The week of the Passion

[Sparkey]

The "Busted Halo" describes itself as an online magazine for spiritual seekers. The article asks the question: Is the date of Jesus’ crucifixion in relation to the Passover different in the gospel of John than in the other gospels?

Fr. John (a contributor) tackles the question:

In the synoptic gospels, Jesus; “last supper” is clearly a Passover meal (Matt.26:17-20, Mark 14:12-17, Luke 22:7-16). Therefore, the crucifixion and death of Jesus takes place AFTER the passover meal. In John’s gospel, the “last supper” is described as a meal that takes place BEFORE the Passover (John 13:1). In John’s gospel, Jesus dies on the cross ON Passover. This enables John to make the theological and spiritual point that Jesus, the true “Lamb of God,” dies at the exact hour that the lambs that will be used for the Passover meals are being sacrificed in the Temple.

Some Scripture scholars have tried to reconcile this difference by pointing out that some groups of Jews in Jesus’ time, such as the Essenes, celebrated the Passover on a slightly different date–just as some Eastern Christians today celebrate Christmas on January 6 while Western Christians observe the feast on December 25. Thus all Jews in Jerusalem would not have been eating their Passover meal on exactly the same evening.

However, the discrepancy in dating is perhaps best explained with the realization that the author of the gospel of John was not concerned about dates in the way modern historians are, but was giving a testimony of faith about his community’s experience of the risen Lord.

While no one truly knows the exact YEAR of Jesus’ death, based on the information we have from the gospels most scholars fix the date at around 30 A.D.

So far, we've heard from several sources and my conclusion remains the same: Jesus is our Risen Lord. Even the OP agrees.

We know for sure that our Lord [is] risen...

 

[Sparkey]

Quoting: THE CRUCIFIXION OF JESUS, "John, however, seems to say that a Passover followed Jesus' crucifixion on Nisan 14."

"Seems" is too vague. John is saying that the crucifixion ocurred on a preparation day for a High Sabbath of Passover. There is two day wich are preparation day of a High Sabbath of Passover: 14th and 20th. If we asume that John did read the 3 synoptics, and that the synoptics states that the crucifixion was not the 14th; we only have the 20th as only possible day according to John.

The guy who wrote the book attempted to reconcile the New Moon observance with various known events. The thrust of his book centered on his conclusion based on his examination of the Jewish Holy Days as covered in his chapter, Astronomical Determination of the New Moon."

 

[Goinheix]

In "The Two Passovers" [chapter of this work] the possibility is examined that there were two Passovers according to the tradition of the Pharisees and pilgrims from the Diaspora. The Sadducean priests conducted the first Passover that included the slaying of the lambs. The Pharisees and many pilgrims observed a second "Passover" seder without the lamb. This calendar arrangement would have been possible in 30 CE, but not in 31 or 33 CE. Next, the Passover would sometimes fall on different days because the Sadducees used sunrise reckoning and the Pharisees used sunset reckoning. This will allow two Passovers in 30 or 31 CE. In 33 CE the observation of the new moon beginning the month was such that only one Passover was possible. By sunrise or sunset reckoning two Passovers are not possible in 33 CE.

There is not any evidence of such fabrication. There is not any sugestion that John is using one Passover and the synoptics a different one.

 

[Goinheix]

The "Busted Halo" describes itself as an online magazine for spiritual seekers. The article asks the question: Is the date of Jesus’ crucifixion in relation to the Passover different in the gospel of John than in the other gospels?

Fr. John (a contributor) tackles the question:

In the synoptic gospels, Jesus; “last supper” is clearly a Passover meal (Matt.26:17-20, Mark 14:12-17, Luke 22:7-16). Therefore, the crucifixion and death of Jesus takes place AFTER the passover meal. In John’s gospel, the “last supper” is described as a meal that takes place BEFORE the Passover (John 13:1). In John’s gospel, Jesus dies on the cross ON Passover. This enables John to make the theological and spiritual point that Jesus, the true “Lamb of God,” dies at the exact hour that the lambs that will be used for the Passover meals are being sacrificed in the Temple.

