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LAW

Oh boy, do I ever really hate to bring this up with you but.......
YLT
2Co 3:6 who also made us sufficient to be ministrants of a new covenant, not of letter, but of spirit; for the letter doth kill, and the spirit doth make alive.
2Co 3:7 and if the ministration of the death, in letters, engraved in stones, came in glory, so that the sons of Israel were not able to look stedfastly to the face of Moses, because of the glory of his face--which was being made useless,
KJV

2Co 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
2Co 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
>

2Co 3:11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

The only letter written and engraven in stone was the 10 Commandments.

Deu 4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.
Deu 9:9 When I was gone up into the mount to receive the tables of stone, even the tables of the covenant which the LORD made with you, then I .....

We can also say the law is not of faith.

The reason Abraham was commended by God as obedient was that he received God's law directly from God.

because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws. Genesis 26:5

The reason Abraham kept God's laws was because he was given God's laws and commandments.

The key is - obeyed My Voice...

Faith comes by hearing God.

The letters written is stone are now replaced with God Himself writing them on our hearts and in our minds.


This scripture doesn't mean God's law of do not lie is done away with, rather is means that how this law was implemented through the law of Moses was to be done away with.

But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not steadfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

As we see from the book of Revelation, liars will be punished according to God's law that is still in force.

But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”
 
We can also say the law is not of faith.

The reason Abraham was commended by God as obedient was that he received God's law directly from God.

because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws. Genesis 26:5

The reason Abraham kept God's laws was because he was given God's laws and commandments.

The key is - obeyed My Voice...

Faith comes by hearing God.

The letters written is stone are now replaced with God Himself writing them on our hearts and in our minds.
I agree.

This scripture doesn't mean God's law of do not lie is done away with, rather is means that how this law was implemented through the law of Moses was to be done away with.
I agree again.
But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not steadfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

As we see from the book of Revelation, liars will be punished according to God's law that is still in force.

But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”
My whole point is that the old covenant has been made obsolete, which included the 10.
That said that does not mean that we are somehow lawless. I hate to think what a lawless people would look like.
As you said, the Lord Himself has written His law on our hearts.
And as JB said of the Law is summed up in 'Love your neighbor as yourself."
Jesus said, "Love your neighbor as I have loved you." That's raising the bar.
 
I really hope we can have a civil discussion without you twisting and changing what I have said.
I'm not twisting anything.

You say that 'love your neighbor as yourself' is an eternal law of God that existed outside of, and before, and after the law of Moses. I agree. But you say the exact same law in the law of Moses has vanished away. How does that work?

I'm baiting. If you would just honestly answer your own argument you'd see that what passed away was the WAY of the law of Moses, not the righteousness of the law of Moses. That still gets fulfilled/ upheld/ satisfied to this very day, but in the new way of the Spirit of God and faith in Christ. This was God's promise, that the day would come when he would move us to keep his law, not discard it in favor of some other law.


So far I have let you get away with a little, like your reference to "law haters", of which I see Deb didn't appreciate.
Be careful. I did not call either one of you law haters. It would be very dishonest of you and Deborah to say I'm calling you law haters here: "I know this is not going to be easy for you, or a lot of other people indoctrinated by centuries of law hating babble."

You and Deborah did not invent this law hating babble. You and Deborah probably don't know the history of the church, but it is Jew/ law haters that developed the erroneous doctrines of the law of Moses that we have all innocently been indoctrinated with. Thankfully, we have the written word of God to expose that error. But the church is so saddled with this indoctrination that most firmly resist the plain words of Paul that says when we walk in our faith we are actually upholding and fulfilling the law of Moses, not getting rid of it!

What vanished away was the law of Moses in regard to literal first covenant worship, not the law of Moses in regard to 'love your neighbor as yourself'. More can be added to that but I think this will suffice for now.


I will not hesitate to report your post's if you try to degenerate this thread into another one that will get closed as you see your position crumbling underneath you again, and you only hope is get the thread closed.
I know how forums work. Even if I wanted to call you a law hater I would not knowing the mods would be all over it in a sec. So just relax and answer my question at the beginning of this post if you want to take the time to explain your doctrine. That's what this forum is for. This is a designated place for that very purpose. And everybody is here voluntarily.
 
