God's Great Free Gift of Salvation for Everyone

[gordon777]

I am afraid not. We are still here on this earth in our unredeemed Adamic bodies, Romans 8:23. Our old unredeemed adamic bodies cannot be inhilated by the works of the law. Christians have two natures, the nature of Adam and the nature of Christ. These two natures are in conflict with each other.

Speaking of redemption. Christ gave Himself for us, to redeem us FROM ALL INIQUITY.

Purifying to Himself a people, zealous of good works. ( not iniquity, which they are redeemed from.)

As we know we were not redeemed with corruptible things, but with the precious blood of Christ without spot. ( by believing that God raised Him up from the dead.)

Seeing we purified our souls in obeying the truth ( not lies of hurting others and being self seeking either) through sincere love of the brothers ( as Christ to lay HIs life down for us.) with a pure heart, to be found of Him blameless and without spot....




Titus 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

1 Peter 1:18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;
19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

1 Peter 1:20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.

1 Peter 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

2 Peter 3:14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.

 

[gordon777]

The vessel doesn't matter.
Who is "at the wheel"?
Your body can't make you sin, as it is at the behest of your mind.
Hopefully, the new mind of the new creature.
The new creature has no lingering influences from that which has been killed with Christ.
Are you a new creature?

To the whole of the scriptures, from the old testament to the new testament, the vessel matters.




Proverbs 25:4 Take away the dross from the silver, and there shall come forth a vessel for the finer.

Isaiah 48:10 Behold, I have refined thee, but not with silver; I have chosen thee in the furnace of affliction.

Jeremiah 18:4 And the vessel that he made of clay was marred in the hand of the potter: so he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it.

Matthew 13:48 Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away.

1 Thessalonians 4:4 That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour;
5 Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God:
6 That no man go beyond and defraud his brother in any matter: because that the Lord is the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified.
7 For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness.
8 He therefore that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God, who hath also given unto us his holy Spirit.

2 Timothy 2:21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.



The vessel is purified through faith in the truth.

It is made filthy again by turning to lies.

The warning is to stand fast and hold, to continue to know sanctification o the spirit through belief in the truth. ( self seeking is a lie.)




2 Thessalonians 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

2 Thessalonians 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

2 Thessalonians 2:13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

 

[Robert Pate]

To the whole of the scriptures, from the old testament to the new testament, the vessel matters.




Proverbs 25:4 Take away the dross from the silver, and there shall come forth a vessel for the finer.

Isaiah 48:10 Behold, I have refined thee, but not with silver; I have chosen thee in the furnace of affliction.

Jeremiah 18:4 And the vessel that he made of clay was marred in the hand of the potter: so he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it.

Matthew 13:48 Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away.

1 Thessalonians 4:4 That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour;
5 Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God:
6 That no man go beyond and defraud his brother in any matter: because that the Lord is the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified.
7 For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness.
8 He therefore that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God, who hath also given unto us his holy Spirit.

2 Timothy 2:21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.



The vessel is purified through faith in the truth.

It is made filthy again by turning to lies.

The warning is to stand fast and hold, to continue to know sanctification o the spirit through belief in the truth. ( self seeking is a lie.)




2 Thessalonians 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

2 Thessalonians 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

2 Thessalonians 2:13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

Problem is that our old Adamic nature is corrupt. Paul struggled with his old Adamic nature, just like we do, Romans 7:7-25.

The only strength that we have is knowing that Jesus crucified the old Adam so that the body of sin might be destroyed, Romans 6:6. If you can embrace that and believe it, you will be a stronger Christian.

 

[Cooper]

Sin is in man, unbelief is in man.

God is faith.

You have no comparison.



Romans 3:22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Romans 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

That is what I said, Jesus is sinless.
.

 

[Hopeful]

That is the most awful, twisted, convoluted, anti-Christ statement I have ever heard.

It sure is.

Jesus is sinless, the sin is mine, as are all my thoughts and actions which are all attributable to my free-will. I am a work in progress.

But you are in Christ?
It is written that there is no sin in Christ, (1John 1:5), so if you have sin in you, you are not in Christ.

Then people say there is no freewill in sinful man, when in reality some choose Christ and others choose the opposer.

Agreed.
We all choose whom we will serve.

Jesus said no man can serve two masters. I am a generally a good servant while my master is faultless. I wonder who others serve?

Shouldn't you be asking who you serve?
You should be just like your master.
It is written..."He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked." (1 John 2:6)
Jesus said whoever commits sin is the servant of sin. (John 8:34)
The truth can make you free. (John 8:32)

 

[Hopeful]

There is no doubt in Christ, doubt can be in us.

Doubt about what?
Doubt is the opposite of belief.

 

[Hopeful]

Pride is sin, selfishness is sin, as it is not as Christ who sought only for the wealth of others.
Sin always has been love for ones self, and now it seems the most popular doctrine is only discussing loving your own selves
Psalm 59:12 For the sin of their mouth and the words of their lips let them even be taken in their pride: and for cursing and lying which they speak.
1 Corinthians 10:24 Let no man seek his own, but every man another's wealth.
2 Corinthians 8:8 I speak not by commandment, but by occasion of the forwardness of others, and to prove the sincerity of your love.
9 For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich.
2 Timothy 3:2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,

That was not an answer to my question.

 

[Hopeful]

Sin is unbelief, that is why anyone can be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin ( of unbelief)

Sin is a manifestation of unbelief.

 

[Hopeful]

Sin is in man, unbelief is in man.

God is faith.

You have no comparison.

That doesn't make any sense.

