Pre-trib Rapture is not scriptural

[Free]

What in the world does any of this have to do with the topic?

 

[Free]

But again, what does any of this have to do with the topic??

 

[Free]

The "release" of believers from evil present and indwelling sin, which is demonic. 1 John 3:8. The Hope of the Gospel and the account of the end time is the putting away, by God, of these workings.

First, I've shown you before that 1 John 3:8 does not say what you erroneously make it say. Second, what does any of this have to do with whether or not pre-trig rapture is Scriptural?

 

[JLB]

First, I've shown you before that 1 John 3:8 does not say what you erroneously make it say. Second, what does any of this have to do with whether or not pre-trig rapture is Scriptural?

LIKE!!!

 

[for_his_glory]

please!!! ............... Edited

 

[Eugene]

.
Due to continued off topic posts this thread was closed for review and editing. The following requests were being ignored.

I asked that you would leave the subject of the flesh as that is another thread which many of us have replied to and stay on topic of the OP which is about pretrib, not the sins of the flesh

But again, what does any of this have to do with the topic??

please!!! ...............

 

[Eugene]

.
for_his_glory

This Thread is Reopened for Posting.
Please address the Original Post.
Pre-trib Rapture is not scriptural​

 

[for_his_glory]

Thank you Eugene

 

[for_his_glory]

The word Rapture is found nowhere in any scripture or in any concordances or Bible dictionaries. Some people have taken the transliterate Greek word Harpazo, to mean Rapture, but the definition of the word Harpazo is:

1. To seize, carry off by force, obtain by robbery
2. To seize on, claim for one's self eagerly
3. To snatch out or away

The Latin word rapio is where the word Rapture came from as it means to be seized or snatched up. No where in scripture does it say we will be seized or snatched up as we are obtained by robbery. We will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air after receiving our new glorified bodies that will be like Jesus and will evermore be with Him on the last day, John 6:40. It's no secret quiet rapture as many teach as the voice and the sound of a trumpet during the last day will be very loud and every eye will see Jesus return so it doesn't sound like we are seized or snatched up from the earth as God sends His angels out to gather the saints of God from the four corners of the earth, Rev 1:7; 1Thessalonians 4:13-18; Matthew 24:29-31.

 

[JLB]

The word Rapture is found nowhere in any scripture or in any concordances or Bible dictionaries. Some people have taken the transliterate Greek word Harpazo, to mean Rapture, but the definition of the word Harpazo is:

1. To seize, carry off by force, obtain by robbery
2. To seize on, claim for one's self eagerly
3. To snatch out or away

The Latin word rapio is where the word Rapture came from as it means to be seized or snatched up. No where in scripture does it say we will be seized or snatched up as we are obtained by robbery. We will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air after receiving our new glorified bodies that will be like Jesus and will evermore be with Him on the last day, John 6:40. It's no secret quiet rapture as many teach as the voice and the sound of a trumpet during the last day will be very loud and every eye will see Jesus return so it doesn't sound like we are seized or snatched up from the earth as God sends His angels out to gather the saints of God from the four corners of the earth, Rev 1:7; 1Thessalonians 4:13-18; Matthew 24:29-31.

Where oh where did they hide the LIKE button.


LIKE!!!!!!!

 

[for_his_glory]

Full Definition of rapture

1. 1 : an expression or manifestation of ecstasy or passion
   
   
2. 2 a : a state or experience of being carried away by overwhelming emotion b : a mystical experience in which the spirit is exalted to a knowledge of divine things
3. 3 often capitalized : the final assumption of Christians into heaven during the end-time according to Christian theology (notice it says Christian theology, not scripture, which means the religious study of the nature of God, beliefs, practices and ideas that have been handed down through the generations, but has no literal findings in scripture.

rapturous
play \ˈrap-chə-rəs, ˈrap-shrəs\ adjective
rapturously
adverb
rapturousness
noun

 

[daninthelionsden]

Bravo. Just a few years ago you would not have seen a post-tribber be able to carry on a thread such as this. The forum bullies who used to run the show here would be ganging up and shutting down this thread. The poster of a post-trib thread ran the risk of banishment/deletion. It is truly nice and refreshing to see tolerance of differing views once again.