Loving your neighbor as yourself is the fulfillment of of the law. But if you are loving your neighbor as yourself, you need no law.
Where did you learn this? In the written words of the Bible, perhaps? Why does Paul in effect write the law down for us in his letters to the churches teaching us what we are to do?

What you are doing is confusing the need for written 'law' with no longer being subject to the futile WAY of trying to serve God through mere written words. You need a written or oral law to learn what the law is. What you don't need is that written/oral word to make you do it! We now have the Spirit in abundance to do that. The old WAY of serving God through the powerlessness of written/oral law alone is what passed away, not the righteousness of the law itself. It is in this way--the new way of the Spirit--that the law of Moses gets fulfilled, not nullified, to this very day.
 
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Absolutely not!

That's where you and I dis-agree.

The law of Moses was temporary.

Unless you can explain away the word UNTIL, then you are trying to push a string uphill.


JLB
The WAY of the law of Moses was added for a time. Eternal precepts of God were temporarily housed in the way and system of the first covenant. That is what has been laid aside. That is what has 'disappeared' from the law now that the accomplishment that allowed that change to happen has happened.
 
Okay, good. We might make some headway here:

We are made dead to sin, meaning our relationship to sin is dead.
You say, 'relationship to sin'. That's good. You can see that the old 'marriage' we had was with sin, not the law.


But sin is not dead to us. We still have sin in our members.

Rom 7:5 - For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death
Look at what you are quoting here. "When we were in the flesh--that is still married to sinful flesh--that is when we were in bondage to then husband 'flesh'. Paul is saying the law acted like a marriage license that enforced our marital bondage to the authority of husband sinful flesh so that we did what that husband told us to do.

Without the law, sin in our members is dead, but the moment we try to use the law to live a pleasing life to God, sin in our members is revived and our functional christian life(the way we should live) is dead and we are allowing sin to reign in our lives.
Now explain to us how one 'uses the law to live a pleasing life to God'. Then we'll test to see if Paul and others use the law that way to teach the church how to live a pleasing life to God. I know exactly where I'm going to take you from here. And I'm doing it to show you that I am NOT endorsing what you and others think I'm endorsing.


God does not want us to live our lives under a law, because we will constantly see that sin in our members and sin is not dead to us. But sin shall not have dominion over us, for we are dead to sin and alive unto God and we should reckon ourselves to be dead indeed unto sin.
Explain what it looks like for a person to 'live under a law', then we'll go from there. I will show you I'm not in this thread telling people to be under the law as you are probably meaning that. But let's first see what 'under the law' means to you.
 
Oh boy, do I ever really hate to bring this up with you but.......
YLT
2Co 3:6 who also made us sufficient to be ministrants of a new covenant, not of letter, but of spirit; for the letter doth kill, and the spirit doth make alive.
2Co 3:7 and if the ministration of the death, in letters, engraved in stones, came in glory, so that the sons of Israel were not able to look stedfastly to the face of Moses, because of the glory of his face--which was being made useless,
KJV

2Co 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
2Co 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
>

2Co 3:11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

The only letter written and engraven in stone was the 10 Commandments.


Deu 4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.
Deu 9:9 When I was gone up into the mount to receive the tables of stone, even the tables of the covenant which the LORD made with you, then I .....
Why do you hate to bring this up with him?

But anyway, it's easy to see that what got written on stone is not what 'disappeared'. The stone--the WAY of the first covenant--is what disappeared. Paul calls the laws themselves that were written on the tablets, and which we uphold in this New Covenant, 'the law of Moses' in this New Covenant. We should not be afraid to, either. We just need to understand it is the way of the law of Moses that has disappeared, not the righteousness of the law of Moses--and that it's okay to call the righteousness of the law of Moses that remains 'the law of Moses'. Paul does.
 
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I'll second that.
For the believer, the law does not have the authority to hold you in bondage to the dictates of former husband 'flesh'. The law only has power to do that for the one still married to sinful flesh.

If a believer is in bondage to former husband sinful flesh it is not because s/he has been acknowledging the righteousness of the law of Moses. It is because they are trying to serve God in the old WAY of the law of Moses, not that they are trying to serve God according to the righteousness of the law of Moses.
 