 

[GodsGrace]

The "man" in question who needs forgiveness is the converting man.
That forgiveness is supplied after his repentance from sin and his baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins.
Peter stated this in Acts 2;38.
The only way any more sin would occur is if the repentance from sin was a lie to God.

How do you understand Acts 2:38?
38Peter said to them, “Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.


It seems to me that we are to repent (turn away from sin and turn toward God),
I believe that if we died at this very moment, we would be saved.
Then we are baptized for the forgiveness of sins and to receive the Holy Spirit.

Do you believe we're not saved until baptism?
Some turn to God and then have to study in their choice of church before they can be baptized.
When we turn to God we are justified...

Romans 5:9
9Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God.

Galatians 2:16
16Yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified.

 

[Hopeful]

That is what I said, Jesus is sinless.

So sinners are not in Jesus.
I agree.

 

[Hopeful]

To the whole of the scriptures, from the old testament to the new testament, the vessel matters.

Not in the context I was using it in.

 

[GodsGrace]

Peter knows Christ has the words of eternal life, to believe and be sure that Christ is the Son of the living God.

After that, what a shock for Christ to bow down to wash Peters feet. peter reacts as if there is a test going on, and declares the Lord will never wash his feet.

Jesus reassures Peter, ho it is necessary, to have part with Christ. peter immediately answers, he wants to be washed more, not his feet only, but his hands and his head also.



John 6:67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?
68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.
69 And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.

John 13:6 Then cometh he to Simon Peter: and Peter saith unto him, Lord, dost thou wash my feet?
7 Jesus answered and said unto him, What I do thou knowest not now; but thou shalt know hereafter.
8 Peter saith unto him, Thou shalt never wash my feet. Jesus answered him, If I wash thee not, thou hast no part with me.
9 Simon Peter saith unto him, Lord, not my feet only, but also my hands and my head.
10 Jesus saith to him, He that is washed needeth not save to wash his feet, but is clean every whit: and ye are clean, but not all.

Good.
I love John 6:68
Lord, to whom shall we go? Only you have the words of eternal life.

 

[Cooper]

It sure is.

But you are in Christ?
It is written that there is no sin in Christ, (1John 1:5), so if you have sin in you, you are not in Christ.

Agreed.
We all choose whom we will serve.

Shouldn't you be asking who you serve?
You should be just like your master.
It is written..."He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked." (1 John 2:6)
Jesus said whoever commits sin is the servant of sin. (John 8:34)
The truth can make you free. (John 8:32)

It is the Father who is in Christ.
.

 

[Hopeful]

How do you understand Acts 2:38?
38Peter said to them, “Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
It seems to me that we are to repent (turn away from sin and turn toward God),
I believe that if we died at this very moment, we would be saved.

I think the thief on the cross is proof of that.

Then we are baptized for the forgiveness of sins and to receive the Holy Spirit.

I truly feel that the gift of the Holy Ghost is in return for a true turn from sin, not for the baptism.
As repentance from sin and water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins are both done at or near the same time, it doesn't really matter.
Another thing happening at baptism is the cleansing of the "temple" before the residency of the Holy Ghost.

Do you believe we're not saved until baptism?
Some turn to God and then have to study in their choice of church before they can be baptized.
When we turn to God we are justified...

It is His blood that sanctifies and justifies us.
That blood is applied when we are "immersed" into Christ (and into His death and burial)...at water baptism.

Romans 5:9
9Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God.
Galatians 2:16
16Yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified.

Amen to that.

 

[Cooper]

Sin is a manifestation of unbelief.

King David sinned while believing in God, as have many more.
.

 

[Hopeful]

It is the Father who is in Christ.
.

So are all those who have been baptized into Him.
We are one.

 

[GodsGrace]

It means as said. If people do not hear ( the preaching of the cross/the Gospel) they are bound. If anyone hears, what the Apostles heard( from Christ) they are loosed on earth and in Heaven.

Sin is unbelief in Jesus Christ ( the Word.)




John 8:24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

Matthew 18:17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.
18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

John 20:23 Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

Is binding different than forgiving sins?

John 20:20-23
20As he spoke, he showed them the wounds in his hands and his side. They were filled with joy when they saw the Lord!
21Again he said, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, so I am sending you.”
22Then he breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit.
23If you forgive anyone’s sins, they are forgiven. If you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven.”

Jesus had the power to forgive sins.
In John 20 He is passing this authority on to the Apostles...
"As the Father has sent Me, so I am sending you",
verse 23 is clear that Jesus is speaking of forgiving sins.

I believe Matthew 16:19 is speaking of something totally different.
"I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”

To bind means to forbid (by a church authority, like the Pharisees).
To loose means to permit.

 

[Hopeful]

King David sinned while believing in God, as have many more.
.

Find a NT example.
The folks of the OT didn't have the ability to crucify the flesh with the affections and lusts. (Gal 5:24)
They had to walk in the flesh, whereas we can now walk in the Spirit.
Thanks be to God !

 

[GodsGrace]

I think the thief on the cross is proof of that.

I truly feel that the gift of the Holy Ghost is in return for a true turn from sin, not for the baptism.
As repentance from sin and water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins are both done at or near the same time, it doesn't really matter.
Another thing happening at baptism is the cleansing of the "temple" before the residency of the Holy Ghost.

It is His blood that sanctifies and justifies us.
That blood is applied when we are "immersed" into Christ (and into His death and burial)...at water baptism.

Amen to that.

Starting on baptism will change the thread too much.
Do you see a difference between justification and sanctification?