Daniel 9:27 and Daniel 12:11-12

[Deborah13]

Hi Sinthesis, Good Afternoon. But it does say that my friend. There are four groups of people that are being spoken of here...Dan 9:27 And (he?) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (he?) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (one?) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the desolator?).”



In your sentence here who are (the people), (them), (they) and (the desolate) you speak of.

Who did Jesus say (they) were?

Mat 23:37 `Jerusalem, Jerusalem, that art killing the prophets, and stoning those sent unto thee, how often did I will to gather thy children together, as a hen doth gather her own chickens under the wings, and ye did not will.
Mat 23:38 Lo, left desolate to you is your house;

Mat 24:2 and Jesus said to them, `Do ye not see all these? verily I say to you, There may not be left here a stone upon a stone, that shall not be thrown down.'

Luk 19:41 And when he came nigh, having seen the city, he wept over it,
Luk 19:42 saying--`If thou didst know, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things for thy peace; but now they were hid from thine eyes.
Luk 19:43 `Because days shall come upon thee, and thine enemies shall cast around thee a rampart, and compass thee round, and press thee on every side,
Luk 19:44 and lay thee low, and thy children within thee, and they shall not leave in thee a stone upon a stone, because thou didst not know the time of thy inspection.'


The Jewish historian and eyewitness Josephus said this,
"Cesar gave orders that they should now demolish the whole city and temple, except the three towers Phaselus, Hippicus, and Mariamne, and a part of the western wall; but all the rest was laid so completely even with the ground, by those who dug it up from the foundation, that there was nothing left to make those who came thither believe that it had ever been inhabited."

 

[ezrider]

In your sentence here who are (the people), (them), (they) and (the desolate) you speak of.

I told you who the desolate ones are in my previous post. You can read about them in Galatians 4:24-27.

 

[DRS81]

Who did Jesus say (they) were?

Mat 23:37 `Jerusalem, Jerusalem, that art killing the prophets, and stoning those sent unto thee, how often did I will to gather thy children together, as a hen doth gather her own chickens under the wings, and ye did not will.
Mat 23:38 Lo, left desolate to you is your house;

Mat 24:2 and Jesus said to them, `Do ye not see all these? verily I say to you, There may not be left here a stone upon a stone, that shall not be thrown down.'

Luk 19:41 And when he came nigh, having seen the city, he wept over it,
Luk 19:42 saying--`If thou didst know, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things for thy peace; but now they were hid from thine eyes.
Luk 19:43 `Because days shall come upon thee, and thine enemies shall cast around thee a rampart, and compass thee round, and press thee on every side,
Luk 19:44 and lay thee low, and thy children within thee, and they shall not leave in thee a stone upon a stone, because thou didst not know the time of thy inspection.'


The Jewish historian and eyewitness Josephus said this,
"Cesar gave orders that they should now demolish the whole city and temple, except the three towers Phaselus, Hippicus, and Mariamne, and a part of the western wall; but all the rest was laid so completely even with the ground, by those who dug it up from the foundation, that there was nothing left to make those who came thither believe that it had ever been inhabited."

I told you who the desolate ones are in my previous post. You can read about them in Galatians 4:24-27.

So far nobody has filled out the blanks. The first blank is Jesus, who are the other three? Why would this be so difficult to fill in the blanks? If you guys know then fill them in....Dan 9:27 And (Jesus) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (he?) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (one?) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the desolator?).”

 

[JLB]

So far nobody has filled out the blanks. The first blank is Jesus, who are the other three? Why would this be so difficult to fill in the blanks? If you guys know then fill them in....Dan 9:27 And (Jesus) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (he?) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (one?) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the desolator?).”

The he is the prince who is to come.

Not Jesus

 

[DRS81]

The he is the prince who is to come.

Not Jesus

I'm just trying to make sense of Dan 9:27. I haven't really gotten a solid answer here. You wanna try to take a stab at it, filling in the blanks....

he, he, one, desolator...

Dan 9:27 And (he?) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (he?) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (one?) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the desolator?).”

 

[Sinthesis]

Hi Sinthesis, Good Afternoon. But it does say that my friend. There are four groups of people that are being spoken of here...Dan 9:27 And (he?) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (he?) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (one?) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the desolator?).”

↑
There is an overspreading of abominations that justify the desolation. In other words, because of the (people?) turning to abomination, Jesus leaves (them?), which means (they?) are left desolate spiritually. Without God, (the desolate?)are eventually destroyed.


In your sentence here who are (the people), (them), (they) and (the desolate) you speak of.