Some Scripture scholars have tried to reconcile this difference by pointing out that some groups of Jews in Jesus’ time, such as the Essenes, celebrated the Passover on a slightly different date–just as some Eastern Christians today celebrate Christmas on January 6 while Western Christians observe the feast on December 25. Thus all Jews in Jerusalem would not have been eating their Passover meal on exactly the same evening.

However, the discrepancy in dating is perhaps best explained with the realization that the author of the gospel of John was not concerned about dates in the way modern historians are, but was giving a testimony of faith about his community’s experience of the risen Lord.

While no one truly knows the exact YEAR of Jesus’ death, based on the information we have from the gospels most scholars fix the date at around 30 A.D.

So far, we've heard from several sources and my conclusion remains the same: Jesus is our Risen Lord. Even the OP agrees.

We know for sure that our Lord [is] risen...

So far we have read the four Gospels that contradict those sources.
Jesus is our Lord Risen, he was crucified on Thursday 20th Nisan and resurrected 3 days later on First fruits Sunday.
It does not matter how many times a lie is repeated or how many persons do it; remain a lie.

 

[Goinheix]

The guy who wrote the book attempted to reconcile the New Moon observance with various known events. The thrust of his book centered on his conclusion based on his examination of the Jewish Holy Days as covered in his chapter, Astronomical Determination of the New Moon."

I did work the calendar for the year 30AD. That year, Nisan 20th was Thursday.

That guy did avoid - in porpouse - to include many detail that make his theory fail.

 

[Goinheix]

In reference to the crucifixion we have two aspects to determine: the day of the week and the date of the month.

I guess it was proven that Jesus did resurrect on Sunday.
That Jesus was dead for three days and three night, making the crucifixion day on Thursday.
That the Gospels do not mention the Friday at all.
That Matthew mention two consecutive sabbath days (thosee between Thu and Sun)

I also guess that it was proven that Jesus ended Nisan 14th alive and free.
That Jesus were not crucified on the High Sabbath Nisan 15th.
That Jesus were crucified on a preparation day for a High Sabbath of Passover.
That the two High Sabbath of Passover are the 15th and th 21st, being preparation day the 14th (wich Jesus ended alive and free) and the 20th.

Aditional I guees it was proven that Jesus were not crucified the same day of his arrest.
That the Gospels describe very long trials.
That the Gospels record deveral sunrises (several days)
That John states that Jesus was at pilates one day and was crucified next day.

This are sure biblical facts.

 

[Sparkey]

The guy who wrote the book attempted to reconcile the New Moon observance with various known events. The thrust of his book centered on his conclusion based on his examination of the Jewish Holy Days as covered in his chapter, Astronomical Determination of the New Moon."

I did work the calendar for the year 30AD. That year, Nisan 20th was Thursday.

That guy did avoid - on purpose - to include many details [that would] make his theory fail.

Thank you. I am considering your words as an "expert source".

Here is a scholarly article that considers probability:
It is a 13-page article entitled, "WHEN WAS JESUS CRUCIFIED? OR, WHAT'S SO GOOD ABOUT GOOD FRIDAY?" by Daniel W. Skubik. Published www.calbaptist.edu/dskubik/crucifix.pdf

In fact, a sampling of the Easter/Passover calendars covering the last three decades of this 20th century reveal 10 years (i.e. one-third of the 30 years surveyed) in which this preferred pattern fits: 1972, 1975, 1976, 1979, 1982, 1986*, 1989*, 1996, 1999, 2000.

For each of these years, you will find that the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread is a Thursday,
the Great Sabbath falls on the previous Friday, the preparation day is on Wednesday, and Easter is
celebrated the following Sunday.

That this often repeated pattern would have obtained during Jesus' lifetime is virtually certain;
that it was the pattern in the year of Jesus' crucifixion is not only plausible, but highly probable. 24

________
Footnote:
24 Permitting priestly adjustment of merely one day's time, thereby fixing the first day of the Feast on Thursday, April 6th, the traditional crucifixion date of CE 29 similarly becomes very plausible. See footnote 3, above, regarding traditional datings.

