JoJo's answer about tongues

[Cornelius]

1Co 12:7 But to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit to profit withal.
1Co 12:8 For to one is given through the Spirit the word of wisdom; and to another the word of knowledge, according to the same Spirit:
1Co 12:9 to another faith, in the same Spirit; and to another gifts of healings, in the one Spirit;
1Co 12:10 and to another workings of miracles; and to another prophecy; and to another discernings of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; and to another the interpretation of tongues:
1Co 12:11 but all these worketh the one and the same Spirit, dividing to each one severally even as he will.

First thing that the Lord tells us, is that the gifts "profit withal"

So those who say it is without profit, are mistaken and not in agreement with the Lord.Now if you look at this scripture you will see that this is talking about the "gift of tongues". An easy way to understand this , is to look and see that "faith" is also in this list of gifts. So to argue then that tongues (all tongues) are not for everybody, would then mean that not all Christians have faith too, because faith is in the same list. We know that is not true, so this faith is something else. Its a "gift of faith". Now anybody who has received this gift at any time (it goes away after it is not needed anymore, like when the miracle is done) will tell you that it is powerful and you KNOW that what you are praying for will happen. Its not the same as normal faith.

The same with prophecy. Sometimes God will give a word through somebody and that does not mean that , that person can always run around prophesying.God is sovereign. Now in this case , tongues work the same. God will sovereignty give this gift to some,(not all) to speak in the church. As you can see, this scripture piece talks about the body of Christ and the gifts that profit the body.

So hopefully it will clear up the matter about "not all speak in tongues" I certainly do not speak in tongues in public. But God has given me a gift of faith, and on occasion the gift of healing, and prophecy. But later those went away and some came back again when needed.

 

[Cornelius]

Now lets look at the real church. You already know that the modern church scoffs at God's gifts, but this is not talking about them, this is talking about God's church as He ordained it:

1Co 12:28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondly prophets, thirdly teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, divers kinds of tongues.
1Co 12:29 Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles?
1Co 12:30 have all gifts of healings? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?
1Co 12:31 But desire earnestly the greater gifts. And moreover a most excellent way show I unto you.

Now these are permanent God "set" them in the church. You are an apostle, a teacher, a worker of miracles, etc. You have people who can always speak in tongues in the church , some who can always interpret and not just on occasion. Some are teachers and some are helpers and some govern.

So now we have part of the body who on occasion can speak and not always, and we have some that are in the list above, who are permanently anointed to do so.

 

[Cornelius]

You must realize that the early church was just human like you and I. So when the gifts first happened to them, they were without teaching and went a but wild with it. So Paul came back with instruction. From what Paul wrote, we can deduct that they must have had rather wild meetings, where they all spoke in tongues and there was not order in the church. So Paul started teaching them the rules. We all need the rules

So obviously some were walking around speaking in tongues to each other. Paul said that must stop, because it is a crazy thing to do. (Some churches still does this and the result is confusion)

1Co 14:6 But now, brethren, if I come unto you speaking with tongues, what shall I profit you, unless I speak to you either by way of revelation, or of knowledge, or of prophesying, or of teaching?


I will carry on later again JoJo, I have to run , my day has started

blessings
C

 

[JoJo]

Okay, I can accept that.

But I still don't see the difference between "tongues" as a special oral language and a "prayer language." I've never come across any Scripture that speaks directly of a "prayer language."

 

[JoJo]

I will carry on later again JoJo, I have to run , my day has started

No problem. Have a great day!

 

[GojuBrian]

I believe John Maccarthy's biblical perspective.

It didn't take me long to realize the tongues I have been around to realize that they are not from God.

Gibberish and foolishness is not Gods will for our worship. :crazy

I worship, praise, and pray in full understanding. The tongues I have heard are of no native language to anyone on earth.

 

[stranger]

1Co 12:7 But to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit to profit withal.
1Co 12:8 For to one is given through the Spirit the word of wisdom; and to another the word of knowledge, according to the same Spirit:
1Co 12:9 to another faith, in the same Spirit; and to another gifts of healings, in the one Spirit;
1Co 12:10 and to another workings of miracles; and to another prophecy; and to another discernings of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; and to another the interpretation of tongues:
1Co 12:11 but all these worketh the one and the same Spirit, dividing to each one severally even as he will.

