Am I saved; or am I fooling myself?

[jgredline]

Oscar
Thanks for the commentaries. I wish I would have known of them.
They helped to clear some things up for me, but it does appear from reading those, that the hebrews were not believers.

I was not as crazy as Jack made me out to be. :wink:

 

[mutzrein]

I was not as crazy as Jack made me out to be. :wink:

Past tense of course :wink:

 

[jgredline]

Past tense of course :wink:

Actually I was expecting to get lynched :-D Actually, I still might :wink:
Well atleast I won't get lynched alone

 

[mutzrein]

Actually I was expecting to get lynched :-D Actually, I still might :wink:
Well atleast I won't get lynched alone

: that's the truth - and you won't be the last

 

[Rick W]

Was Judas Iscariot a believer?
Was he saved?
Did he lose his salvation?

Many sought salvation by their on hand. What jesus taught didn't go over very well.

Joh 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Joh 6:61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?





I don't think Judas was a believer.

Joh 6:62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
Joh 6:64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.



Judas was given to betray Christ so "the scriptures would be fulfilled." It would appear the intent was not salvation especially seeing that he was not a believer.

Joh 6:65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
John 17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the Scripture might be fulfilled.

 

[unred typo]

Actually I was expecting to get lynched :-D Actually, I still might :wink:
Well atleast I won't get lynched alone

: that's the truth - and you won't be the last

I agree. The more the merrier. How could you be wrong? For broad is the way…

When the strong delusion comes, only those who aren't afraid to stand alone against the tide of 'expert' and well respected theologians and their overwhelming influence, will not be deceived.

 

[MrVersatile48]

Hi all!

I just had time to see OP & speed-read page 10 to make sure this Selwyn Hughes Word 4 Today is apt here:-

December 2


A Crucial Element

Acts 17:16--34
"... but now [God] commands all people everywhere to repent." (v. 30)

There are, of course, many reasons why some people move along the path of discipleship at a snail's pace, while others appear to cover twice the distance in half the time. It has much to do with the way we enter the Christian life.

Those who have studied the manner in which people become Christians tell us there are two main ways of coming to faith in Christ. One is through a dramatic conversion, whereby a person confronted with the claims of Christ yields to Him in a single moment.

The other is when a person moves more slowly into faith, and sometimes cannot even pinpoint the exact moment when he or she made the great surrender.

What must be remembered is that both experiences are valid.

The best evidence that we are alive is not our birth certificate but the fact we are going about our daily lives as living, breathing people.

I myself find no problem when individuals say they do not know the day or hour when they committed themselves to Christ, providing they show evidence that they belong to Him by such proofs as a desire to be alone with Him in prayer, a longing to know Him better through His Word, and an eagerness to meet and have fellowship with other believers.

But no matter how one enters the Christian life -- suddenly or slowly -- the most essential element is repentance. I have no hesitation in saying that if we do not understand what is involved in living repentant lives, then regardless of how we start the Christian life there will be no successful continuance.

Prayer:

My Father and my God, if repentance is so important -- and I see that it is -- then help me understand it more deeply. I am at Your feet. Teach me, dear Lord. In Jesus' Name I ask it. Amen.

For Further Study

Acts 3:11--20; Luke 13:3; Acts 17:21--32

1. What was Peter's message to the onlookers?
2. How important is repentance?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Even just reading that - before I saw this page, I was gonna say that I've often heard folk ask @ 'the unforgivable sin'

I'm sure that, without exception, the preachers & conference speakers have not only said what Jesus said - it's the blasphemy against the Holy Spirit - but have also explained that the best commentary on the Bible is the Bible itself, saying that it can therefore only mean rejecting the one-&-only way of salvation

All have added that if you are concerned about it - @ hurting God & grieving the Holy Spirit - then, by definition, you haven't committed it

The other thing that came strongly to me on reading that word, & was conformed in reading page 10 here, is to take this opportunity to encourage readers to 'study, to show yourselves approved unto God, a workman that needs not be ashamed, rightly dividing the Word of truth'

With a memory like mine, I sure need regular reminders!