The two dates marked by an asterisk [1986*, 1989*] indicate those years wherein the Jewish Pesach and the western Christian celebration of Easter do not actually coincide. For 1986, Pesach began on Thursday, April 24th, but Easter Sunday was celebrated on March 30th; for 1989, Pesach began on Thursday, April 20th, while Easter Sunday fell on March 26th.

In fact, lack of concurrent dates for Easter and Passover in the western church's liturgical year is unfortunately all too frequent. This is due to the rejection of the Jewish calendar by Emperor Constantine, who was convener and head of the Council of Nicea in CE 325.

For the sake of uniformity in the church calendar and so that celebration of the resurrection would always occur on a Sunday, the name Easter was chosen (up to and until that Council's time the title of a pagan spring festival) to represent the first Sunday after the vernal equinox as the day of the resurrection.

The Council's specific determinations are lost to us, but Eusebius quotes from a letter by the Emperor to the churches admonishing acceptance of this festival change from the third day following the beginning of Pesach to the newly-calculated Easter, lest "in the celebration of this most holy feast we should follow the practice of the Jews, who have impiously defiled their hands with enormous sin . . . ." [The Life of the Blessed Emperor Constantine, III, xviii (London: S. Bagster & Sons, 1845)].

I reckon it sad that this touch of anti-Jewish sentiment continues to taint the celebration of the resurrection even today

 

[Sparkey]

Again, and for the third time (as you know) I am not presenting conclusion. I am presenting documentation for the view of others. My only stated conclusion is that Jesus is Risen.

Here then, CRUCIFIXION OF JESUS AFTER, NOT DURING PASSOVER FESTIVAL© by Aristeo Canlas Fernando, Peace Crusader, published: http://aristean.org/passover1.htm, excerpt presented here under "fair use".

Passover in August? Sorry but it goes against all we know.

He specifically looked at the "proleptic Gregorian Calendar in 1 BC". The proleptic Gregorian calendar is produced by extending the Gregorian calendar backward to dates preceding its official introduction in 1582.

He was not considering the ecclesiastical Full Moon as defined (according to "Calendars" by L. E. Doggett, reprinted by permission from "Explanatory Supplement to the Astronomical Almanac, P. Kenneth Seidelmann, editor, University Science Books, Sausalito) as the fourteenth day of a tabular lunation, where day 1 corresponds to the ecclesiastical New Moon. The tables are based on the Metonic cycle, in which 235 mean synodic months occur in 6939.688 days.

Since nineteen Gregorian years is 6939.6075 days, the dates of Moon phases in a given year will recur on nearly the same dates nineteen years laters. To prevent the 0.08 day difference between the cycles from accumulating, the tables incorporate adjustments to synchronize the system over longer periods of time. Additional complications arise because the tabular lunations are of 29 or 30 integral days. The entire system comprises a period of 5700000 years of 2081882250 days, which is equated to 70499183 lunations. After this period, the dates of Easter repeat themselves.

The following algorithm for computing the date of Easter is based on the algorithm of Oudin (1940). It is valid for any Gregorian year, "Y". All variables are integers and the remainders of all divisions are dropped. The final date is given by M, the month, and D, the day of the month.

C = Y/100,
N = Y - 19*(Y/19),
K = (C - 17)/25,
I = C - C/4 - (C - K)/3 + 19*N + 15,
I = I - 30*(I/30),
I = I - (I/28)*(1 - (I/28)*(29/(I + 1))*((21 - N)/11)),
J = Y + Y/4 + I + 2 - C + C/4,
J = J - 7*(J/7),
L = I - J,
M = 3 + (L + 40)/44,
D = L + 28 - 31*(M/4).

More about the Jewish "Civil" and "Religious" calendars may be learned here:
The Jewish Calendar and Sacred Festivals

 

[Sparkey]

As you say and I quote you "Just Facts, Please".

Please do not attribute the words of others that I have quoted as mine. That would be similar to if you quoted Jesus as my saying you said it, when you didn't. You said that Jesus said it. It's not all that difficult for me to understand that you are not Jesus, just because you quoted him.