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Okay, good. We might make some headway here:


You say, 'relationship to sin'. That's good. You can see that the old 'marriage' we had was with sin, not the law.



Look at what you are quoting here. "When we were in the flesh--that is still married to sinful flesh--that is when we were in bondage to then husband 'flesh'. Paul is saying the law acted like a marriage license that enforced our marital bondage to the authority of husband sinful flesh so that we did what that husband told us to do.


Now explain to us how one 'uses the law to live a pleasing life to God'. Then we'll test to see if Paul and others use the law that way to teach the church how to live a pleasing life to God. I know exactly where I'm going to take you from here. And I'm doing it to show you that I am NOT endorsing what you and others think I'm endorsing.



Explain what it looks like for a person to 'live under a law', then we'll go from there. I will show you I'm not in this thread telling people to be under the law as you are probably meaning that. But let's first see what 'under the law' means to you.
Paul has already shown us, what it looks like to live under the law. Rom 7: 7-25. In these verses Paul, is being an ensample for us, to show us why we can not use the law to live out our christian lives because he already tried.

Rom 7:9 - For I was alive without the law once(this is after his conversion in Damascus): but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.( When Paul started to use the law "thou shalt not covet", sin revived..and it wrought in all manner of concupiscence.

A person would use the law to restrain sin, but it can't be done. Sin is to powerful. If a person tries to use the law to restrain sin, then that person is allowing to sin to have dominion and reign in their lives.
 
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Paul has already shown us, what it looks like to live under the law. Rom 7: 7-25. In these verses Paul, is being an ensample for us, to show us why we can not use the law to live out our christian lives because he already tried.

Rom 7:9 - For I was alive without the law once(this is after his conversion in Damascus): but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.( When Paul started to use the law "thou shalt not covet", sin revived..and it wrought in all manner of concupiscence.
You need to be more specific. You're not explaining how one uses the law to live out their Christian life. Are you saying simply reading the law and knowing what the law says is what it means to try to live out the Christian life by the law?
 
The WAY of the law of Moses was added for a time. Eternal precepts of God were temporarily housed in the way and system of the first covenant. That is what has been laid aside. That is what has 'disappeared' from the law now that the accomplishment that allowed that change to happen has happened.


You just added your own words to scripture, in order to change what the bible says to align with your own pet doctrine.

Here is what the bible actually says -

What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made... Galatians 3:19


There were transgressions to God's commandments and law, before the law was added.

The very reason the law was added, was to show Abraham's descendants the stipulations to God's Covenant with them through Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

The law was added...until the Seed.

Jesus said, the law and the prophets were until John...



You have one three more payments on your house, until they are paid, the house belongs to them.

After they are paid the house no longer belongs to them, but it is yours, free and clear.



JLB
 
Huh? I never said anything about a jot or tittle disappearing. Where did you get that from?
Post #406: "We cannot pick and choose or change one jot or tittle of the Law of Moses which scripture calls the old covenant."


I said that Jesus did not destroy the law.
I said that we cannot destroy the law by tearing it apart into segments. The ceremonial laws are just one part of the whole covenant.
Jesus changed the 'jots and tittles' of the law concerning temple, priesthood, and sacrifice, but he did not change the law concerning 'love your neighbor as yourself'. So, that negates your claim.

How does one not keep a law and fulfill a law?
Let's use some law that you or I can actually do? Not something only Jesus could do.
Okay, good. You're asking the right question.

The Feast of UnLeavened Bread is a perfect example. The law requires that you cleanse your house of all leaven after you have observed the Passover. We don't do that in this New Covenant, because we don't HAVE to do that in this New Covenant. Why don't we have to, anymore? Because we fulfill that requirement when we cleanse the household of our bodies, the church, of the leaven of sin.

See? We don't keep the law of the Feast of UnLeavened Bread, yet it is fulfilled when we purge the household of believers of the leaven of sin.