In fact, I nearly hit 'send' without sharing that studies have also shown that the average convert to Christianity needs @ 64 exposures to God's Word before making the decision to commit their life to Christ - ("Engel Scale"?)

My 42 years of creative evangelism sure bore out the truth of 'precept upon precept, line upon line'

I recall sharing how the most moving moment of the recent UK Day of Prayer at NEC was the word about God drawing back the prodigals

Next 3.5 weeks are the best time each year to contact folk you ain't seen in ages, yes?

Please pray for my Laura Dawn - she turns 19 on 10 Dec if she's still alive - I haven't seen her for 3.5 years & regular enquiries have been blanks, be it with old school friends, police, social services & Missing Persons, etc

I just have to hold by faith to the fact that she gave her heart to Jesus in the few months that she lived with me at Southport AoG, before moving back to N Wales for a few months, then disappearing as soon as she left school: as a keen cadet, she may well have gone global backpacking & decided to stay incommunicado in some remote rural area - she may well be writing books/articles/screenplays under a pen name, as she was always impressed with the story of a successful comic book illustrator who lived in an isolated idyll

Whatever way she may have disguised her distinctive sandy hair & powder blue eyes - (coloured contacts, etc) - I'm sure even laser cosmetic surgery couldn't change the attractive slight turn in one eye: she's a slim 5' 4" & was last heard of in Prestatyn, where she was a cadet, but was in Rhyl High

I'm sure others have stories @ why this thread is especialy important

I'll sure make the time, Sun pm, to read it all, DV

God bless!

Ian

 

[MrVersatile48]

This prayer request adds more details & emphasises the funny side:-

http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopi ... 145#308145

We Scousers are famous for training ourselves to see the funny side of anything - 'better to laugh than to cry'

Bible versions inc, "He who is of a merry heart has a continual feast'


"Be thankful to God in all circumstances"

"...continually giving thanks & making melody in your hearts to the Lord"

Much more on that theme in the Merlin Carothers classics, 'From Prison To Praise' & 'The Power of Praise'

Must go

God bless!

Ian

 

[Jay T]

Was Judas Iscariot a believer?
Was he saved?
Did he lose his salvation?

Judas was an example of those who 'HAD' their names in the book of Life...then, had their names removed later.

 

[golfjack]

reply

Why don't we try to examine Hebrews 10:26-29.

Verse 6 says, for if we sin wilfilly after that we have received the knowledge of the truth..... That sin couldn't just be referring to any sin, for if it was referred to any sin, then 1 John 1:9 wouldn't be true. 1 Jiohn 1:9 promises us that if we confess our sins, God is faithful and just to forgive us and to cleanse us of all unrighteousness.

Therefore, Hebrews 10:26 is talkming about the sin of rejecting Christ.There's a principle for all Christians, of course. But in New Testament days, the Jerwish Christians were tempted to go back into Judaism because of the difficulties of following Christ. Many were cut off from their families, and were having it rough, not only financially, but also becuse of great persecution.

Some of them were tempted to go back to their old life of Judaism, but to do that they would have to deny that Christ is the Son of God. Hebrews 10:29 says the unpardonable sin is trodding under foot the Son of God.

To deny that Christ is the Son of God is the sin Hebrews 10 is referring to. It's the same as turning away from Him, rejecting Him saying, I don't want Jesus anymore. The Bible is saying that if mature believers ( Heb 6: 5, having tasted the good Word of God) willfully and deliberately deny Christ, there isn't any more sacrifice for their sins.

Therefore, the sin the Bible is addressing here is denying Christ, not some other sin a Christian may commit in his lifetime. But one of the areas where Satan has wreaked great havoc in the Body of Christ is in the area of the unpardonable sin.


May God bless, golfjack

 

[jgredline]

Judas was an example of those who 'HAD' their names in the book of Life...then, had their names removed later.

Sorry Jay T
But Potluck has it right. Judas was not a believer. He never was.....

For you to say that God erased his name from the lambs book of life is flat crazy....What kind of God do you think we worship? Never mind, I forgt that Ellen G white is your God....



