Power over sin by the Spirit of Grace

[George Muller]

What some believers fail to see or understand that it is the "free-gift" of righteousness and the power of that righteousness that overcomes the "flesh". So until one "receives the abundance of grace and free-gift of righteousness" and walks in that justified "spiritual" condition. They cannot be "in the Spirit" nor do they have real power over the sin that dwells in the flesh. Being "saved" is not a event it is a condition of the spirit that one must live in. The just shall "live" by faith.

Ro 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

Ro 5:17 For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)

Being saved-justified is not a one time act, it is a condition and position of being "In Christ" To be "In Christ" is to be In Gods Righteousness.

"that I might be found "In HIM" not having my own righteousness.

Now one cannot biblically be "in the Spirit" unless they are in Gods Righteousness. A person seeking to justify themselves by any part of the law, are "carnal" even though they may be born-again and have the Spirit, they are in the flesh, and they cannot inherit the Kingdom of God.

Ga 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

Here Paul makes this point very clear, that as one receives Christ Jesus, so walk ye in Him. A believer receives by faith the Spirit and Gods righteousness. To walk in the Spirit one must walk in faith of Gods Righteousness. This is the Power over sin, the ONLY POWER. The Spirit is the ONLY source of righteousness.

 

[JLB]

What some believers fail to see or understand that it is the "free-gift" of righteousness and the power of that righteousness that overcomes the "flesh".

What some believers fail to see is what the scriptures actually say.

21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him. 2 Corinthians 5:21

Not that we have already been made the righteousness, but that we might become the the righteousness.

as it is written -

7 Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. 1 John 3:7


JLB

 

[George Muller]

What some believers fail to see or understand that it is the "free-gift" of righteousness and the power of that righteousness that overcomes the "flesh".

What some believers fail to see is what the scriptures actually say.

21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him. 2 Corinthians 5:21

Not that we have already been made the righteousness, but that we might become the the righteousness.

as it is written -

7 Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. 1 John 3:7


JLB

2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

In fact the word "might" is not in the scriptures, this is word added in translation. But even if one could twist this scripture in some way, the righteousness of faith is so well established at all points in the New Testament, that one has to reject the New Testament and the gospel altogether to make such an unbiblical statement.

"for it would have been better had they never known the way of righteousness" Like a dog to its vomit many reject the righteousness of faith, these are most pitiful of people, for they are in willing sin against the Spirit of Grace. "free-will" will have its reward, and weeping and the howling of those who reject grace and the righteousness of faith, will be a terrible thing, but just.

Ro 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
Ro 3:22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:


And this is the righteousness to which John is speaking; The righteousness of faith, in the Spirit

1Jo 3:4 ¶ Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
9

Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Those who are under law, are sinners and are in the bondage of sin, they are in the flesh and cannot inherit the Kingdom of God.

 

[George Muller]

Ro 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
Ro 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
Ro 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Ro 4:6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,
Ro 4:9 ¶ Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness.
Ro 4:11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:
Ro 4:13 For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.
Ro 4:22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.
Ro 5:17 For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)

I could go on and on....

 

[JLB]

2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him. In fact the word "might" is not in the scriptures, this is word added in translation. But even if one could twist this scripture in some way, the righteousness of faith is so well established at all points in the New Testament, that one has to reject the gospel to make such an unbiblical statement.

You claim to remove wording from the text, while at the same time accuse those who don't add or take away from God's word as twisting and making unbiblical statements!

That is truly backwards..

Here is what the scripture says -

21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

The idea being conveyed here is a "process of becoming".

A process of transformation.

A process of conforming to the image of the Son of God.

Let's look at other scriptures that validate this idea of the process of becoming righteous.

12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: John 1:12

We have as believers, the right or the power to become sons of God.

This denotes a process of becoming.

A process of being conformed to the Image of God's Son.

2 And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God. Romans 12:2

There is a process of transformation.

We are not full stature sons on the day we were born again.

11 And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, 12 for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, 13 till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; 14 that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, Ephesians 4:11

As we look at the New Testament and what it teaches us concerning these things, we will understand what John said -

Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous.

Unbiblical doctrines are employed by those who would add to or take away from God's word.

This is a common practice by those, as Paul said, who carry out this work by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, Ephesians 4:14

He who practices righteousness is righteous.


