What is The Baptism that saves us now?

[Hopeful]

There is a scripture I awoken to.
About the inside of the cup being made clean and then the outside would be clean.

I never really got that but I have to do some research still...I didn't get it because I felt like the outside still needed washings..

But then I thought of another word beside clean which was pure...which lead to purification of utensils used for service.

Before that explanation another passage came to me, which was: it's not what goes in the body that defiled it but what comes out of it.

Put 2 & 2 together and you get the Baptism that saves us now..

As I said before God[life] is the answer to a clear conscience before God.

Not only is the spirit the guarantee that we will have what he says will have as an earnest deposit...

But we talked about being immersed(Baptized) into the presence of God by being immersed(baptized) in His word.(teachings)

When is one cleaned from the inside out?
(As they walk in the Spirit they do not fullfill the lust of the flesh....and too they uphold the law.

How does one walk in the Spirit? By obeying the truth...

Who is the truth? Jesus is the way the truth and the life..no one comes to the father but through Him...

What does it mean that Jesus is the way??? Is it speaking of Him:
as the model?
the living, enduring word?
As the Messiah?
The outward manifestation of God in human form?

So beautifully said it is not the removal of dirt from the Skin.......dealing with the outward first as under the law.

However

Answer from God for a clear conscience
FOUND BY THE RESURRECTION OF JESUS CHRIST..

How did the resurrection take place? He was quickened by the Spirit....(made alive by the Spirit) How??? Because He was in the presence of God? Because death could not hold the power being life. For He is the way the truth and the "life"....[must look up life.]
Because of His resurrection we can also be Justified by His faithfulness ...

And where is He said to be? Right hand of God with all things being under His authority.

I just had a thought... Why is Jesus bodily resurrection so important???
Wow! because He was man with a body and Spirit that are both in alignment in heaven.

Which in a sense says through Him we can conquer the works of the devil...which to me is being seperated from life with God. How our own personal will out of alignment with the will of God.

Therefore the Baptism that saves us is immersion into the presence of God...by doing what is right, by obeying the Spirit which is truth, and of course the truth sets us free from bondage under the kingdom of Satin.

This scripture just came to me: now being justified freely by faith..we have peace with God....through our LORD JESUS CHRIST

We are no longer to know any man after the flesh......for we are all under one in the same Spirit ....(spirit of peace?),(spirit of life), (spirit of joy)

And there it is God is Spirit and those that worship Him must worship(my words) with the right attitude....

This is why we first must be quickened by the Spirit...
For God is not the God of the dead but the living..what association does light have with dark.

Now...

Go back to the prepositional beginning in 1 Peter 3:19.

What do you find?
They were saved by water....
Water is not necessarily the Baptism
What saved them was their obedience to God

Therefore God saved them through the water based on their obedience to God...

The answer of a good conscience before God is God...God is faithful.

I bet He said He would save them in their obedience to Him and He did.

There obedience then must have brought them in the presence of God/a friendship relationship...(eternal life)

So then hopeful...I recall Jesus saying He gave Peter the key...to the kingdom or something similar.(etc etc)...so it is truly possible that through their obedience they were saved...but watch this...people are obedient from the heart first...As when Jesus Healed as they went (believed, etc) For example the scriptures that says they obeyed from the heart the form of doctrine that was presented to them....and God looks at the heart....To worship in Spirit is with the right attitude.

Anyway I think I am 74% satisfied with this....only because in my mind....
I think I have to distinguish between scriptures that are about Christ being in Us as oppose to those where we are in Christ......

You can't be immersed into God's word, or any other philosophical dead-end, while you are in the flesh.
The way to kill the flesh is by water baptism.
It is written..."Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin." (Rom 6:3-6)
Go with what is written by God's apostle instead of what you "awoke to".

 

[Runmyramble]

You can't be immersed into God's word,

"IMMERSED IN THE WORD"
"immersed(baptized) in His word."
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
That's what I wrote above....

OF COURSE YOU CAN BE IMMERSED IN THE WORD-BY LIVING IT OUT..."TEACH THEM TO DO ALL THAT I HAVE COMMANDED YOU"
THE WORD IS LIVING...THEREFORE NEEDS TO BE LIVE OUT ...