In my sentence (the people), (them), (they) and (the desolate) all speak of the bad figs of the Jewish leadership who both rejected Jesus' doctrine and acted without God as their own messiah to deliver the promised land from the Romans. Their methods and motivations done in the name of God was an abomination that could not stand.

Also your particular analysis of four groups of people in Dan 9:27 is incorrect according to my viewpoint.

 

[Deborah13]

So far nobody has filled out the blanks. The first blank is Jesus, who are the other three? Why would this be so difficult to fill in the blanks? If you guys know then fill them in....Dan 9:27 And (Jesus) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (he?) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (one?) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the desolator?).”

You my friend have been given many scriptures and perspectives. It is for you to study and pray about.

Think about this too,
Who destroyed the first temple, the Babylonians or God and why was it done.
Who destroyed the second temple, the Romans or God and why was it done.

Do you think any men or power of men could destroy what was/is God's?

 

[DRS81]

Also your particular analysis of four groups of people in Dan 9:27 is incorrect according to my viewpoint.

Hi Sinthesis. How is it incorrect.
There are four groups of people spoken of in this verse,
not to mention throughout 19 different versions also..http://biblehub.com/daniel/9-27.htm

Dan 9:27 And (he?) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (he?) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (one?) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the desolator?).”

..and still nobody has filled the blanks.
if you, ezrider and Deborah13 understand who the four groups are then it should be a simple task.
if you guys don't know the answer then simply say I don't know.

 

[Deborah13]

Hi Sinthesis. How is it incorrect.
There are four groups of people spoken of in this verse,
not to mention throughout 19 different versions also..http://biblehub.com/daniel/9-27.htm

Dan 9:27 And (he?) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (he?) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (one?) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the desolator?).”

..and still nobody has filled the blanks.
if you, ezrider and Deborah13 understand who the four groups are then it should be a simple task.
if you guys don't know the answer then simply say I don't know.

There are not four groups of people.
I know what I see and I gave you the scriptures. I also gave you the pages on biblehub, where you can read my views. Here they are again.
http://biblehub.com/commentaries/mhcw/daniel/9.htm
http://biblehub.com/commentaries/clarke/daniel/9.htm

 

[DRS81]

I give up.

 

[DRS81]

I'll fill them out for you..

Dan 9:27 And (he?) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (he?) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (one?) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the desolator?).”

Dan 9:27 And (the antichrist) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (the antichrist) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (the antichrist) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the Jewish people).”

or

Dan 9:27 And (Jesus) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (Jesus) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (the Roman army) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the Jewish people).”

 

[Deborah13]

I'll fill them out for you..

Dan 9:27 And (he?) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (he?) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (one?) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the desolator?).”

Dan 9:27 And (the antichrist) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (the antichrist) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (the antichrist) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the Jewish people).”

or

Dan 9:27 And (Jesus) shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week (Jesus) shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come (the Roman army) who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on (the Jewish people).”

The second one is what I believe. I will add though that the Roman army was the instrument of the Lord to bring this judgement on the nation as a whole. Just as the Babylonians were the instrument of the Lord to bring judgement.

 

[Sinthesis]

And he(Jesus) shall confirm the covenant with many(Jesus' followers) for one week: and in the midst of the week he(Jesus) shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he(Jesus) shall make it desolate, even until the consummation(End of Temple Judaism), and that determined(Roman victory) shall be poured upon the desolate(Jewish rebels). - KJV

And he(Jesus) hath strengthened a covenant with many(Jesus' followers) -- one week, and in the midst of the week he(Jesus) causeth sacrifice and present to cease, and by the wing of abominations he(Jesus) is making desolate, even till the consummation(End of Temple Judaism), and that which is determined(Roman victory) is poured on the desolate one(Corporate Jewish Rebellion). - YLT

 

[Deborah13]

And he(Jesus) shall confirm the covenant with many(Jesus' followers) for one week: and in the midst of the week he(Jesus) shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he(Jesus) shall make it desolate, even until the consummation(End of Temple Judaism), and that determined(Roman victory) shall be poured upon the desolate(Jewish rebels). - KJV

And he(Jesus) hath strengthened a covenant with many(Jesus' followers) -- one week, and in the midst of the week he(Jesus) causeth sacrifice and present to cease, and by the wing of abominations he(Jesus) is making desolate, even till the consummation(End of Temple Judaism), and that which is determined(Roman victory) is poured on the desolate one(Corporate Jewish Rebellion). - YLT

 

[for_his_glory]

In Daniel 9:24 there are six events mentioned which should be the consequences of the incarnation of our Lord: -

I. To finish (לכלא lechalle, to restrain), the transgression which was effected by the preaching of the Gospel, and pouring out of the Holy Ghost among men. [ At the cross Messiah fulfilled Genesis 3:15, the power of satan over man]

II. To make an end of sins; rather ולהתם חטאות ulehathem chataoth, "to make an end of sin-offerings," which our Lord did when he offered his spotless soul and body on the cross once for all. 1[Messiah was the final and only atonement for sin.]

