One's belief, hearing and faith are not what saves them. Christ is the Saviour so He alone does the saving.
Everything else pertaining to salvation, comes to those saved from that.
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
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God's Great Free Gift of Salvation for Everyone
- Thread starter Robert Pate
- Start date
Everything else pertaining to salvation, comes to those saved from that.
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
Roger, there are so many contradictions, biblically, in the reformed faith, that I wouldn't know where to start.
YOU say faith is a work.
Paul says it's a gift.
How many times must I post the verses?
Could you please explain how you understand them?
Ephesians 2:8-9
8For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
9not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Romans 11:6
6But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works, otherwise grace is no longer grace.
Titus 3:5
5He saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,
Galatians 2:16
16Yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified.
How could you possibly say that faith or belief is a work?
to be cont'd
Oh my! If we try to produce it, it is our work, if we receive it, it is a gift. That's not hard to understand, is it?
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
rogerg
cont'd
This was you statement in post 582
True faith is not only a work, but should someone have it, was by God's work alone
[Jhn 6:28-29 KJV]
28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
********************************************************************************
John 6:28-29 NASB
26Jesus answered them and said, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate of the loaves and were filled.
27“Do not work for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you, for on Him the Father, God, has set His seal.”
The Son of Man will give us the food...we are not to work for it.
28Therefore they said to Him, “What shall we do, so that we may work the works of God?”
29Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent.”
We are not to work....but to believe in Jesus.
Other religions of the world require works,
the Christian religion does not.
It please God that we believe for our salvation, not that we work for it.
The crowd asked Jesus what they should do to do GOD'S WORKS.
He replied ... The only "work" God wants you to do is to believe.
This does not mean that believing is a work,,,
but Jesus was telling the crowd that there is no work they could do to be saved...
but only to believe.
cont'd
This was you statement in post 582
True faith is not only a work, but should someone have it, was by God's work alone
[Jhn 6:28-29 KJV]
28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
********************************************************************************
John 6:28-29 NASB
26Jesus answered them and said, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate of the loaves and were filled.
27“Do not work for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you, for on Him the Father, God, has set His seal.”
The Son of Man will give us the food...we are not to work for it.
28Therefore they said to Him, “What shall we do, so that we may work the works of God?”
29Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent.”
We are not to work....but to believe in Jesus.
Other religions of the world require works,
the Christian religion does not.
It please God that we believe for our salvation, not that we work for it.
The crowd asked Jesus what they should do to do GOD'S WORKS.
He replied ... The only "work" God wants you to do is to believe.
This does not mean that believing is a work,,,
but Jesus was telling the crowd that there is no work they could do to be saved...
but only to believe.
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
My goodness I, that post certainly does reply.
God destroyed the earth because man had become so depraved...
He saved those that were righteous.
But it was a just act.
EVERYONE died except the right with God.
Which is very different than saying that it is just
for God to save some and abandon the rest.
One method is just
and one is not.
You may say that God can do whatever He will....
and indeed He can. God is sovereign.
But He is also just,
and you cannot detach God from His very nature...which is just.
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
But we ALL believe faith is a gift.
So why do you say it's a work?
How do we TRY TO PRODUCT faith?
Whoever said we produce it?
I really am beginning to think you don't even read my posts....
No once again.God set his saving love upon them while they were yet sinners.
I had said before you cannot mix the terms as if they are interchangable.
He knows those elected intimately.
Adam knew Eve, and she conceived,
Adam knew Eve again, and she conceived again
Joseph knew not Mary until after the birth of Jesus.
All men are depraved.
You said He is not willing that any perish as you misused 2 Pet.:3: 9 multitudes perished in the flood.God was very willing that they perished.
IT was never Gods design to save every person
The theology you promote has no answer, where the biblical theology is consistent
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
Pretty funny Iconoclast.
You have to go to the flood.when calvinism is swimming in inconsistencies.
And you never did understand my post, was it
553???
What flood?
I said that biblical history begins with Abraham.
I guess you think that snakes talk too.
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
Je ne sai pas what you're talking about.
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
Why don't you explain to us, instead, how God could be just If He sends SOME AND NOT ALL off to hell if we are ALL BORN DEPRAVED and deserving of hell.
And, of course, no calvinist has ever answered my quote of Calvin's....
Book 3
Chapter 24
Paragraph 8.....
there are two species of calling: for there is an universal call, by which God, through the external preaching of the word, invites all men alike, even those for whom he designs the call to be a savor of death, and the ground of a severer condemnation. Besides this there is a special call which, for the most part, God bestows on believers only, when by the internal illumination of the Spirit he causes the word preached to take deep root in their hearts. Sometimes, however, he communicates it also to those whom he enlightens only for a time, and whom afterwards, in just punishment for their ingratitude, he abandons and smites with greater blindness.
Your posts are too illogical/fragmented for me to reply to. Maybe tomorrow after I'm rested.
I thought you were joking or attempting to Joke.
I believe the bible as written...so did Jesus.
If you do not believe the bible as God breathed truth,inspired and inerrant, you will never come to truth.
Robert Pate
Member
You must have graduated from heresy college.
Our faith in Christ and his Gospel makes the Gospel ours.
"So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God" (which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17. Also Ephesians 1:13.
Did you actually read what you included? According to the translation YOU chose, it says
" This is the WORK of God, that you believe...". I tried but I just can't make it any clearer
than that - that should someone believe they do so only by God's work - believing is from God, period. Perhaps
you didn't see the "that you believe" part?
Relative to that, none of what you wrote makes any senses - you sound like you are talking about a different verse.
You'd be far better off not trying to twist what has already been written into what you'd like it to say.
Last edited:
So, by that you're saying that you eliminate, and therefore do not have a Saviour. In that case,
which of us graduated from heresy college? You've missed the entire point and basis of the Bible
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
This made me laugh.
YOU think I'M illogical.
LOL
How many times have I said calvinism is illogical?
You're just copying me because of your great respect for my opinion!
Yes, you're on to me, my secret is outThis made me laugh.
YOU think I'M illogical.
LOL
How many times have I said calvinism is illogical?
You're just copying me because of your great respect for my opinion!
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
No.
I'm not at my computer. Uffa.
The crowd asked how they could do the work of God.
Jesus answered THIS IS THE WORK OF GOD....
IOW This Is What God Wants You To Do...
BELIEVE IN JESUS.
If it's the way YOU understand it,
It would mean the crowd was acting like God.
It's English Roger.
Read it again please.
That simply is NOT what the verse says, and it won't no matter how many times you try to force it to.
It does not/cannot support your interpretation. It's really astounding you would persist in it - we all can read what it says: " that ye believe". See the "that"?
Look, Jesus was both correcting and teaching within the same verse - I think that's where you're getting confused:
1) He was teaching that contrary to their understanding there was no work of God they could do - none. And,
2) That regarding salvation, God alone accomplishes all work, to include their receiving of true faith.