First thing that the Lord tells us, is that the gifts "profit withal"

So those who say it is without profit, are mistaken and not in agreement with the Lord.Now if you look at this scripture you will see that this is talking about the "gift of tongues". An easy way to understand this , is to look and see that "faith" is also in this list of gifts. So to argue then that tongues (all tongues) are not for everybody, would then mean that not all Christians have faith too, because faith is in the same list. We know that is not true, so this faith is something else. Its a "gift of faith". Now anybody who has received this gift at any time (it goes away after it is not needed anymore, like when the miracle is done) will tell you that it is powerful and you KNOW that what you are praying for will happen. Its not the same as normal faith.

The same with prophecy. Sometimes God will give a word through somebody and that does not mean that , that person can always run around prophesying.God is sovereign. Now in this case , tongues work the same. God will sovereignty give this gift to some,(not all) to speak in the church. As you can see, this scripture piece talks about the body of Christ and the gifts that profit the body.

So hopefully it will clear up the matter about "not all speak in tongues" I certainly do not speak in tongues in public. But God has given me a gift of faith, and on occasion the gift of healing, and prophecy. But later those went away and some came back again when needed.

Hi Cornelius,

Not all speak in tongues after the manner of the present series of videos .

blessings

blessings

 

[stranger]

I believe John Maccarthy's biblical perspective.

It didn't take me long to realize the tongues I have been around to realize that they are not from God.

Gibberish and foolishness is not Gods will for our worship. :crazy

I worship, praise, and pray in full understanding. The tongues I have heard are of no native language to anyone on earth.

Hi GojuBrian,

Hopefully you are not becoming a Macarthurite! I am glad that you used the expression 'the tongues I have been around' and 'the tongues I have heard' - because none of us can speak beyond what our experience would allow.

Like you what I have heard (and seen) did not convince me of its authenticity for decades until I met what seemed to be an ex-alcoholic unassuming fellow who prayed for a man in a language I understood and then briefly in what can only by called 'tongues of fire.'

I had never previously heard anyone EVER pray like that before (in a language I did understand ) and briefly in the tongue I did not understand. It is like me thinking I had seen the stars a thousand times in the night sky and then seeing the stars for the first time in central Australia.

blessings

 

[mutzrein]

Okay, I can accept that.

But I still don't see the difference between "tongues" as a special oral language and a "prayer language." I've never come across any Scripture that speaks directly of a "prayer language."

Hi Jo - What do you think of 1 Corinthians 14:2? - 'For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God. Indeed, no one understands him; he utters mysteries with his spirit.'

Do you not see 'speaking' to God as prayer?

 

[Dave Slayer]

Okay, I can accept that.

But I still don't see the difference between "tongues" as a special oral language and a "prayer language." I've never come across any Scripture that speaks directly of a "prayer language."

Hi Jo - What do you think of 1 Corinthians 14:2? - 'For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God. Indeed, no one understands him; he utters mysteries with his spirit.'

Do you not see 'speaking' to God as prayer?

Mutzrein, could you please interpret this for me? Thanks!

"alla balla bella kemma, juru arauku bamma, warteh spiruh juannacarama fonsitana gillutrala"

 

[shad]

Do you not see 'speaking' to God as prayer?

Why would anyone pray without knowing what he is praying for? He might even be praying to evil one.

.

 

[duval]

Hi to any and all

I believe a careful study of the scriptures will show that the miraculouos gift of tongues passed with the infantcy of the church.

God bless,
duval

 

[radorth]

Hi to any and all

I believe a careful study of the scriptures will show that the miraculouos gift of tongues passed with the infantcy of the church.

God bless,
duval

Premises: Tongues passed with the infancy of the church and the tongues I've heard sounds fake.

Conclusion: Rad woke up in the middle of the night basked in a warm, heavenly light speaking in tongues the devil gave him

He asked for a fish and got a stone. Hence, Jesus lied.

The logic seems to be, "We don't have it in our church and so it must have passed with the infancy of the church."

Or, "I heard tongues that was obviously fake, so it's not for today."

This logic is frightening, and is evidence the church is resisting God and using scripture plainly meant to bring order, not to stop the seeking and correct use of the gifts.

Love, Rad

 

[radorth]

Why would anyone pray without knowing what he is praying for? He might even be praying to evil one.

But Paul says we can pray with and without mental understanding, both in Romans and Corinthians!!

 

[duval]

Hi Radworth

Its not because the congregation I attend doesn't speak in tongues, nor is it because some tongues speaking has sounded fake, BUT because the scripture teaches they have passed. I'm not trying to be arrogant about it with you or anyone else.