We may both agree with the sentiment but those are not my words. Aeschylus said that "in war, truth is the first casualty," but I have no idea who was the first to say, "Just the facts, please." Certainly it wasn't me.

I have gone back through several posts and corrected quotes to include credit to the original authors.
Kindly pardon me for my part of any confusion here.

 

[Slider]

Every spring we get the same thing.... many folks all tied up in who is right about what day this or that happened ... It is about WHO arose and what would He think of the bickering?

While who arose is important, we must remember that He who arose said in John 4:24 that those who worship him must worship in spirit and in truth. He also said in Mat 4:4 and Luke 4:4 that man shall not live by bread alone but by every word of God.

 

[Goinheix]

Again, and for the third time (as you know) I am not presenting conclusion. I am presenting documentation for the view of others. My only stated conclusion is that Jesus is Risen.

Here then, CRUCIFIXION OF JESUS AFTER, NOT DURING PASSOVER FESTIVAL© by Aristeo Canlas Fernando, Peace Crusader, published: http://aristean.org/passover1.htm, excerpt presented here under "fair use".

Passover in August? Sorry but it goes against all we know.

He specifically looked at the "proleptic Gregorian Calendar in 1 BC". The proleptic Gregorian calendar is produced by extending the Gregorian calendar backward to dates preceding its official introduction in 1582.

He was not considering the ecclesiastical Full Moon as defined (according to "Calendars" by L. E. Doggett, reprinted by permission from "Explanatory Supplement to the Astronomical Almanac, P. Kenneth Seidelmann, editor, University Science Books, Sausalito) as the fourteenth day of a tabular lunation, where day 1 corresponds to the ecclesiastical New Moon. The tables are based on the Metonic cycle, in which 235 mean synodic months occur in 6939.688 days.

Since nineteen Gregorian years is 6939.6075 days, the dates of Moon phases in a given year will recur on nearly the same dates nineteen years laters. To prevent the 0.08 day difference between the cycles from accumulating, the tables incorporate adjustments to synchronize the system over longer periods of time. Additional complications arise because the tabular lunations are of 29 or 30 integral days. The entire system comprises a period of 5700000 years of 2081882250 days, which is equated to 70499183 lunations. After this period, the dates of Easter repeat themselves.

The following algorithm for computing the date of Easter is based on the algorithm of Oudin (1940). It is valid for any Gregorian year, "Y". All variables are integers and the remainders of all divisions are dropped. The final date is given by M, the month, and D, the day of the month.

C = Y/100,
N = Y - 19*(Y/19),
K = (C - 17)/25,
I = C - C/4 - (C - K)/3 + 19*N + 15,
I = I - 30*(I/30),
I = I - (I/28)*(1 - (I/28)*(29/(I + 1))*((21 - N)/11)),
J = Y + Y/4 + I + 2 - C + C/4,
J = J - 7*(J/7),
L = I - J,
M = 3 + (L + 40)/44,
D = L + 28 - 31*(M/4).

More about the Jewish "Civil" and "Religious" calendars may be learned here:
The Jewish Calendar and Sacred Festivals

1 - Using a calendar in a backward manner is not correct. In times of the passion the Roman calendar was the Julian. You must use the Julian.
2 - Actually, the only calendar that it matters is the Jew calendar, and it can be reconstructed - I did it - in base of astronomical calculations.

That article has no authority.

 

[Goinheix]

As you say and I quote you "Just Facts, Please".

Please do not attribute the words of others that I have quoted as mine. That would be similar to if you quoted Jesus as my saying you said it, when you didn't. You said that Jesus said it. It's not all that difficult for me to understand that you are not Jesus, just because you quoted him.

We may both agree with the sentiment but those are not my words. Aeschylus said that "in war, truth is the first casualty," but I have no idea who was the first to say, "Just the facts, please." Certainly it wasn't me.

I have gone back through several posts and corrected quotes to include credit to the original authors.
Kindly pardon me for my part of any confusion here.

