 102:18-22 [#M]; Ps. 116:1-9 [#N]; Hos. 13:14 [#O]; Jon. 2:1-10 [#P]; Zec. 9:9-11 [#Q]; Mt. 12:30-32[#R]; John 5:28-29[#S]; Rm. 11:25-36[#T]; 1 Pt. 3:18-22[#U]; 1 Pt. 4:6[#V]; 1 Cor. 5:5[#W]; Eph. 4:8-10[#I]; Heb. 9:27-28[#X]; Rev. 20:11-15[#Y];Luke 16:19-31[#Z]; John 3:16-18[#ZA]

It is written..."For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?" (1 Peter 4:17)
Your answer to that question is...NOTHING.
It is a very unwise answer.