Please address this thought that was in my last post.
Quote:
"What I see is that the old and temporary 'way' to fulfill God's eternal law was the Law of Moses at that time.
The new and eternal 'way' to fulfill God's eternal law is to abide in Christ."
This is exactly what I've been saying. The WAY we fulfill the righteousness of the law of Moses has changed, not the righteous requirements of the law of Moses themselves. The new WAY to fulfill the righteousness of the law of Moses is through faith in Christ and the Spirit of God. The problem is people refuse to accept that Paul said this new WAY--the way of faith--does in fact uphold the law of Moses. We've all been trained by centuries of erroneous indoctrination that we can't say that. Even though Paul plainly says it in our Bibles.


Do you not see that the law of God to 'love your neighbor as yourself" was in effect from the very beginning of the world. It did not start with the Law of Moses.
(You may have to refresh your memory of what you are addressing here in post #416 to make sense of my response)

Do you think Passover, Sabbath keeping, circumcision, and animal sacrifice for sin started with the law of Moses? The point being, we most certainly can, and must, distinguish between ceremonial and moral law. Otherwise we all have to keep these laws, too, because they were before the law of Moses, just as 'love your neighbor as yourself' was before the law and why we have to keep it.


Why would my faith in Jesus fulfill a marriage contract I was never in with God? God didn't make a marriage contract with me or you at Mt. Sinai. That marriage contract was made between God and the children of Israel.
Remember that Paul even uses this analogy in Romans. The husband that is dead is the old covenant, and wife is then free to marry another. She becomes the bride of Christ and is brought through faith in Him, into the new covenant.
The premise for your argument, "why would my faith in Jesus fulfill a marriage contract I was never in with God?", is false, therefore, your argument is false. That premise being "the husband that is dead is the old covenant" and that you say you were called to a marriage with Christ, the New Covenant, not the old husband the old covenant.

In Romans 7:1-6, Paul is not saying the old covenant is the old husband. He is saying sinful flesh is the old husband. Sin is the old husband who used to have authority over us. And he's saying the law acted like a marriage license that kept us bound to sinful flesh, enforcing the authority and power of sin to keep you 'married' to him and doing what he wants you to do (that is, of course, sin).

But in salvation that marriage partner, sinful flesh, dies. And the power of the law to keep you bound like a marriage contract in marital (un)bliss to sin no longer has the authority to enforce a relationship that has ended. It ended because when a death has occurred in a marriage the marriage ends and the person still alive is no longer married and is free to remarry. In this case, the widow who used to be maritally bound to sinful flesh is now free to marry Jesus Christ. And in this relationship the thing that acts as the marriage license to enforce husband Jesus' authority over you, to make you do what he wants, is the Holy Spirit.

I learned this from our Messianic brothers: We in the church have been taught (indoctrinated) that the bad guy in Romans is the law. But the bad guy is actually sinful flesh--sinful flesh that cannot, and will not submit to the righteous requirements of the law of Moses. The way of the law is only the bad guy in that it is not an effective way to deal with sinful flesh. In and of itself it is holy, just and good.

So the problem is fallen flesh. The remedy is not the way of the written code, but that does not make the law of Moses itself the bad guy--lacking glory, relatively speaking, but not bad. Holy and righteous good guy, 'law' (the way of law) is set aside in favor of a way that does work with fallen flesh--the way of the Spirit and faith in Jesus Christ. The new way 'faith' does not change what good guy--but old way--'law' tried to do. Faith just does it in a different way. A way that actually works. A way that is by comparison to good, but old guy law infinitely more glorious.


I don't understand what you are saying in what I made blue.
Jethro: "Again, I point you to the laws governing sacrifice for sin. Faith does not get rid of those. Those requirements are forever and eternal, froward and backward in all of time and space."

The point being, people dismiss the law of Moses on the basis that it was temporary (and only for the Jews). But the requirement for animal sacrifice for sin is before the law of Moses, too, but has been 'dismissed'.
 
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Jethro said -

Look at what you are quoting here. "When we were in the flesh--that is still married to sinful flesh--that is when we were in bondage to then husband 'flesh'. Paul is saying the law acted like a marriage license that enforced our marital bondage to the authority of husband sinful flesh so that we did what that husband told us to do.

that is when we were in bondage to then husband 'flesh


Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ...

For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death.


2 For the woman who has a husband is bound by the law to her husband as long as he lives. But if the husband dies, she is released from the law of her husband. 3 So then if, while her husband lives, she marries another man, she will be called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from that law, so that she is no adulteress, though she has married another man. 4 Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another--to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God. 5 For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death. 6 But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter. Romans 7:2-6


Delivered from the law...