JLB

 

[George Muller]

You claim to remove wording from the text, while at the same time accuse those who don't add or take away from God's word as twisting and making unbiblical statements!

That is truly backwards..

Here is what the scripture says -

21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

The idea being conveyed here is a "process of becoming".

No, I have the Greek and "might" is not there, it is a word added in translation. Also the righteousness of faith is so well established in the New Testament (as I have shown in part) that any point you "think" you are making as to how this verse is read is just a vain and meaningless point.

2Co 5:21 For <gar> he hath made <poieo> him to be sin <hamartia> for <huper> us, <hemon> who <ho> knew <ginosko> no <me> sin; <hamartia> that <hina> we <hemeis> might be made <ginomai> the righteousness <dikaiosune> of God <theos> in <en> him. <autos>

If there is any conditional element of this word is it is based on the need that one must have "faith" to be made righteous.

For "in Him" we have no sin, and we cannot sin.

 

[George Muller]

A process of conforming to the image of the Son of God.

Let's look at other scriptures that validate this idea of the process of becoming righteous.

12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: John 1:12

We have as believers, the right or the power to become sons of God.

This denotes a process of becoming.

The process is through the righteousness of faith, and confidence in Gods righteousness, by the Spirit.

2Co 3:9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.
11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.
2Co 3:14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.
15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.
17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.
18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

Yes there is a process but it works through the believer who has Gods Righteousness by faith.

 

[JLB]

You claim to remove wording from the text, while at the same time accuse those who don't add or take away from God's word as twisting and making unbiblical statements!

That is truly backwards..

Here is what the scripture says -

21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

The idea being conveyed here is a "process of becoming".

No, I have the Greek and "might" is not there, it is a word added in translation. Also the righteousness of faith is so well established in the New Testament (as I have shown in part) that any point you "think" you are making as to how this verse is read is just a vain and meaningless point.

Whatever "Greek" you think you have, from whatever source it came from, such as those that translated the New World Translation, that the Jehovah's witness's have their bible translation.

Look at all the scriptures in the New Testament that I posted, that validate the idea of BECOMING transformed into His Image.

17 For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith; as it is written, "The just shall live by faith."Romans 1:17

and again -

till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; Ephesians 4:13


Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous.


JLB

 

[JLB]

Yes there is a process but it works through the believer who has Gods Righteousness by faith.

I agree with this statement.

 

[George Muller]

Whatever "Greek" you think you have, from whatever source it came from, such as those that translated the New World Translation, that the Jehovah's witness's have their bible translation.

What do you mean JLB, there is no debate about the Greek Word in this passage. We have the sure Greek reading and no biblical or Greek scholar has any issue as to the Greek words used in this passage. I am not speaking of a "translation" that is where the word "might" comes in, in the translation into English, but as I have said the issue of Gods righteousness unto the believer is not dependent upon this single scripture, but is shown in absolute and clear terms throughout the New Testament. So you only make a debate about a single translation of one scripture, when the whole of Gods Word defeats your point altogether. So either you are just unable to have a honest discussion or you are unwilling to surrender your own will to the truth of scripture, either way you are in great error and are in danger of being judged with the wicked and unrighteous of the world.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

You claim to remove wording from the text, while at the same time accuse those who don't add or take away from God's word as twisting and making unbiblical statements!

That is truly backwards..

Here is what the scripture says -

21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

The idea being conveyed here is a "process of becoming".

No, I have the Greek and "might" is not there, it is a word added in translation. Also the righteousness of faith is so well established in the New Testament (as I have shown in part) that any point you "think" you are making as to how this verse is read is just a vain and meaningless point.

2Co 5:21 For <gar> he hath made <poieo> him to be sin <hamartia> for <huper> us, <hemon> who <ho> knew <ginosko> no <me> sin; <hamartia> that <hina> we <hemeis> might be made <ginomai> the righteousness <dikaiosune> of God <theos> in <en> him. <autos>

If there is any conditional element of this word is it is based on the need that one must have "faith" to be made righteous.

For "in Him" we have no sin, and we cannot sin.

...Legally speaking.

The blood of Christ keeps us legally righteous and blameless before God in heaven. Meanwhile, the Spirit of God is working in us an ever-increasing behavioral righteousness here on earth (2 Peter 1:8 NASB).

