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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
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Daniel 9:27 and Daniel 12:11-12
- Thread starter DRS81
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Ok, there's something that is really confusing me here..
The Messiah started preaching at the beginning of the 483rd year. 49 + 434 = 483.
Then the 487th, 488th, and 489th year was when the *Romans came. They destroyed Jerusalem and God’s holy place.
Then the end comes, the end of the 70 weeks, the 490th year. And that's it!
So where in the world does Dan 9:27 seven years fit into the 70 weeks. It doesn't make sense.
Where does the (confirming a covenant) take place. Shouldn't it be 71 weeks?
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Yes Jesus never confirmed a covenant for 7 years but rather made the New Covenant with His blood.
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The events of the 70th week are listed in verse 27, none of which has anything to do with Jesus, and is associated with the prince who is to come and the abomination of desolation.
If you can show a New Testament scripture after the cross that has the abomination of desolation occurring or the sacrifice and offerings in the Temple ceasing then please share them.
I haven't found any sacrifices or
offerings ceasing in the book of Acts or any mention of the Abomination of Desolation occurring in Acts or any of Paul's letters.
Jesus listed that event as a sign just before His Coming.
Which is what Paul also taught.
Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
2 Thessalonians 2:1-4
If you can show a scripture from the book of Acts that has the sacrifices ceasing and an Abomination of Desilation occurring in the Temple then your 70th week theory occurring after Jesus was crucified could be considered as valid.
JLB
Deborah13
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The Romans didn't come right after in 487th.....years.
There's only 70 weeks in the prophecy.
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- #87
Right, but where do the seven years in Dan 9:27 fit in to the 70 week prophecy. Why is it there.
Unless you're saying that the evil prince has come and gone..
v26 Then a foreign prince will come with his army and he will destroy the city and the holy place.
v27 The prince will make a strong agreement with many people for 7 years. In the middle of the 7 years he will stop all the *sacrifices. He will put an awful thing in the holy place.
Or maybe the timeline of Dan 9:27 starts here in red..
v25 ‘I want you to know and understand’, Gabriel continued. ‘Someone will issue a command to build Jerusalem again. 49 years (in other words, 7 times 7) will pass. People will build Jerusalem city again. They will build streets and a wall. But God’s people will suffer trouble during this time. Then there will be 434 years (in other words, 62 times 7) more. Then, the special ruler that God has chosen will come. v26 After the 434 years, people will kill the special ruler that God has appointed. He will have nothing. (DAN 9:27 STARTS HERE/FUTURE Then a foreign prince will come with his army and he will destroy the city and the holy place. The end will be like a flood. God has ordered that people should destroy things. He has decided that there will be war until the end of that time. v27 The prince will make a strong agreement with many people for 7 years. In the middle of the 7 years he will stop all the *sacrifices. He will put an awful thing in the holy place. And it will stay there until God acts. God has decided to kill this prince, and his end will happen.’
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Deborah13
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Jesus said read Daniel not Acts.
Dan 9:24 `Seventy weeks are determined for thy people, and for thy holy city, to shut up the transgression, and to seal up sins, and to cover iniquity, and to bring in righteousness age-during, and to seal up vision and prophet, and to anoint the holy of holies.
All of these things had to be accomplished during that 70 wks, and they were by the Messiah Himself. He was crucified After the 69 wks so for all these things to be accomplised within the 70wks, Messiah died and rose in the 70th week.
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Exactly!!!!!!
If the events of the 70th week would have occurred within 7 years of the Cross, then we could surely find the evidence in the book of Acts which recorded events within days of the Cross moving forward.
We don't find any AOD or the sacrifices and offerings in the Temple ceasing.
The 70th week has not started, as the times of the Gentiles has not come to an end.
JLB
Deborah13
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This is what your commentator said, I quote him again,
"Then there is a period of 62 times 7 years. After this, Jesus came into the world. He taught and he cured people for about three and a half years. But then the people killed him. He was the man whom God had appointed. Later the *Romans came. They destroyed Jerusalem and God’s holy place."
The Romans came in AD70 and destroyed Jerusalem and the temple.
Jesus said all this would happen in Matthew 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21. Especially we can see this in Luke 21 when Luke records about the armies surrounding Jerusalem and when they saw this they were to 'flee to the mountains'.
That's what happened, they fled to places like Pella, which was north east of Jerusalem and away from all the cities of Israel. We know this from the Jewish historian Josephus and there was a Roman historian that wrote about some of this too, but I can't think of his name right now, starts with a T...
When the temple was destroyed that was the official end of the temple sacrifices but it had already been determined that would happen. When they turned against Him and crucified Him they said, 'We have no king except Caesar.' How ironic is it that it would be the armies of Caesar that would destroy their temple, city, kill them, and sell them into slavery.