If you quote a famous schoolar saying that the Moon is made of cheese, then I take it as you say the same.
That is why I dont argue with links.

 

[Goinheix]

In reference to the crucifixion we have two aspects to determine: the day of the week and the date of the month.

I guess it was proven that Jesus did resurrect on Sunday.
That Jesus was dead for three days and three night, making the crucifixion day on Thursday.
That the Gospels do not mention the Friday at all.
That Matthew mention two consecutive sabbath days (thosee between Thu and Sun)

I also guess that it was proven that Jesus ended Nisan 14th alive and free.
That Jesus were not crucified on the High Sabbath Nisan 15th.
That Jesus were crucified on a preparation day for a High Sabbath of Passover.
That the two High Sabbath of Passover are the 15th and th 21st, being preparation day the 14th (wich Jesus ended alive and free) and the 20th.

Aditional I guees it was proven that Jesus were not crucified the same day of his arrest.
That the Gospels describe very long trials.
That the Gospels record several sunrises (several days)
That John states that Jesus was at pilates one day and was crucified next day.

Those are facts direct from the Bible.

 

[Sparkey]

As you say and I quote you "Just Facts, Please".

Please do not attribute the words of others that I have quoted as mine. That would be similar to if you quoted Jesus as my saying you said it, when you didn't. You said that Jesus said it. It's not all that difficult for me to understand that you are not Jesus, just because you quoted him.

We may both agree with the sentiment but those are not my words. Aeschylus said that "in war, truth is the first casualty," but I have no idea who was the first to say, "Just the facts, please." Certainly it wasn't me.

I have gone back through several posts and corrected quotes to include credit to the original authors.
Kindly pardon me for my part of any confusion here.

If you quote a famous schoolar saying that the Moon is made of cheese, then I take it as you say the same.
That is why I dont argue with links.

Although I agree that you may call me a liar, I personally don't like it. I won't return the favor, but may correct you.

 

[Sparkey]

That the two High Sabbath of Passover are the 15th and th 21st, being preparation day the 14th (wich Jesus ended alive and free) and the 20th.

This is your statement and you've rightly said, "I also guess..." before you made that declaration. The fact of the matter is, and I believe you know this, we do not know the exact year of the crucifixion of our Lord. Just as we do not know the precise year of his birth. Now, let me be clear, I do not disagree with either of your two statements quoted here. What you've said is probably the best guess I've heard. It does pass the "Test of Jonah," for instance.

 

[Goinheix]

As you say and I quote you "Just Facts, Please".

Please do not attribute the words of others that I have quoted as mine. That would be similar to if you quoted Jesus as my saying you said it, when you didn't. You said that Jesus said it. It's not all that difficult for me to understand that you are not Jesus, just because you quoted him.

We may both agree with the sentiment but those are not my words. Aeschylus said that "in war, truth is the first casualty," but I have no idea who was the first to say, "Just the facts, please." Certainly it wasn't me.

I have gone back through several posts and corrected quotes to include credit to the original authors.
Kindly pardon me for my part of any confusion here.

If you quote a famous schoolar saying that the Moon is made of cheese, then I take it as you say the same.
That is why I dont argue with links.

Although I agree that you may call me a liar, I personally don't like it. I won't return the favor, but may correct you.

I dont recall calling you a liar.
I propose you focus on the issue and try to mess it.
I also sugest you avoid to post links because I will take it as all in that links is your personal opinion.

 

[Sparkey]

I dont recall calling you a liar.

To use your style of reply, I don't recall saying that you have called me a liar.


I have not, for instance, said that the moon was made of cheese. You may say what you want about me, even go as far as call me a liar, and say that I said that the moon was made of cheese, if you like. I will not do the same in return, because I do understand your opinion and your guess. But, and having said that, I do reserve the right to correct any false impression that you create (on purpose) in what seems to be your desire to obfuscate or 'becloud' opinions other than your own.