MAKES ME WONDER...WHAT IT MEANS TO HAVE OUR NAMES WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF LIFE....(TO LIVE OUT THE WORD) IMMERSE OURSELVES IN THE TEACHINGS OF CHRIST

...

YOU IMMERSE YOURSELF IN YOUR JOB
TOTALLY COMITTED....WORKING AT IT..ETC

or any other philosophical dead-end, while you are in the flesh.

NOW YOU RIGHT ABOUT THAT..ONE SHOULD DEFINITELY NOT IMMERSE THEMSELVES IN DEAD END THINGS..BUT THEY DO....DEAD END JOBS THAT DO NOT BRING PROMOTIONS OR UPWARD MOBILITY.

ALSO THEY SHOULD NOT IMMERSE THEMSELVES IN THEIR FLESHLY DESIRES....

BUT SET THEIR TREASURES IN HEAVEN

The way to kill the flesh is by water baptism.
It is written..

ACCORDING TO YOUR INTRRPRETATION BELOW?

."Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

YOU WERE BAPTIZED INTO WHAT HE DID.
LIKE/AS THOSE IN NOAH'S DAY WERE IN THE ARK....DID THEY TAKE THEMSELVES THROUGH THE WATER?

YET THEY "RECKONED" THEMSELVES AS DOING SUCH SENSE THEY WERE IN THE ARK...FOR WHY WOULD THEY HAVE TO BE TOLD WHAT THEY WOULD KNOW?

4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death

ANOTHER WORDS YOU CAN IDENTIFY WITH WHAT HE DID BECAUSE YOU ARE IN HIM/ONE IS TO RECKON THEMSELVES DEAD TO SIN

: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

THERE IT IS: "LIKE, AS"

5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

THERE IT IS AGAIN "LIKENESS"

6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin." (Rom 6:3-6)

AMEN

Go with what is written by God's apostle instead of what you "awoke to".

THAT WAS RUDE OF YOU..

YOU GO WITH WHAT THE APOSTLES TAUGHT BUT ...MANY COULD SAY YOU HAVE NOT AWOKEN TO THE TRUE MEANING.

I awoken to a scripture written in the Bible...as I wrote so please do not take what is plainly seen out of it's context.

 

[Hopeful]

"IMMERSED IN THE WORD"
"immersed(baptized) in His word."
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
That's what I wrote above....

OF COURSE YOU CAN BE IMMERSED IN THE WORD-BY LIVING IT OUT..."TEACH THEM TO DO ALL THAT I HAVE COMMANDED YOU"
THE WORD IS LIVING...THEREFORE NEEDS TO BE LIVE OUT ...

Why didn't you include the rest of my sentence?
You made a point out of context that fails in context.

NOW YOU RIGHT ABOUT THAT..ONE SHOULD DEFINITELY NOT IMMERSE THEMSELVES IN DEAD END THINGS..BUT THEY DO....DEAD END JOBS THAT DO NOT BRING PROMOTIONS OR UPWARD MOBILITY.
ALSO THEY SHOULD NOT IMMERSE THEMSELVES IN THEIR FLESHLY DESIRES....
BUT SET THEIR TREASURES IN HEAVEN
ACCORDING TO YOUR INTRRPRETATION BELOW?
YOU WERE BAPTIZED INTO WHAT HE DID.
LIKE/AS THOSE IN NOAH'S DAY WERE IN THE ARK....DID THEY TAKE THEMSELVES THROUGH THE WATER?
YET THEY "RECKONED" THEMSELVES AS DOING SUCH SENSE THEY WERE IN THE ARK...FOR WHY WOULD THEY HAVE TO BE TOLD WHAT THEY WOULD KNOw
ANOTHER WORDS YOU CAN IDENTIFY WITH WHAT HE DID BECAUSE YOU ARE IN HIM/ONE IS TO RECKON THEMSELVES DEAD TO SIN
THERE IT IS: "LIKE, AS"
THERE IT IS AGAIN "LIKENESS"
AMEN
THAT WAS RUDE OF YOU.

Go with what is written in God's word instead of what you "woke to".
They are very different things, and only God's is correct.

YOU GO WITH WHAT THE APOSTLES TAUGHT BUT ...MANY COULD SAY YOU HAVE NOT AWOKEN TO THE TRUE MEANING.