Jesus wasn't weeping over a city 2,000 yrs out in the future but the very city and people that hated Him.
Luk 21:22 because these are days of vengeance, to fulfil all things that have been written.
Dan 9:27 And he hath strengthened a covenant with many--one week, and in the midst of the week he causeth sacrifice and present to cease, and by the wing of abominations he is making desolate, even till the consummation, and that which is determined is poured on the desolate one.'
Mat 23:38 Lo, left desolate to you is your house;
Deborah13
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ezrider
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Where are you coming up with the idea that Messiah the Prince was fulfilled at what is now called Palm Sunday? That was not when Messiah the Prince was made known, that was when He was announced as their King. Unto Messiah the Prince to me would refer to the time when Jesus began his earthly ministry proclaiming the kingdom of God, demonstrating the Mercy of the Lord; proclaiming the forgiveness of sin. Messiah the Prince would have arrived the moment John baptized him and saw the Spirit of God descend upon him like a dove. This is when the 70th week would have started, and in the midst of the week, Jesus was cut off and crucified.
Deborah13
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Yes, I agree.
Sinthesis
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I've never claimed the Messianic covenant was a seven year covenant. Rather, for the 70th week of the seven years, from Jesus' baptism until the stoning of Stephan, those many Jews who trusted in God's promise to send His Messiah had their belief in God's faithfulness confirmed in Jesus Christ.
Sinthesis
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Yep!
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The Baptism of Jesus has nothing to do with the 70 weeks.
Messiah the Prince was fulfilled when all the city came out and proclaimed
HOSANNA TO THE SON OF DAVID!
Hosanna is a messianic phrase that refers to YHWH Himself.
The son of King David is the Prince.
That is why Jesus told the Pharisee's if these do not praise me the rocks would cry out.
That was the Day that the 69th week was being fulfilled!
JLB
Sinthesis
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Nope. The Messiah 'arrived' when He was anointed with the Holy Spirit. Jesus, the Prince of Peace, began Daniel's 70th week the very day John the Baptist saw the Holy Spirit descend on Him, and bore record that He was the Son of God. Jesus was recognized as Messiah by Andrew and Simon Peter the very next day, and Philip and Nathanael the day after. John 1:29-51
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- #99
Hi Deb.
I don't think Matt 23:38 can be compared to Dan 9:27. Yes they both say (desolate), but Dan 9:27 specifically gives us a timeline of seven years. You seemed to have found the description of what happens within these 70 weeks using Dan 9:25 and Dan 9:26, but that still leaves Dan 9:27 seven years unaccounted for...
Dan 9:27 And he shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week he shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come one who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on the desolator.”
1. Who is making a strong covenant with many for seven years.
2. Who is putting an end to sacrifice and offering and putting up the abomination of desolation.
3. Is the seven years in Dan 9:27 the 483rd year to the 490th year.
4. Are you saying Dan 9:26-27 are speaking about AD70.
- DRS81
Deborah13
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Young's Literal Translation
Dan 9:27 And he (Messiah) hath strengthened a covenant with many--one week, and in the midst of the week he causeth sacrifice and present to cease,( Messiah became the only atonement for sin ) and by the wing of abominations (the wing of the Roman armies) he is making desolate, even till the consummation, and that which is determined is poured on the desolate one (the desolate one was the nation of Israel that had rejected Him).'
Luk 21:20 `And when ye may see Jerusalem surrounded by encampments, then know that come nigh did her desolation;
Luk 21:21 then those in Judea, let them flee to the mountains; and those in her midst, let them depart out; and those in the countries, let them not come in to her;
Luk 21:22 because these are days of vengeance, to fulfil all things that have been written.
Written where?
Mat 24:15 `Whenever, therefore, ye may see the abomination of the desolation, that was spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place (whoever is reading let him observe)
Vengeance for what?
Mat 23:31 So that ye testify to yourselves, that ye are sons of them who did murder the prophets;
Mat 23:32 and ye--ye fill up the measure of your fathers.
Mat 23:33 `Serpents! brood of vipers! how may ye escape from the judgment of the gehenna?
Mat 23:34 `Because of this, lo, I send to you prophets, and wise men, and scribes, and of them ye will kill and crucify, and of them ye will scourge in your synagogues, and will pursue from city to city;
Mat 23:35 that on you may come all the righteous blood being poured out on the earth from the blood of Abel the righteous, unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the sanctuary and the altar:
Mat 23:36 verily I say to you, all these things shall come upon this generation.
Mat 23:37 `Jerusalem, Jerusalem, that art killing the prophets, and stoning those sent unto thee, how often did I will to gather thy children together, as a hen doth gather her own chickens under the wings, and ye did not will.
Mat 23:38 Lo, left desolate to you is your house;
3. yes
4. yes