Anyone who thinks the righteousness of Christ by faith means literally being perfectly righteous here on earth...well,...this is what John says about that:

"8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. " (1 John 1:8 NASB)

 

[TOG]

A person seeking to justify themselves by any part of the law, are "carnal" even though they may be born-again and have the Spirit, they are in the flesh, and they cannot inherit the Kingdom of God.

You may find this hard to believe, but I agree with you on this. What I would like to know from you is whether you you believe it is possible to obey God's commandments, not to justify ourselves, but because we love God and want to do His will.

 

[JLB]

You claim to remove wording from the text, while at the same time accuse those who don't add or take away from God's word as twisting and making unbiblical statements!

That is truly backwards..

Here is what the scripture says -

21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

The idea being conveyed here is a "process of becoming".

No, I have the Greek and "might" is not there, it is a word added in translation. Also the righteousness of faith is so well established in the New Testament (as I have shown in part) that any point you "think" you are making as to how this verse is read is just a vain and meaningless point.

2Co 5:21 For <gar> he hath made <poieo> him to be sin <hamartia> for <huper> us, <hemon> who <ho> knew <ginosko> no <me> sin; <hamartia> that <hina> we <hemeis> might be made <ginomai> the righteousness <dikaiosune> of God <theos> in <en> him. <autos>

If there is any conditional element of this word is it is based on the need that one must have "faith" to be made righteous.

For "in Him" we have no sin, and we cannot sin.

...Legally speaking.

The blood of Christ keeps us legally righteous and blameless before God in heaven. Meanwhile, the Spirit of God is working in us an ever-increasing behavioral righteousness here on earth (2 Peter 1:8 NASB).

Anyone who thinks the righteousness of Christ by faith means literally being perfectly righteous here on earth...well,...this is what John says about that:

"8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. " (1 John 1:8 NASB)

Only a double naught spy could know these things!


JLB

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Whatever "Greek" you think you have, from whatever source it came from, such as those that translated the New World Translation, that the Jehovah's witness's have their bible translation.

What do you mean JLB, there is no debate about the Greek Word in this passage. We have the sure Greek reading and no biblical or Greek scholar has any issue as to the Greek words used in this passage. I am not speaking of a "translation" that is where the word "might" comes in, in the translation into English, but as I have said the issue of Gods righteousness unto the believer is not dependent upon this single scripture, but is shown in absolute and clear terms throughout the New Testament. So you only make a debate about a single translation of one scripture, when the whole of Gods Word defeats your point altogether. So either you are just unable to have a honest discussion or you are unwilling to surrender your own will to the truth of scripture, either way you are in great error and are in danger of being judged with the wicked and unrighteous of the world.

I'm not a prophet, but I see a padlock on this thread coming soon.

STOP JUDGING POSTERS!

 

[Jethro Bodine]

You claim to remove wording from the text, while at the same time accuse those who don't add or take away from God's word as twisting and making unbiblical statements!

That is truly backwards..

Here is what the scripture says -

21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

The idea being conveyed here is a "process of becoming".

No, I have the Greek and "might" is not there, it is a word added in translation. Also the righteousness of faith is so well established in the New Testament (as I have shown in part) that any point you "think" you are making as to how this verse is read is just a vain and meaningless point.

2Co 5:21 For <gar> he hath made <poieo> him to be sin <hamartia> for <huper> us, <hemon> who <ho> knew <ginosko> no <me> sin; <hamartia> that <hina> we <hemeis> might be made <ginomai> the righteousness <dikaiosune> of God <theos> in <en> him. <autos>

If there is any conditional element of this word is it is based on the need that one must have "faith" to be made righteous.

For "in Him" we have no sin, and we cannot sin.

...Legally speaking.

The blood of Christ keeps us legally righteous and blameless before God in heaven. Meanwhile, the Spirit of God is working in us an ever-increasing behavioral righteousness here on earth (2 Peter 1:8 NASB).

Anyone who thinks the righteousness of Christ by faith means literally being perfectly righteous here on earth...well,...this is what John says about that:

"8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. " (1 John 1:8 NASB)

Only a double naught spy could know these things!


JLB

(Aw, shucks.)