What was the Ethiopian baptized in for the remission of his sins?
It is written..."And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?" (Acts 8:36)
I guess he wasn't as "woke" as you.

I awoken to a scripture written in the Bible...as I wrote so please do not take what is plainly seen out of it's context.

Out of context posts start on sandy ground.
Stick with what is written.

 

[Runmyramble]

Why didn't you include the rest of my sentence?
You made a point out of context that fails in context.

Go with what is written in God's word instead of what you "woke to".
They are very different things, and only God's is correct.

What was the Ethiopian baptized in for the remission of his sins?
It is written..."And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?" (Acts 8:36)
I guess he wasn't as "woke" as you.

Out of context posts start on sandy ground.
Stick with what is written.

Ok time to ignore...

 

[Hopeful]

Ok time to ignore...

As long as you know what the Ethiopian was "baptized" with, it is OK.

 

[heartwashed]

As long as you know what the Ethiopian was "baptized" with, it is OK.

water, correct?

 

[Hopeful]

water, correct?

Correct.
It could have been maple syrup though, as long as he was "immersed".

 

[heartwashed]

Correct.
It could have been maple syrup though, as long as he was "immersed".

Yes, I believe that.

Immersion in water is the best symbol to represent identification with the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ. As we go under the water, we are buried with Him. As we come out of the water, we are risen with Him (symbolically).

This counts as the best way that I know of to confess Jesus our Lord before men...to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth for the remission of sins.

Such a confession has the power to save a man (Matthew 10:32, Luke 12:8).

Also, I would point out that sprinkling in water also has the power to produce regeneration according to Ezekiel 36:25-27.

 

[Runmyramble]

Ok time to ignore...

This is what I wrote:

There is a scripture I awoken to.
About the inside of the cup being made clean and then the outside would be clean.

I never really got that but I have to do some research still...I didn't get it because I felt like the outside still needed washings..

But then I thought of another word beside clean which was pure...which lead to purification of utensils used for service.

Before that explanation another passage came to me, which was: it's not what goes in the body that defiled it but what comes out of it.

Put 2 & 2 together and you get the Baptism that saves us now..

As I said before God[life] is the answer to a clear conscience before God.

Not only is the spirit the guarantee that we will have what he says will have as an earnest deposit...

But we talked about being immersed(Baptized) into the presence of God by being immersed(baptized) in His word.(teachings)

When is one cleaned from the inside out?
(As they walk in the Spirit they do not fullfill the lust of the flesh....and too they uphold the law.

How does one walk in the Spirit? By obeying the truth...

Who is the truth? Jesus is the way the truth and the life..no one comes to the father but through Him...

What does it mean that Jesus is the way??? Is it speaking of Him:
as the model?
the living, enduring word?
As the Messiah?
The outward manifestation of God in human form?

So beautifully said it is not the removal of dirt from the Skin.......dealing with the outward first as under the law.

However

Answer from God for a clear conscience
FOUND BY THE RESURRECTION OF JESUS CHRIST..

How did the resurrection take place? He was quickened by the Spirit....(made alive by the Spirit) How??? Because He was in the presence of God? Because death could not hold the power being life. For He is the way the truth and the "life"....[must look up life.]
Because of His resurrection we can also be Justified by His faithfulness ...

And where is He said to be? Right hand of God with all things being under His authority.

I just had a thought... Why is Jesus bodily resurrection so important???
Wow! because He was man with a body and Spirit that are both in alignment in heaven.

Which in a sense says through Him we can conquer the works of the devil...which to me is being seperated from life with God. How our own personal will out of alignment with the will of God.

Therefore the Baptism that saves us is immersion into the presence of God...by doing what is right, by obeying the Spirit which is truth, and of course the truth sets us free from bondage under the kingdom of Satin.

This scripture just came to me: now being justified freely by faith..we have peace with God....through our LORD JESUS CHRIST

We are no longer to know any man after the flesh......for we are all under one in the same Spirit ....(spirit of peace?),(spirit of life), (spirit of joy)

And there it is God is Spirit and those that worship Him must worship(my words) with the right attitude....

This is why we first must be quickened by the Spirit...
For God is not the God of the dead but the living..what association does light have with dark.

Now...