Israel was married to the One who gave them the law. The Lord, before He became flesh.

“not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them, says the LORD.

and again -

For your Maker is your husband,
The LORD of hosts is His name;
And your Redeemer is the Holy One of Israel;
He is called the God of the whole earth. Isaiah 54:5


He became flesh and died, so they are no longer bound by the law of their Husband, now their are married to the One who is raised from the dead, Jesus Christ.



JLB
 
You need to be more specific. You're not explaining how one uses the law to live out their Christian life. Are you saying simply reading the law and knowing what the law says is what it means to try to live out the Christian life by the law?
*Note* When I am say "you", You're* or whatever, I am not specifically talking about you, but any person in general. Please don't take me as personally attacking you. Thank you

A person would use the law to restrain sin or how to run their lives. But not just the law of Moses, they would use their own law, or a law their pastor gave them.

Thou shalt not Covet - each time you examine yourself to that commandment, all manner of concupiscence is wrought in. Now your conscience is defiled and now your really not going to covet, then all manner of concupiscence is wrought in. Its a never ending cycle. Instead walking in the newness of life that was given to us, we are worried about not coveting and the sin of lust is very much alive to us and the way you are to live is dead.

Same goes for man made laws. Thou shalt not watch t.v. - every time you sneak a peak at the t.v. you have defiled your conscience and you have sinned.

Here is another one. Thou shalt tithe every Sunday. Your under a law, and your tithing is not pleasing God.
Thou shalt wear a Suit and Tie. Thou shalt be baptized in water. Thou shalt not///Thou shalt do....its all law. And if a Christian is living this type of life, that Christian is in the flesh and cannot please God.

A Christian should live under grace. Grace has no limits. Grace is God's greatest power. God teaches us how to utilize this power.

When a temptation arises, a Christian should not do it because God said thou shalt not. A Christian doesn't do it because God has made them dead to sin, or a Christian does it, because it brings God the most glory. The Spirit has baptized us into Christ. We are dead with Christ, buried with Christ, and raised with Christ and are seated in heavenly places with Christ.

But this is just the beginning. We have the rest of Romans-Philemon where God teaches us how to utilize this great power of Grace. How to Walk in the Spirit(The way God has made us) and not to walk after the flesh(under a law or even living unto God through the power of our flesh).
 
*Note* When I am say "you", You're* or whatever, I am not specifically talking about you, but any person in general. Please don't take me as personally attacking you. Thank you

A person would use the law to restrain sin or how to run their lives. But not just the law of Moses, they would use their own law, or a law their pastor gave them.

Thou shalt not Covet - each time you examine yourself to that commandment, all manner of concupiscence is wrought in. Now your conscience is defiled and now your really not going to covet, then all manner of concupiscence is wrought in. Its a never ending cycle. Instead walking in the newness of life that was given to us, we are worried about not coveting and the sin of lust is very much alive to us and the way you are to live is dead.

Same goes for man made laws. Thou shalt not watch t.v. - every time you sneak a peak at the t.v. you have defiled your conscience and you have sinned.

Here is another one. Thou shalt tithe every Sunday. Your under a law, and your tithing is not pleasing God.
Thou shalt wear a Suit and Tie. Thou shalt be baptized in water. Thou shalt not///Thou shalt do....its all law. And if a Christian is living this type of life, that Christian is in the flesh and cannot please God.

A Christian should live under grace. Grace has no limits. Grace is God's greatest power. God teaches us how to utilize this power.

When a temptation arises, a Christian should not do it because God said thou shalt not. A Christian doesn't do it because God has made them dead to sin, or a Christian does it, because it brings God the most glory. The Spirit has baptized us into Christ. We are dead with Christ, buried with Christ, and raised with Christ and are seated in heavenly places with Christ.

But this is just the beginning. We have the rest of Romans-Philemon where God teaches us how to utilize this great power of Grace. How to Walk in the Spirit(The way God has made us) and not to walk after the flesh(under a law or even living unto God through the power of our flesh).


Our effort is to be filled with God's Spirit, and lead by the same.

Grace is the power of God to us that we may do what we could not, without it.

On this we agree!