So then, you may be interested in the opinion of — Jack W. Langford, from Burleson, Texas who would agree with you, and has disagreed with the RCC authority, Tim Staples (previously quoted). Here's a quick summary of what he said in reply to an article published, quoting Staples:

I just received your latest edition of This Rock and I was especially interested in the article by Tim Staples on "How Do We Explain the Passover ‘Discrepancy’?" (May/June 2007). I happen to have been doing a lot of research on this subject and I immediately saw a serious "discrepancy" in Mr. Staples’ article.

Mr. Staples said, "And remember, that means the fourteenth of Nisan would have been Thursday. This would have been the day of preparation when the Lamb was slain and the Passover meal eaten in the evening."

Now all four facts that I emphasize are very accurate. At the time Christ died the fourteenth of Nisan was a Thursday, and that day was called "the day of preparation," and in the evening the regular Passover meal was eaten.

However, under the heading "Just The Facts, Please" Mr. Staples immediately says, "We know for certain that our Lord died on Friday (cf. Matt. 27:62; Mark 15:42; Luke 23:54, and John 19: 31)."

It just so happens that each one of the verse references cited above from Matthew, Mark, Luke and John all say the very same thing: namely that the day Christ was crucified was "the day of preparation." And the day of preparation, as you noted before, was Thursday, not Friday! So the one thing "we know for certain" is that our Lord DID NOT DIE on Friday!

But Jack W. Langford of Burleson, Texas didn't leave it at that either. He played what I'm sure he considered his trump card. He quoted a pope who had made a declaration in April of 2007.

Here's what the Pope said:

In the narrations of the evangelists, there is an apparent contradiction Between the Gospel of John, on the one hand, and what, on the other hand, Matthew, Mark, and Luke tell us. According to John, Jesus died on the cross precisely at the moment in which, in the Temple, the Passover lambs were being sacrificed. His death and the sacrifice of the lambs coincided. This means that he died on the eve of Passover, and that, therefore, he could not have personally celebrated the paschal supper; at least that is what it would seem.

On the contrary, according to the three synoptic evangelists, the Last Supper of Jesus was a paschal supper, in its traditional form. He introduced the innovation of the gift of his body and blood. This contradiction, until a few years ago, seemed impossible to resolve . . .

The discovery of the manuscripts of Qumran has led us to a convincing possible solution that while not accepted by all, is highly probable. We can now say that what John referred to is historically correct. Jesus truly spilled his blood on the eve of Passover at the hour of the sacrifice of the lambs. However, he celebrated Passover with his disciples probably according to the calendar of Qumran, that is to say, at least one day earlier —he celebrated without a lamb, like the Qumran community who did not recognize the Temple of Herod and [who] was waiting for a new temple.

(Zenit.org, qtd. in The Wanderer, April 19, 2007)

Now, strangely I find that I agree with the pope when he said, "This contradiction seemed impossible to resolve." What about you? I'm pretty sure that Tim Staples, Jack Langford of Burleson Texas, and yes, even that pope would agree with me when I declare, "He is Risen!"

Also note the dates on these conversations. We are entering into an ancient conversation here. The discussion is older than you, even older than me, if you can believe that. It is. Disregarding what others have said in the flow of our conversation is not an option that I will agree to.

 

[Goinheix]

Now, strangely I find that I agree with the pope when he said, "This contradiction seemed impossible to resolve." What about you? I'm pretty sure that Tim Staples, Jack Langford of Burleson Texas, and yes, even that pope would agree with me when I declare, "He is Risen!"

Also note the dates on these conversations. We are entering into an ancient conversation here. The discussion is older than you, even older than me, if you can believe that. It is. Disregarding what others have said in the flow of our conversation is not an option that I will agree to.

What I can tell you is that everybody do recognice the aparent contradiction. That too many have tried out because it is very important to solve that aparent contradiction. That despite of all efforts they have failed.
I can also tellyou that I have solved the aparent contradiction. That for some obscure reason the founding of the solution is not celebrated but keept silence by all means.
That the solution for all contradictions is by understanding that the four Gospels are not portraying a crucifixion on the same day of the arrest.
That the solution for all contradiction is by accepting the Gospels when point the Thu 20th as crucifixion date.