Go back to the prepositional beginning in 1 Peter 3:19.
What do you find?
They were saved by water....
Water is not necessarily the Baptism
What saved them was their obedience to God

Therefore God saved them through the water based on their obedience to God...

The answer of a good conscience before God is God...God is faithful.

I bet He said He would save them in their obedience to Him and He did.

There obedience then must have brought them in the presence of God/a friendship relationship...(eternal life)

So then hopeful...I recall Jesus saying He gave Peter the key...to the kingdom or something similar.(etc etc)...so it is truly possible that through their obedience they were saved...but watch this...people are obedient from the heart first...As when Jesus Healed as they went (believed, etc) For example the scriptures that says they obeyed from the heart the form of doctrine that was presented to them....and God looks at the heart....To worship in Spirit is with the right attitude.

Anyway I think I am 74% satisfied with this....only because in my mind....
I think I have to distinguish between scriptures that are about Christ being in Us as oppose to those where we are in Christ......

 

[Hopeful]

Yes, I believe that.
Immersion in water is the best symbol to represent identification with the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ. As we go under the water, we are buried with Him. As we come out of the water, we are risen with Him (symbolically).

Not symbolically, but actually...by faith.
Rom 6:5 says..."For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:"
Those fighting against water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins miss out on both the "planting" and on the "resurrecting".
They can't walk with Jesus, in newness of life.

This counts as the best way that I know of to confess Jesus our Lord before men...to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth for the remission of sins.

Who cares what other think?
It is between you and God.

Such a confession has the power to save a man (Matthew 10:32, Luke 12:8).

A tad out of context, but folks watching others get baptized never hurt anyone.

Also, I would point out that sprinkling in water also has the power to produce regeneration according to Ezekiel 36:25-27.

I don't agree...in a NT context.
Where is the "planting" in sprinkling?

 

[JLB]

Ok I am back for a .moment...Hope all is well with you.

I came home for some rest and was meditating...also read something on the subject

So to dwelve into the subject...

Is it our appeal to God
Or God's appeal to men?

Or rather

Is it our pledge(promise) for a clear conscience before God?

Meaning (we are making a promise)

Or God's promise to man for a clear conscience before Him?

This is for you too JLB

I was water baptized and also baptized with the Holy Spirit, with the evidence that is seen and heard.

I believe people should indeed be water baptized, however, water baptism is for believers, not unbelievers.

We are saved, when we believe.

We don’t receive the Spirit at water baptism.



Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them, who, when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit. For as yet He had fallen upon none of them. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.
And when Simon saw that through the laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Spirit was given, he offered them money, saying, “Give me this power also, that anyone on whom I lay hands may receive the Holy Spirit.” Acts 8:14-19







JLB

 

[heartwashed]

Acts 2:38-39 contains a conditional promise given to as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Fulfill the condition, receive the promise;

And show that you have indeed been called.

If you have not been called, you have not been justified and will not be glorified, Romans 8:30.

 

[Runmyramble]

So...my conclusion again...the baptism that saves us now....Has to do with the cleansing of our hearts; our conscience before the living God...

And it's living in (submerged in)the presence of God, the Holy Trinity..

This happens by:
By being immersed in the word of God; Jesus's life, teachings, or commands.

For just as The words Jesus spoke are Spirit(quickening) and life
The answer to a clear conscience is Life..
For again God is not the God of the dead but the living.

And through the resurrection ...of Jesus whose body was quickened by the Spirit that was in Him...we too can be quickened by that same Spirit that makes us alive to God...so God[life] is the answer to a clear conscience before God....there the saying God is God...
I am that I am...
It is God that we have our being and exist..

Read the full chapter of 1 Peter 3
and see what you get from it...

Why would it not be about removing the dirt from the skin?...because the opposite is removing the filth from the conscience..

Is your conscience clean by your physical act of Baptism? Or obedience from the heart...sense man looks at the outer appearance but God the heart.

And through obedience of the heart does God thereby Justify man? If so if you were justified in your spirit... your expression of what has already been done would be? Water Baptism

 

[Runmyramble]

I was water baptized and also baptized with the Holy Spirit, with the evidence that is seen and heard.

At the same time? So when you were Baptized in water did you come upspeaking in tongues?

I believe people should indeed be water baptized, however, water baptism is for believers, not unbelievers.

Ok

We are saved, when we believe.