God bless
duval

 

[radorth]

Hi Radworth

Its not because the congregation I attend doesn't speak in tongues, nor is it because some tongues speaking has sounded fake, BUT because the scripture teaches they have passed. I'm not trying to be arrogant about it with you or anyone else.

God bless
duval

That's fine. I am sure you are sincere and my response was only partially directed your way. I am suggesting that others experience it however rarely and there is no scripture suggesting any such thing. Paul wrote half the NT and kept on speaking in tongues more than anybody.

The only scipture on your side is that tongues is for the immature and they should put it away. That I can acknowledge, with the caveat that some of us would rather admit we are immature than be found saying God doesn't do this or that anymore.

Has it occurred to you that Chesterton was right that the problem with Christianity is that it has not been tried by the vast majority of Christians? I know what I experienced came from God. Call me immature, and whatever else you wish,but don't arbitrarily deny it came from God.

Sincerely, Rad

 

[lovely]

I disagree with the idea that tongues are not for today. 1 Corinthians warns us not to forbid tongues. I think there is an order to tongues as put forth in the Word, but many churches who profess, and place a wrong emphasis on tongues, do not follow that order in the slightest, and so this gives me cause to doubt them, no God's gift, but the people.

I do not think that tongues is for everyone, because first of all we see other gifts that follow the Holy Spirit's regeneration of the believer, and secondly Paul specifically says that not all will speak with tongues. He also warns us to not use our gifts for our own glory, or to lord over others, but I also see this happen with many churches where tongues are prominent, it is written into their doctrine, and I see those with tongues deny the Holy Spirit in the lives of their brothers and sisters. The Holy Spirit in needed for salvation.

I also see them take advantage of the poor, the widowed, and so forth with their false teaching and false gifts, and I see a lack of fruit. As I see it now, I would love to have the gift of tongues, if it's the Lord's will, but I feel like with all the counterfeit stuff, and the false teaching that surrounds the churches that idolize tongues, it is no longer a gift used to edify the body...it's bringing the body down, dividing, and causing confusion. I don't see myself as better because I don't have tongues, and I don't see myself as less...though I may be less in other ways...I see myself as one who is just looking to the Lord to give my what He desires for my life.

As far as the Holy Spirit praying for us, I believe that He does this for all believers, and not through tongues, but through His Spirit communicating with my spirit and with the Father. This is Scriptural, and I have had this happen for me personally as a widow unable to even utter prayers due to overwhelming grief, and yet the Lord poured out His Spirit generously on me and my children, and He blessed us with comfort, wisdom, and guidance, and answered unspoken prayers of my heart.

As I said before, I am not discontent, and if the Lord never gives me all the gifts, including tongues, I believe it is His will and I will be joyful in my portion. I am His vessel and willing to do His will only, and willing to suffer the shame of my brothers and sisters thinking less of me, that I do not have the Holy Spirit in my life, and that I lack faith, because I do not have the gift of tongues. If I ever receive the gift of tongues, I pray that the Lord will help me exercise it in away that edifies the body and glorifies Him only.

 

[Cornelius]

OK JoJo, I am back.

So now we have to look for a scripture that is "prayer" and where it connects to "tongues"
Please notice the difference here, because these tongues are not interpreted as in the previous scriptures

1Co 14:2 For he that speaketh in a tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God; for no man understandeth; but in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

These are the private tongues that you pray with:

1) Speaking unto God

Do you see that here the person is not speaking unto men (the previous scriptures spoke about speaking in the church.....to men)

2) Do you see that here.........no man understandeth So its not in the church, because in church somebody must interpret.

3) Here we speak mysteries.

 

[Cornelius]

Paul specifically says that not all will speak with tongues.

Lovely, you should read the thread from the beginning, I covered the section where Paul speaks about "not all speaking in tongues" (meaning not all will speak in church, not at all meaning you cannot pray in tongues in private )
blessings
C

 

[Cornelius]

OK JoJo, we have covered the part where Paul shows us that the GIFT of tongues is meant for church use and is not for everybody. And we have covered where he tells us about tongues in private which doe not exclude anybody.

Act 10:45 And they of the circumcision that believed were amazed, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Act 10:46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God.

All these people were speaking in tongues as the Spirit came upon them.

1Co 14:18 I thank God, I speak with tongues more than you all:
Paul would have really been cruel and proud if he said this to a group of Christians where not everybody could speak in tongues. He spoke to the Corinthians as a whole and could say this, because they all spoke in tongues. He was just more aware of the benefit and made sure that he spoke more in tongues than they did. Paul knew it was meant to edify him, and he made full use of it.

C