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Was Paul Heretical in Teaching Sinless Perfection?

That is where your fallacy lies.
Your body was not born again, but your spirit.
2 Cor 5:17 says otherwise..."Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new."
That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:6
I'm sure glad I no longer walk in or after the "flesh".
You don't have to either !
Your body contains sin, even though Christ is in you.
You are intent on introducing sin into Christ, but your efforts are just plain silly.
It is impossible for sin to be in Christ.
And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Plainly we see Christ being in us, yet our body still contains sin.
Why do you keep ignoring Romans 8:9 ?..."But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his."
Your POV is only valid in those who don't have the Spirit dwelling in them.
Fortunately though, a true repentance from sin and baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins will rectify that condition !
Peter says in Acts 2:38, that those who do those two things will receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
 
2 Cor 5:17 says otherwise..."Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new."

Again, you keep posting your own words and tagging your opinion with a scripture reference.

Therefore, from now on, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him thus no longer. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new. 2 Corinthians 5:16-17


There is nothing here nor in any other scripture that says our physical body was born again.


Again as the scripture says …


And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. Romans 8:10

Born again Christians who have Christ in us, have a physical body that contains sin.

We therefore have sin, and are not sinless.

If you believe you are sinless, then the scriptures say you have deceived yourself.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 1 John 1:8

The way we avoid practicing the works of the flesh (sinning) is to walk in the Spirit.


I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. Galatians 5:16




JLB
 
You commented that there are many denominations with the same teachings.
I too have found "churches" that teach we are to be obedient to God, but when I ask them if they are, they give me the same old runaround, culminating in a NO.
Hi, what was on my mind at the time was the history I had just got through looking at; the branches that spun from protestantism .
 
Again, you keep posting your own words and tagging your opinion with a scripture reference.
The scripture saying "all things become new" makes your POV moot.
You want to preclude the body from that "all things".
Therefore, from now on, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him thus no longer. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new. 2 Corinthians 5:16-17
Both verses are correct.
So why do you regard yourself according to the flesh ?
And why can't you include the vessel as part of the all things that are made new ?
There is nothing here nor in any other scripture that says our physical body was born again.
Nothing except 2 Cor 5:17, which you just cited.
Though Jesus' parable from Luke 5:37-38 shows it too.
If you put new wine in old bottles, both will be destroyed.
If you put a new spirit in an old vessel both will also be destroyed.
Again as the scripture says …
And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. Romans 8:10
Are you still walking around in a dead body ?
I am not, thanks be to God and being raised with Christ to walk in newness of life. (Rom 6:4)
Of course that new life will not occur without a true repentance from sin.
Born again Christians who have Christ in us, have a physical body that contains sin.
If true, then pitifully, a sinful man has been reborn of God's seed.
That is quite the impossibility.
Your POV introduces Christ into a polluted temple.
We therefore have sin, and are not sinless.
Just as your first point was wrong, so too is the second.
If you believe you are sinless, then the scriptures say you have deceived yourself.
There is no sin in God, in Whom I walk. (1 John 1:7)
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 1 John 1:8
True, for those walking in sin.
Not everyone does though.
The way we avoid practicing the works of the flesh (sinning) is to walk in the Spirit.
The way to not sin at all is to walk in the Spirit.
He is not a revolving door.
I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. Galatians 5:16
Why do you resist the exhortation ?

Kill the old you, (Gal 5:24), and be reborn of God's perfect seed. (1 John 3:8-10)
 
Hi, what was on my mind at the time was the history I had just got through looking at; the branches that spun from protestantism .
OK, and protestantism spun off from catholicism, which spun off from something else.
So how do we choose the correct church ?
Start by asking them if they still commit sin.
 
The scripture saying "all things become new" makes your POV moot.
You want to preclude the body from that "all things".

All things do indeed become when we are born again.

However, you still are just posting opinion.

Therefore, from now on, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him thus no longer. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new. 2 Corinthians 5:16-17

We certainly have a new outlook on like, we see where we were once blind but our physical body is still the same physical body we had from birth.

And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. Romans 8:10

When Christ is in us at our new birth, we still have a body that contains sin, because the Spirit brings about the new birth in our spirit, not our physical body.

The way we avoid practicing the works of the flesh (sinning) is to walk in the Spirit.


I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. Galatians 5:16


Born again Christians who have Christ in us, have a physical body that contains sin.

We therefore have sin, and are not sinless.

If you believe you are sinless, then the scriptures say you have deceived yourself.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 1 John 1:8




Please post a scripture that says our physical body is born again when we are baptized in water.





JLB
 
Which church do you believe will say NO, WE DO NOT SIN...
?
The church founded on the fact that Jesus is the Son of God.
It is named "The Church By Christ Jesus, in Eph. 3:21.
They have all repented of sin.
They have all crucified the flesh, with the affections and lusts.
They have all been raised with Christ to walk in newness of life.
They have all received the gift of the Holy Ghost.
They have all been reborn of God's seed.
 