You mean you are given the Holy spirit when you believed?

We don’t receive the Spirit at water baptism.

Hopeful believes we do...I figure as the first act of faith...But I believe the first act of faith is the choice to follow what has been revealed to you from the heart..

Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them, who, when they had come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit. For as yet He had fallen upon none of them. They had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then they laid hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.
And when Simon saw that through the laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Spirit was given, he offered them money, saying, “Give me this power also, that anyone on whom I lay hands may receive the Holy Spirit.” Acts 8:14-19

But what is being sought here? For don't you agree that the HolyGhost falls on those who believe to equip them for service? In a sense He(the Holy Ghost) verifies the word received.

JLB

 

[jaybo]

If being baptized in water -- immersion -- saves people, then all those baptized by John in the Jordan were saved and had no need for Jesus Christ to be their Savior. The idea that baptism saves is ludicrous.

 

[heartwashed]

If being baptized in water -- immersion -- saves people, then all those baptized by John in the Jordan were saved and had no need for Jesus Christ to be their Savior. The idea that baptism saves is ludicrous.

Baptism in Jesus' Name is an identification with Christ in His death, burial, and resurrection and saves in that it is a confession of Jesus Christ before men (Matthew 10:32, Luke 12:8).

 

[Mungo]

If being baptized in water -- immersion -- saves people, then all those baptized by John in the Jordan were saved and had no need for Jesus Christ to be their Savior. The idea that baptism saves is ludicrous.

Two things wrong with your post.

1. It contradicts scripture which clearly states that baptism saves (Mk 16:16 & 1Pet3:21)

2. John's baptism was a Jewish baptism and not "in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit" (Mt 28:19) as Jesus commanded.

 

[jaybo]

Baptism in Jesus' Name is an identification with Christ in His death, burial, and resurrection and saves in that it is a confession of Jesus Christ before men (Matthew 10:32, Luke 12:8).

It is interesting that neither of the verses that you quote is "baptism" mentioned. Again, if baptism saves, why weren't those who John baptized saved?

John 3:5-6, "Then people from Jerusalem, as well as all Judea and all the region around the Jordan, were going out to him, and he was baptizing them in the Jordan River as they confessed their sins."

Luke 3:15-18, "While the people were filled with anticipation and they all wondered whether perhaps John could be the Christ, John answered them all, “I baptize you with water, but one more powerful than I am is coming—I am not worthy to untie the strap[aw] of his sandals. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire. His winnowing fork is in his hand to clean out his threshing floor and to gather the wheat into his storehouse, but the chaff he will burn up with inextinguishable fire.” And in this way, with many other exhortations, John proclaimed good news to the people."

John 10:40-41, " Jesus went back across the Jordan River[e] again to the place where John had been baptizing at an earlier time, and he stayed there. Many came to him and began to say, “John performed no miraculous sign, but everything John said about this man was true!”

If baptism saves, why did the people say this? Clearly, baptism in water saves nobody.

 

[heartwashed]

It is interesting that neither of the verses that you quote is "baptism" mentioned.

So, your argument is that baptism in Jesus' Name is not a confession of Jesus Christ before men?

 

[heartwashed]

Again, if baptism saves, why weren't those who John baptized saved?

John 3:5-6, "Then people from Jerusalem, as well as all Judea and all the region around the Jordan, were going out to him, and he was baptizing them in the Jordan River as they confessed their sins."

Luke 3:15-18, "While the people were filled with anticipation and they all wondered whether perhaps John could be the Christ, John answered them all, “I baptize you with water, but one more powerful than I am is coming—I am not worthy to untie the strap[aw] of his sandals. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire. His winnowing fork is in his hand to clean out his threshing floor and to gather the wheat into his storehouse, but the chaff he will burn up with inextinguishable fire.” And in this way, with many other exhortations, John proclaimed good news to the people."

John 10:40-41, " Jesus went back across the Jordan River[e] again to the place where John had been baptizing at an earlier time, and he stayed there. Many came to him and began to say, “John performed no miraculous sign, but everything John said about this man was true!”

If baptism saves, why did the people say this? Clearly, baptism in water saves nobody.

Consider Luke 7:29-30.

Clearly in this passage, whether or not they were baptized had a direct effect on whether or not they had faith in Jesus.