III. To make reconciliation (ולכפר ulechapper, "to make atonement or expiation") for iniquity; which he did by the once offering up of himself.

IV. To bring in everlasting righteousness, צדק עלמים tsedek olamim, that is, "the righteousness, or righteous One, of ages;" that person who had been the object of the faith of mankind, and the subject of the predictions of the prophets through all the ages of the world. [Messiah's everlasting righteousness came to man that man may be saved.]

V. To seal up (ולחתם velachtom, "to finish or complete") the vision and prophecy; that is, to put an end to the necessity of any farther revelations, by completing the canon of Scripture, and fulfilling the prophecies which related to his person, sacrifice, and the glory that should follow. [Messiah fulfilled all OT prophecy about Him. Luke 24:44 and
Matthew 5:17]

VI. And to anoint the Most Holy, קדש קדשים kodesh kodashim, "the Holy of holies." משיח mashach, to anoint, (from which comes משיח mashiach, the Messiah, the anointed one), signifies in general, to consecrate or appoint to some special office. Here it means the consecration or appointment of our blessed Lord, the Holy One of Israel, to be the Prophet, Priest, and King of mankind.

Everything in [ ] is what I added.

http://biblehub.com/commentaries/clarke/daniel/9.htm

I believe that all six of these things were fulfilled by the Messiah in His live, death, and resurrection.

Shadows of the OT fulfilled in the NT and the final fulfillment when Christ returns for His Bride.

 

[for_his_glory]

Hi Glory. Thank you for post. However, I don't see Dan 9:27 anywhere in post. Where does Dan 9:27 fit it. - DRS81

Vs.27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

The 70th seven began with Christ baptism in AD 29 and three years later at the end of the first half of the 70th seven sacrifices and offering ceased because Christ hung on the cross as he was the final sacrifice that fulfilled the law. From the giving of the law in 458BC when Ezra went to establish the law, or to rebuild the Spiritual city right up to the cross were the first 69 sevens. The 70th seven is from the time of the cross until Jesus comes and gathers his bride as they prepare to stand in the Holy place until the overspreading of abominations he will make desolate, or make an end to all that would not repent and make Christ their Lord and Savior.

 

[Deborah13]

Shadows of the OT fulfilled in the NT and the final fulfillment when Christ returns for His Bride.

I don't understand what you are saying by the final fulfillment of this prophecy is when He returns.
Where does this fit into the six things listed that must be filled in the 70 weeks. Can you look at the list I posted and tell me where you see that, please.
Thanks

 

[DRS81]

The 70th seven is from the time of the cross until Jesus comes and gathers his bride.

Hi Glory. Your above statement is a span of 2,000 years. The 70th week is only seven years.

 

[Sinthesis]

The 70th seven began with Christ baptism in AD 29 and three years later at the end of the first half of the 70th seven sacrifices and offering ceased because Christ hung on the cross as he was the final sacrifice that fulfilled the law. From the giving of the law in 458BC when Ezra went to establish the law, or to rebuild the Spiritual city right up to the cross were the first 69 sevens. The 70th seven is from the time of the cross until Jesus comes and gathers his bride as they prepare to stand in the Holy place until the overspreading of abominations he will make desolate, or make an end to all that would not repent and make Christ their Lord and Savior.

This paragraph of yours is contradictory. It says that the cross was in the 69th week and also the 70th week. Do you believe the 70th week started at the baptism or the cross?

 

[for_his_glory]

Hi Glory. Your above statement is a span of 2,000 years. The 70th week is only seven years.

We have been in the 70 weeks of years since that of Christ birth, death and resurrection and continue in it until the return of Christ. The 69th week ended in Malachi chapter 4 as God was silent for 400 years between Malachi and Matthew because of the transgressions made against God by His people. The 70th week started in Matthew when God sent his prophet John the baptist as a forerunner of Christ as he preached in the wilderness of Judaea saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand, Matthew 3:1,2, and the 70th week will end when Christ returns to make an end of all the abominations that cause desolation or another way of saying it, will make an end of all sin that is in the world.