All things do indeed become when we are born again.
However, you still are just posting opinion.
Please explain how the "body" doesn't fit into the "all things" made new, in 2 Cor 5:17.
Therefore, from now on, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him thus no longer. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new. 2 Corinthians 5:16-17
You post the scripture, even emboldening the salient point, but still deny its truth ?
We certainly have a new outlook on like, we see where we were once blind but our physical body is still the same physical body we had from birth..
That is only true for those who have NOT been BORN AGAIN.
Rebirth requires the end of that which has been replaced.
And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. Romans 8:10
Why don't you think the old body is dead ?
Why do you insist it is still alive ?
When Christ is in us at our new birth, we still have a body that contains sin, because the Spirit brings about the new birth in our spirit, not our physical body.
You have never supplied any scripture implying that skin and bones have sin in them.
Why do you empower them to have any power over you ?
Or that they somehow can commit some damning sins ?
The way we avoid practicing the works of the flesh (sinning) is to walk in the Spirit.
The way we avoid the works of he flesh is to walk in the Spirit.
A single murder, lie, theft, gets the same punishment as 500 murders, etc.
Those waking in the Spirit won't commit any murder, lie, or theft..
I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. Galatians 5:16
That is true, though you won't admit it.
Born again Christians who have Christ in us, have a physical body that contains sin.
Then rebirth from God's seed is a hoax.
The child of Adam continues to walk as a phony Christian.
You are of the camp that wants to put new wine into old bottles. (Matt 9:17)
We therefore have sin, and are not sinless
Your POV is a lie designed to accommodate sin.
Its purveyors will be rewarded with a lake of fire.
.If you believe you are sinless, then the scriptures say you have deceived yourself.
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 1 John 1:8
If your POV on 1 John 1:8 is true, then verse 7 and 9 are lies.
They say that ALL our sin and ALL our unrighteousness can be washed away.
If we can't say we have no sin, then we can't be washed of ALL sin.
Please post a scripture that says our physical body is born again when we are baptized in water.
Sure..." Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7 For he that is dead is freed from sin."
The old man was destroyed, so how can it still exist ?

Here is another..."In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead." (Col 2:11-12)
The new man risen who has been raised with Christ is not the came man who was crucified with Jesus.
He is a new creature.
 
"How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?" - Jn. 3:4

Plainly Jesus says no.

Hopeful thinks otherwise.

Hopeful was taught that his physical body was born again sinless when he was water baptized, so he believes he is sinless.

Jesus taught us flesh gives birth to flesh, and the Spirit gives birth to spirit.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:6





JLB
 
Please explain how the "body" doesn't fit into the "all things" made new, in 2 Cor 5:17.

Why does our mind need to be renewed if it was made new?

And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God. Romans 12:2

Answer: the thing that was born again was your spirit, not your soul, not your physical body.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:6

  • that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Therefore, from now on, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him thus no longer. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new. 2 Corinthians 5:16-17

Why does Paul teach us to not regard each other according to the flesh, if the flesh is sinless?

again

And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. Romans 8:10


Our physical body will die because of the sin it contains.




JLB
 
Plainly Jesus says no.

Hopeful thinks otherwise.

Hopeful was taught that his physical body was born again sinless when he was water baptized, so he believes he is sinless.

Jesus taught us flesh gives birth to flesh, and the Spirit gives birth to spirit.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:6





JLB
There're four distinct pillars of Christian worldview - Creation, Desacration (or fall of man, sinful nature of man), Redemption and Glorification. This is the overarching biblical narrative, any theology or doctrine, including the Nicene Creed, must fit into this framework. If it doesn't, then this theology or doctrine is questionable. Hopeful's mistake is conflating redemption and glorification. Simply put, Jesus's first coming as a suffering servant is our redemption, Jesus's SECOND coming as a conquering king is our glorification. In between is our sanctification, a slow process to repent our sins and truly embrace Jesus as our Lord and Savior. This part is NOT optional, you can't skip it.
 
any theology or doctrine, including the Nicene Creed

Thological doctrines, Nicene Creed, or anything else other than the doctrine of Christ is unbiblical.


Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9
 
Thological doctrines, Nicene Creed, or anything else other than the doctrine of Christ is unbiblical.


Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9
Yes, that doctine is our redemption - Jesus Christ died for our sins according to the Scripture. (1 Cor. 15:3)
 
Plainly Jesus says no.

Hopeful thinks otherwise.

Hopeful was taught that his physical body was born again sinless when he was water baptized, so he believes he is sinless.

Jesus taught us flesh gives birth to flesh, and the Spirit gives birth to spirit.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:6
The reborn man is reborn of the Spirit.
God is a Spirit, and it is His seed from which the reborn are gendered.
 
Why does our mind need to be renewed if it was made new?
It doesn't.
And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God. Romans 12:2
That renewal occurs at rebirth from God's seed.
The unregenerated cannot "prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God".
Answer: the thing that was born again was your spirit, not your soul, not your physical body.
That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:6
Rebirth doesn't bring forth men of the "flesh".
It brings forth men of the Spirit.
that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
As we are reborn of the Spirit, we are spiritual.
"But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man." (1 Cor 2:15)
Rebirth doesn't come from the seed of Adam.
Therefore, from now on, we regard no one according to the flesh.
Amen, because we are are no longer in the "flesh".
Why does Paul teach us to not regard each other according to the flesh, if the flesh is sinless?
Because we are no longer in the 'flesh", or walking after it.
again
And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. Romans 8:10
So why do you keep saying it is alive ?
Our physical body will die because of the sin it contains.
The vessel will die because it is mortal.
But the man inside of the vessel is immortal.
The body can't commit sin nor will it be judged for sin.
The man inside the vessel pulls the strings.
It will bear the judgement of God.

You are blaming your suit-case for the smell of your dirty laundry.
 
Thological doctrines, Nicene Creed, or anything else other than the doctrine of Christ is unbiblical.


Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9
Well put.
Whoever commits sin does not abide in the doctrine of Christ, and does not have God.
Why you call then reborn Christians ???
 
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