JUDAS ISCARIOT [JOO duhs iss KAR ih uht]  the disciple who betrayed Jesus. Judas was the son of Simon (John 6:71), or of Simon Iscariot (NRSV). The term Iscariot, which is used to distinguish Judas from the other disciple named Judas (Luke 6:16; John 14:22; Acts 1:13), refers to his hometown of Kerioth, in southern Judah (Josh. 15:25). Thus, Judas was a Judean, the only one of the Twelve who was not from Galilee.
The details of Judas’ life are sketchy. Because of his betrayal of Jesus, Judas, however, is even more of a mystery. It must be assumed that Jesus saw promise in Judas, or He would not have called him to be a disciple.
Judas’ name appears in three of the lists of the disciples (Matt. 10:2–4; Mark 3:16–19; Luke 6:14–16), although it always appears last. His name is missing from the list of the 11 disciples in Acts 1:13; by that time Judas had already committed suicide. Judas must have been an important disciple, because he served as their treasurer (John 12:6; 13:29).
During the week of the Passover festival, Judas went to the chief priests and offered to betray Jesus for a reward (Matt. 26:14–16; Mark 14:10–11). At the Passover supper, Jesus announced that He would be betrayed and that He knew who His betrayer wasâ€â€one who dipped his hand with him in the dish (Mark 14:20), the one to whom He would give the piece of bread used in eating (John 13:26–27). Jesus was saying that a friend, one who dipped out of the same dish as He, was His betrayer. These verses in John indicate that Judas probably was reclining beside Jesus, evidence that Judas was an important disciple.
Jesus said to Judas, “What you do, do quickly†(John 13:27). Judas left immediately after he ate (John 13:30). The first observance of the Lord’s Supper was probably celebrated afterward, without Judas (Matt. 26:26–29).
Judas carried out his betrayal in the Garden of Gethsemane. By a prearranged sign, Judas singled out Jesus for the soldiers by kissing him. The gospels do not tell us why Judas was needed to point out Jesus, who had become a well-known figure. It is possible that Judas disclosed where Jesus would be that night, so that He could be arrested secretly without the knowledge of His many supporters (Matt. 26:47–50).
Matthew reports that, realizing what he had done, Judas attempted to return the money to the priests. When the priests refused to take it, Judas threw the money on the Temple floor, went out, and hanged himself. Unwilling to use “blood money†for the Temple, the priests bought a potter’s field, which became known as the “Field of Blood†(Matt. 27:3–10). This field is traditionally located at the point where the Kidron, Tyropoeon, and Hinnom valleys come together.
It is difficult to understand why Judas betrayed Jesus. Since he had access to the disciples’ treasury, it seems unlikely that he did it for the money only; 30 pieces of silver is a relatively small amount. Some have suggested that Judas thought that his betrayal would force Jesus into asserting His true power and overthrowing the Romans. Others have suggested that Judas might have become convinced that Jesus was a false messiah, and that the true Messiah was yet to come, or that he was upset over Jesus’ apparent indifference to the law and His association with sinners and his violation of the Sabbath. Whatever the reason, Judas’ motive remains shrouded in mystery.
Acts 1:20 quotes Psalm 109:8 as the basis for electing another person to fill the place vacated by Judas: “Let another take his office.†When the 11remaining apostles cast lots for Judas’ replacement, “the lot fell on Matthias. And he was numbered with the eleven apostles†(Acts 1:26).

Nelson's new illustrated Bible dictionary.

 

[jgredline]

Many sought salvation by their on hand.

This is still true. Simply look through this thread and one can see that ''works'' are a part of salvation instead as a ''result of salvation''

I don't think Judas was a believer.

Joh 6:62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
Joh 6:64 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.

Judas was given to betray Christ so "the scriptures would be fulfilled." It would appear the intent was not salvation especially seeing that he was not a believer.

Joh 6:65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
John 17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the Scripture might be fulfilled.

Thanks PotLuck, good post

 

[jgredline]

I agree. The more the merrier. How could you be wrong? For broad is the way…

When the strong delusion comes, only those who aren't afraid to stand alone against the tide of 'expert' and well respected theologians and their overwhelming influence, will not be deceived.

