OK, good, but why quote scriptures that have NOTHING to do with salvation but have ONLY to do with our post-salvation walk?
You are viewing salvation as merely forensic, as something abstract. Thus you believe that one can be saved and yet still be engaged in vile behaviour.
Say it is not so!
You would have a serial killer saved and killing less and less in his post salvation walk correct?
Say it is not so. When would the serial killer have to stop murdering? When does the porn watcher have to stop watching porn? When does the child molester have to stop molesting? You must believe that they don't have to because they get saved in their sins.
Say it is not so and address this point.
Rom 2:6 goes with Rom 2:5, But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath , when his righteous judgement will be revealed. 6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.â€
Romans 2:7 stands on it's own, verses 8 & 9 reiterate verses 5 & 6, and verse 10 reiterates verse 7. Paul had a habit of writing this way. CONTEXT is always important when reading and quoting scripture.
There you go trying to separate Rom 2:7 from the passage. It does not stand on its own, Paul is teaching about how God is going to render to everyone according to their deeds then he gives the examples of the righteous and the unrighteous.
You twist it around and then call it context? That is quite a feat of mental gymnastics. Why not just accept it for what it plainly says?
Reality is what is real and mental games do not change reality. We either align our opinions with reality as it is presented to us or we deceive ourselves. You are just deceiving yourself by trying to pull Rom 2:7 out of that passage by saying it "stands alone."
2 Thess 1:8 reads, He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. Don't know what version you use but it's a little ad-libbed.
Yes we ALL will appear at the judgement seat. Rev 20:12-13, 15; And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done... Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.
I think it's pretty clear that those in the Book of Life, receive Eternal Life, and those in the other books received judgement and eternal damnation based on what they had done ,and what was recorded in the other books.
How does any of that negate all men being judged according to their deeds? You are tap dancing.
Read the warning to the churches in Revelation 2 and 3 for God sure saw their works and called upon most of those churches to repent.
What we do matters.
Gal 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for
whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
Gal 6:8 For
he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.
Gal 6:9
And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.
Well as I HAVE supplied scripture, from the Bible, to that assertion and you have not, then I would suggest your statement here is personal opinion. However if you can supply scripture to support your assertion, then please feel free to share it with ALL of us.
Go reread all my posts, I have supplied abundant scripture.
Again, you mix up the act of salvation with the acts of walking in Christ. Your opening two statements even contradict this statement. What is it?
The words you use here indicate our WALK in Jesus, NOT salvation.
In response to...
You claimed that the deeds of the body have nothing to do with salvation when clearly there are scriptures which speak of "striving," "working together with God, "working fully to accomplish," of course all in the context of the leading of the grace of God.
As I mentioned earlier you incorrectly view salvation as some abstract package that you receive. The Bible teaches that salvation is a present state where one has been freed from the bondage and condemnation of sin. A person who is saved is not yielding to the passions and desires of their flesh and being drawn into sin. They have ceased from sin exactly a 1Pet 4:1-2 clearly states.
I have already dealt with those verses and properly exegeted them. Again you opine instead of exegeting.
Let's take a look shall we.
You misunderstand digger but I will try to clarify for you.
1 John 2:1-2
My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have an advocate with the Father—Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. 2 He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.
This confirms what he said earlier in 1 John 1:8-10. I would suggest you use a modern English version to help further with the proper vernacular of this part of scripture. ! John 5:18 states, We know that anyone born of God does not continue to sin; the One who was born of God keeps them safe, and the evil one cannot harm them. Doesn't quite convey the same message, does it?
1Joh 2:1 uses the word IF which means sin is not the forgone conclusion. You originally posted 1Joh 1:8 as evidence that sin IS a forgone conclusion and that those who say that they have ceased from sin are liars.
The sin John is referring to in 1Joh 2:1 is non-presumptuous sin. We know that because in 1Joh 3 he writes...
1Jn 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
1Jn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
1Jn 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.
The children of God are made manifest to the world by their deeds. They are not producing the fruit of sin in their lives.
The children of God are slaves to righteousness.
Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Rom 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
A servant of sin is someone who yields to it as Paul clearly states in Rom 6:16.
Sin is yielded to in this fashion.
Jas 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
Jas 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
Those that are Christ's do not sin in this fashion because they have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.
Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Thus they don't yield their members to unrighteousness.
Rom 6:12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
Rom 6:13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
Yet you teach the opposite because you used 1Joh 1:8 to refute my contention that the sins of the flesh stop. You used 1Joh 1:8 to imply that the sin cannot stop and that I was a liar.
Sorry, I guess I missed those. Your posts tend to get a little onerous. Maybe you should ask me again? I'd be more than happy to answer them.
Does a serial killer have to stop murdering people before God will grant him forgiveness?
Does a child molester have to stop molesting children before God will grant them forgiveness?
Does an individual have to forsake his viewing of porn before God will forgive them?