 

[SHINY4UJESUS]

Hmmm. I'm a glutton for punishment, LOL; guess I'll throw my hat into this mix! Why not eh? I would simply take a different tack entirely here.
1) While there are literal applications to scripture, and potentially such in Revelation; a great deal is illustrative in context, and we do well to consider these things.
2) As such, there are some who proclaim we are seeing the seals broken in this day and age; and yet others who disagree. Some who believe we are currently in the literal "tribulation," and some who proclaim it is all just a metaphorical interpretation of spiritual items unable to be conveyed in worldly terms. (IE: seven years may not be seven years but an indeterminate period, specifically based on the idea that the Hebrew numeric representation of the #7 aside from literal value also has an inherent illustrative context signifying a number of infinite or undetermined value. IE: The actual events may not be literal, but metaphorical or analogous in context. IE: Since no scripture is "given to private interpretation," but is Spirit-inspired, dynamic, living and active; may have multiple contexts, meanings and applications-as such each element or all elements could "potentially," be equally valid or equally invalid regarding "rapture," and tribulation.)
3) Thus, we may currently be IN-TRIB, and have been IN-TRIB for a period; making the entire conversation in applicable relative to the concepts expounded therein. OR we may not be IN-TRIB, thus making all arguments pertinent and potentially viable. OR as alluded to biblically there are simply items not given us to comprehend at all, or at the least understandable before the appointed time, thus all arguments may be inherently unable to competently apply. OR given the illustrative context, should that indeed be what the particular passages are to be interpreted in, all or none of the arguments for, against, or peripherally relative to; the perspectives may be misapplied and misappropriated entirely.

I do not profess to have the answers of course; I simply offer these things as a means to provoke a deeper thinking in relation to the concepts of tribulation and/or rapture and/or interpretations thereof. I won't hold my breath expecting divine revelation or clarity on these matters as it is in God's hands alone to dictate such things; though it would be mighty swell of Father should He grace me with such knowledge. In the end, truth will be what truth will be, and I would imagine that no matter who believes what in regards to these things-neither belief nor disbelief in them will change what they are by even the smallest fraction. So I suppose I will just sit back, praise God and follow Jesus until the day He takes me home.

 

[calvin]

Bravo. Just a few years ago you would not have seen a post-tribber be able to carry on a thread such as this. The forum bullies who used to run the show here would be ganging up and shutting down this thread. The poster of a post-trib thread ran the risk of banishment/deletion. It is truly nice and refreshing to see tolerance of differing views once again.

:amen

 

[calvin]

I like 'dirtfarmer's' intro so I'll pinch it
calvin here,
If there were to be one scriptural passage that would nail the question it would have to be revelation 20:4.
Having one's head chopped off , having one's ability / freedom to buy or sell would be tribulation mega big time.
Also, those who don't take part in this first resurrection will have to wait for the second and face the very real prospect of the second death...a fate that is not reserved for the Christian.

It seems to me that there are two levels of tribulation mentioned in scripture;
1 John 16:31,32,33. here the tribulation is fairly mild (relatively speaking) and seems to target disciples of Christ only.

2.Mark 13:19 The trbulation of those days will be global in effect. It seems that it will be a final purging and wake up call for humanity.
Christians at that time will have a very important role to play. People will be looking for reasons why, hope for the moment, hope for tomorrow, and seeking to find their way back to the Lord.

Well that is as I see it anyway, so I don't see a pre triib gathering of the Lord's disciples as being a credible rival to a post tribulation gathering.

 

[Sinthesis]

Christians at that time will have a very important role to play. People will be looking for reasons why, hope for the moment, hope for tomorrow, and seeking to find their way back to the Lord.

How is that different from the role we are to play right now?

 

[calvin]

How is that different from the role we are to play right now?