 

[Slider]

In reference to the crucifixion we have two aspects to determine: the day of the week and the date of the month.

I guess it was proven that Jesus did resurrect on Sunday.
That Jesus was dead for three days and three night, making the crucifixion day on Thursday.
That the Gospels do not mention the Friday at all.
That Matthew mention two consecutive sabbath days (thosee between Thu and Sun)

I also guess that it was proven that Jesus ended Nisan 14th alive and free.
That Jesus were not crucified on the High Sabbath Nisan 15th.
That Jesus were crucified on a preparation day for a High Sabbath of Passover.
That the two High Sabbath of Passover are the 15th and th 21st, being preparation day the 14th (wich Jesus ended alive and free) and the 20th.

Aditional I guees it was proven that Jesus were not crucified the same day of his arrest.
That the Gospels describe very long trials.
That the Gospels record several sunrises (several days)
That John states that Jesus was at pilates one day and was crucified next day.

Those are facts direct from the Bible.

Jesus did not resurrect Sunday. Matthew 28 says he resurrected before the first day of the week. All the other gospels (like matthew) note only when the women arived, and that when they arrived, he was already gone. Not one acccount says he rose on Sunday.

Jesus was in the heart of the earth for three days and three nights. That totatlly disqualifies Thursday no matter when he rose from the dead. If he raised on Saturday like the Bible says, its only two days and two nights. If it was Sunday morning like you say, it is only two days, two nights and part of a night. No.... Thursday between 3 and 6 (it was more likely to be between 4:30 and 6....) does not count. Jesus asked the rhetorical question: are there not 12 hours in the day? (John 11:9). By default, there are also 12 hours in a night. And for the record, yes it does have to be 72 hours. By what authority would you say otherwise when Jesus defined what a day and night was? Jesus also said in Matthew 4:4 and Luke 4:4 that man shall not live by bread alone, but by EVERY WORD of God. Jesus also said that every jot and tittle was important and not to be overlooked (mat 5:18.

I want to point something else out to you regarding this... Acts 1:15 says there were ABOUT 120 in the upper room. In 2 Kings 9:32 Jezebel had two OR three eunichs with her. What is my point? If God wants to be vauge, he knows how to express himself. There may have been 115 or 125 in the upper room.... God said there were about that many which leaves leeway. However when Jesus said 3 days and 3 nights, it does not leave leeway.

Overall, if it were a matter of a couple of hours either way, I might not object. But you are talking about the loss of 12 to 24 hours! Furthermore, if you are stating that it doesn't have to be a full 72 hours, your arguement for a Thursday crucifixion is no stronger than those who believe it was on a Friday.

Matthew does mention 2 Sabbaths, but it does not say and is impossible that they were back to back. I will give two reasons:

1. The Bible mentions the Pharasees asked that the tomb be guarded in case his JEWISH followers were plotting to steal the body. When were the soldiers guarding the tomb? During the Sabbath? Not likely. They wouldn't have needed to because no work could be done during the Sabbath.
2. When did the women buy spices for annointing Jesus' body and when did they prepare them? Mark 16:1 says they bought them AFTER the Sabbath. Luke 23:56 says they prepared them BEFORE the Sabbath. Please tell me how they could've prepared the spices before they bought them. It is clear that there were two Sabbaths: they bought the spices after the High Sabbath, prepared them, then observed the weekly Sabbath. These facts make it pretty easy to disprove there was only one Sabbath. However, it also proves that they could not have been back to back Sabbaths because there would have been no time to buy or prepare the spices between the two Sabbaths.

Sometime later I might post a day by day account of what happened. For now.... Please tell me when the tomb was guarded and when the spices were purchased and made....

 

[Goinheix]

Jesus did not resurrect Sunday. Matthew 28 says he resurrected before the first day of the week. All the other gospels (like matthew) note only when the women arived, and that when they arrived, he was already gone. Not one acccount says he rose on Sunday.

Matthew 28 say that Jesus was resurrected when the women arrived early that Sunday
Mark 16:9 is saying that Jesus did resurrect on Sunday.
Jesus did resurrect on Sunday