JLB
 
Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ...

For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death.


2 For the woman who has a husband is bound by the law to her husband as long as he lives. But if the husband dies, she is released from the law of her husband. 3 So then if, while her husband lives, she marries another man, she will be called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from that law, so that she is no adulteress, though she has married another man. 4 Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another--to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God. 5 For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death. 6 But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter. Romans 7:2-6


Delivered from the law...


Israel was married to the One who gave them the law. The Lord, before He became flesh.

“not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them, says the LORD.

and again -

For your Maker is your husband,
The LORD of hosts is His name;
And your Redeemer is the Holy One of Israel;
He is called the God of the whole earth. Isaiah 54:5


He became flesh and died, so they are no longer bound by the law of their Husband, now their are married to the One who is raised from the dead, Jesus Christ.



JLB
This is what I've been saying. Deborah said the old husband is the law. But we can see that the law is not the husband. The law is what binds people married to the flesh (not Christ) to sin like a marriage contract binds a woman to the authority and will of her husband.

So, now, with the death of old husband 'flesh', the law cannot be a marriage contract that binds us to a husband that is dead (marriage contracts end at death). So, now that we are free from old husband flesh and now married to Christ, instead of the law being that which kept us bound to sin, it becomes the righteousness that gets fulfilled in accordance with new husband's wants and desires for us. The Holy Spirit now being the 'license' that enforces that authority.
 
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This is what I've been saying. Deborah said the old husband is the law. But we can see that the law is not the husband. The law is what binds people married to the flesh (not Christ) to sin like a marriage contract binds a woman to the authority and will of her husband.

So, now, with the death of old husband 'flesh', the law cannot be a marriage contract that binds us to a husband that is dead (marriage contracts end at death). Now that we are married to Christ, instead of the law being that which kept us bound to sin, it's righteousness gets fulfilled in accordance with new husband's wants and desires for us. The Holy Spirit now being the 'license' that enforces that authority.


The Husband is the Lord not the flesh.

your quote:

that is when we were in bondage to then husband 'flesh'...
 
*Note* When I am say "you", You're* or whatever, I am not specifically talking about you, but any person in general. Please don't take me as personally attacking you. Thank you

A person would use the law to restrain sin or how to run their lives. But not just the law of Moses, they would use their own law, or a law their pastor gave them.

Thou shalt not Covet - each time you examine yourself to that commandment, all manner of concupiscence is wrought in. Now your conscience is defiled and now your really not going to covet, then all manner of concupiscence is wrought in. Its a never ending cycle. Instead walking in the newness of life that was given to us, we are worried about not coveting and the sin of lust is very much alive to us and the way you are to live is dead.

Same goes for man made laws. Thou shalt not watch t.v. - every time you sneak a peak at the t.v. you have defiled your conscience and you have sinned.

Here is another one. Thou shalt tithe every Sunday. Your under a law, and your tithing is not pleasing God.
Thou shalt wear a Suit and Tie. Thou shalt be baptized in water. Thou shalt not///Thou shalt do....its all law. And if a Christian is living this type of life, that Christian is in the flesh and cannot please God.

A Christian should live under grace. Grace has no limits. Grace is God's greatest power. God teaches us how to utilize this power.

When a temptation arises, a Christian should not do it because God said thou shalt not. A Christian doesn't do it because God has made them dead to sin, or a Christian does it, because it brings God the most glory. The Spirit has baptized us into Christ. We are dead with Christ, buried with Christ, and raised with Christ and are seated in heavenly places with Christ.

But this is just the beginning. We have the rest of Romans-Philemon where God teaches us how to utilize this great power of Grace. How to Walk in the Spirit(The way God has made us) and not to walk after the flesh(under a law or even living unto God through the power of our flesh).
If this is all true, that reading laws of 'don't do this', and 'do this' actually causes us to sin, why do the New Testament writers employ that technique in lengthy passages of scripture to teach us how to live?
 
If this is all true, that reading laws of 'don't do this', and 'do this' actually causes us to sin, why do the New Testament writers employ that technique in lengthy passages of scripture to teach us how to live?
The law causes no sin....we do. The law has no power and requires a power source(our flesh). But in our flesh dwelleth no good thing and the law is weak through the flesh.
 
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