Calvin here,
thankyou for your reply.
I don't see the role we are to play as being different, but possibly the oportunity to effectively proclaim the gospel might change.
In my little corner of the Earth, we have to go looking for people who are receptive to the gospel, however I think (and I might be wrong), in those final days people will seek us out...some to kill us and others to enquire of the Lord, seeking answers, seeking hope, seeking faith., seeking salvation.

 

[smaller]

First, I've shown you before that 1 John 3:8 does not say what you erroneously make it say. Second, what does any of this have to do with whether or not pre-trig rapture is Scriptural?

Because "devils" are divided out/separated from mankind, at the end. Matt. 25.

Believers who are still alive, will be standing here, on earth, when the account of Matt. 25 transpires. There will be no "pre-trib" rapture.

 

[Douglas Summers]

Full Definition of rapture

1. 1 : an expression or manifestation of ecstasy or passion
   
   
2. 2 a : a state or experience of being carried away by overwhelming emotion b : a mystical experience in which the spirit is exalted to a knowledge of divine things
3. 3 often capitalized : the final assumption of Christians into heaven during the end-time according to Christian theology (notice it says Christian theology, not scripture, which means the religious study of the nature of God, beliefs, practices and ideas that have been handed down through the generations, but has no literal findings in scripture.

rapturous
play \ˈrap-chə-rəs, ˈrap-shrəs\ adjective
rapturously
adverb
rapturousness
noun

Etymology
"Rapture" is derived from Middle French rapture, via the Medieval Latin raptura ("seizure,kidnapping"), which derives from the Latin raptus ("a carrying off").[17]

Greek
The Koine Greek of 1 Thessalonians 4:17 uses the verb form ἁρπαγησόμεθα (harpagisometha), which means "we shall be caught up" or "taken away", with the connotation that this is a sudden event. The dictionary form of this Greek verb is harpazō (ἁρπάζω).[18] This use is also seen in such texts as Acts 8:39, 2Corinthians 12:2-4 and Revelation 12:5.

Latin
The Latin Vulgate translates the Greek ἁρπαγησόμεθα as rapiemur,[19] from the verb rapio meaning "to catch up" or "take away".[20]

English Bible translations
English versions of the Bible have expressed the concept of rapiemur in various ways:

• The Wycliffe Bible (1395), translated from the Latin Vulgate, uses "rushed".[21]
• The Tyndale New Testament (1525), the Bishop's Bible (1568), the Geneva Bible (1587) and the King James Version (1611) use "caught up".[22]
• The on-line NET Bible (1995-2005) translates the Greek of 1 Thessalonians 4:17[23] using the phrase "suddenly caught up" with this footnote: "Or 'snatched up.' The Greek verb ἁρπάζω implies that the action is quick or forceful, so the translation supplied the adverb 'suddenly' to make this implicit notion clear."

There is more to the understanding of the word rapture then what you posted. You could find it if you were looking for it. Aside from that, why do you care why someone believes in the taking away of the Church before Christ second coming, while the world is continually lapsing into a hellhole while the religious play church. Whether you believe in the rapture or not is not a sin. I believe it because it is not about a word. It is a doctrine with several Scriptures references. No need to try and convince me otherwise. What else do you not believe...Just wondering?

 

[daninthelionsden]

The bible says even Christ doesn't know the time of that Day...only the Father. If you were to take several colored highlighters to the Book of Revelations and use different colors for who said what. You will find that angels do the majority of announcing, along with Christ Himself. But note in Rev 6:16. The announcers are not angels nor Christ. Their "mightiness" status only matters to others on earth and have no bearing nor authority in the Kingdom. If Christ doesn't even know the timing of that Day....then these fellows surely are not the ones to usher it in. Very important to consider the source of the proclamation. It is clear the Day of the Lord is a massacre of Christ's enemies as stated in Zech. 14:12, Mat 24:28, Lu 17:37.......these verses give a triangulation from the Jewish perspective, the Christian perspective and even Christ's perspective. This event doesn't take place until Rev 19:17/18.