:-D :-D :-D

 

[golfjack]

reply

Hebrews 6:4 says, For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened..... I believes this refers to getting under conviction. The preaching of the Word enlightens the sinner. It's like the prodigal son when he came to himself ( Luke 15:17). Through the preaching of God's Word, the sinner sees that he is lost. He's enlightened about the truth of God's Word and he sees his need for a savior. Therefore, this condition refers to one who isn't saved in nthe first place.


Hebrews 6:4 says.... and have tasted of the heavenll gift.... A man under conviction has not yet tasted of the Heavenly Gift, because Jesus is the Heavenly gift.

Hebrews 6:4 says.... and were partakers of the Holy Ghost. I believe this verse means more than being born again and becoming acquainted with the Holy Spirit through His indwelling Presence ( John 14:16, 17). It refers to being filled with the Holy Spirit, having received the baptism in the Holy Spirit ( Acts 1:5; 2:4).

Hebrews 6:5 says, and have tasted the good word of God...I believe this verse can't apply to baby Christians. They haven't tasted the good Word of God. Baby Christians are still on the sincere milk of the Word. First Peter 2:2 tells us: As newborn babies, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby. I believe those who have had some degree of spiritual growth and who fully understand the seriousness of denying Christ and are experienced in the solid meat of the Word could be guilty of committing this sin.

Hebrews 6:5 says tasted the...the powers of the world to come. I believe the powers of the world to come are spiritual gifts. Those who have tasted of the powers of the world to come are mature Christians who have the gifts of the Spirit operating in their lives or ministries. I believe that these ensuing gifts is the earnest of our inheritence in the world to come ( Eph. 1:13, 14; 2 Cor. 5:5).

So there are five qualifications a believer would have to meet before he or she could be guilty of committing the unpardonable sin. You can readily see that very few believers could qualify to be guilty of committing this sin.

I know I am in the minority here, but I lerarned much at Rhema and we didn't study about things like Reformed Christianity, calvanists Thelogy, and other teachers you bring before me. We just studied the Bible.


May God bless, golfjack

 

[unred typo]

golf jack wrote: Some of them were tempted to go back to their old life of Judaism, but to do that they would have to deny that Christ is the Son of God. Hebrews 10:29 says the unpardonable sin is trodding under foot the Son of God.


I agree, golfjack. The knowledge of the truth for them was the truth that Jesus as the Son of God was qualified to give commands that superseded the ten commandments and that he was the fulfillment of the rites of the OT and that his blood is the sacrifice that supersedes all the OT sacrifices and takes away our sins when we repent and confess them. By leaving the principles of Christ, and looking to any other means of justification besides the blood, they had rejected the only way to be saved. There is no other sacrifice sufficient for removing our sin.

This is what some have done today when they deny the truth that Jesus taught which is to live according to love for one another and God, and to be repentant and rely on the blood to wash away their sins (daily as they realize that they have sinned.) By making another gospel other than what Jesus preached, they have trodden underfoot the Son of God and reduced the message of Christ into a workless faith that cannot save. This is not unforgivable but must be repented of and confessed as sin. If one does not repent and do the works Jesus commands, they have only a fearful judgment to look forward to.
:o

 

[destiny]

Those of you who don't see conditional security the way I do are of your father the devil.

:-D :wink: :bday:

 

[guibox]

Those of you who don't see conditional security the way I do are of your father the devil.

:-D :wink: :bday:

oscar or Solo :P ...are you posting as an alternate identity???

 

[golfjack]

reply

Destiny, What do you mean by conditional security. And I hope you were not calling my father tbe devil. I rebuke that in the name of Jesus.



May God bless, golfjack

 

[destiny]

Re: reply

Destiny, What do you mean by conditional security. And I hope you were not calling my father tbe devil. I rebuke that in the name of Jesus.



May God bless, golfjack

Jack, I was only kidding around, thats why I used the little emoticons.

Conditional security means there are conditions you must meet in order to stay secure in your salvation, such as obedience for example.
It means if you stop maintaining your relationship with God you can backslide and fall away.

 

[golfjack]

reply

I am so sorry Destiny. Won't you forgive me?



May God bless, golfjack