Or one who reads their Bible without the blinders of an indoctrination.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blinders

 

[Jethro Bodine]

A person seeking to justify themselves by any part of the law, are "carnal" even though they may be born-again and have the Spirit, they are in the flesh, and they cannot inherit the Kingdom of God.

You may find this hard to believe, but I agree with you on this. What I would like to know from you is whether you you believe it is possible to obey God's commandments, not to justify ourselves, but because we love God and want to do His will.

You mean keeping God's commandments doesn't always mean someone is trying to be justified by that effort? And that faith working through love IS keeping God's commandments?

Are you sure?

 

[George Muller]

A person seeking to justify themselves by any part of the law, are "carnal" even though they may be born-again and have the Spirit, they are in the flesh, and they cannot inherit the Kingdom of God.

You may find this hard to believe, but I agree with you on this. What I would like to know from you is whether you you believe it is possible to obey God's commandments, not to justify ourselves, but because we love God and want to do His will.

Yes we "fulfill" all the law demanded through "love" as it is written. No one walking in the Spirit will intentionally break any commandment of God, but a believer is not judged by the law of Moses. Our Law is the "royal law" love and that is the Commandment of Christ. So the simplicity of Christ is allowing the Spirit of God to work through us, to love is to keep all that God demands. In love ALL the law is fulfilled. ALL is the issue when we consider legalist always "break" the law into parts and are always in transgression of the law, but through the Spirit and Love we are able to keep it all, not by the "letter" but by the Spirit. So not by looking to rules, but by living a life of faith and love from the heart, as the Spirit gives us the ability.

 

[reba]

We talk of power over sin and how we are righteous yet the squabbles continue and the Pharisee side of us jumps out. What a shame we will not see ourselves ...... Praise the Lord for His Grace

 

[JLB]

no biblical or Greek scholar has any issue as to the Greek words used in this passage.

This would mean that you yourself personally know all the Greek scholars that have ever read this passage.

Not!!

So you only make a debate about a single translation of one scripture, when the whole of Gods Word defeats your point altogether.

I quote many scriptures that teach us that righteousness is of faith.

He takes us from faith to faith.

Faith is the evidence of things NOT SEEN.

Faith is the substance of things HOPED FOR.

Faith is not the reality of the thing hoped for.

The righteousness that is of faith, is the righteousness that is hoped for.

The full reality of the righteousness that Jesus Christ walked in on this earth, is what we are hoping to be conformed to.


JLB

 

[George Muller]

You claim to remove wording from the text, while at the same time accuse those who don't add or take away from God's word as twisting and making unbiblical statements!

That is truly backwards..

Here is what the scripture says -

21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

The idea being conveyed here is a "process of becoming".

No, I have the Greek and "might" is not there, it is a word added in translation. Also the righteousness of faith is so well established in the New Testament (as I have shown in part) that any point you "think" you are making as to how this verse is read is just a vain and meaningless point.

2Co 5:21 For <gar> he hath made <poieo> him to be sin <hamartia> for <huper> us, <hemon> who <ho> knew <ginosko> no <me> sin; <hamartia> that <hina> we <hemeis> might be made <ginomai> the righteousness <dikaiosune> of God <theos> in <en> him. <autos>

If there is any conditional element of this word is it is based on the need that one must have "faith" to be made righteous.

For "in Him" we have no sin, and we cannot sin.

...Legally speaking.

The blood of Christ keeps us legally righteous and blameless before God in heaven. Meanwhile, the Spirit of God is working in us an ever-increasing behavioral righteousness here on earth (2 Peter 1:8 NASB).

Anyone who thinks the righteousness of Christ by faith means literally being perfectly righteous here on earth...well,...this is what John says about that:

"8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. " (1 John 1:8 NASB)

Like I have said before Jethro, the conflict is in your lack of understanding, not in the scriptures for as John also wrote In Him we have no sin and we cannot sin. So I will try to help you understand, Of myself and in the flesh I am the worst of sinners, "nothing good lives in me". In the Spirit I am born of God and In Gods righteousness I am sinless and without blame. Now the whole of the New Testament is to bring us from the flesh, "to crucify the flesh" and live in the Spirit, John is teaching the same thing Paul taught only showing it in a different way.