Raptures – Tribulation

[Brother Mike]

That chart is mistaken. I am not even going to get into the numbers. Do you know how unbelievably poisonous it is to believe we can be justified by anything we do? "Missed the grace period" "justified by works?" Being beheaded for the sake of the Gospel does not secure salvation. It secures your PLACE in the Kingdom of God. Salvation is dependent on the blood of Jesus and ONLY the blood of Jesus. It is a free gift, and can not be received any other way. Do not be deceived.

Believing you can be saved by what YOU do is the single most dangerous belief there is. That is the mark of every false religion. Every person who is not in Christ, even atheistic humanists, tries to be justified by what their wickedly deceitful heart tells them to do.

When you used the word "Saved" and "Salvation" You refer to Eternal life with God or the actual meaning of the words?

The chart also seems to refer "Salvation" as Aionios Zoe and not soteria. I would not agree with that in the chart. It was a bad heart condition that would take the mark anyway, so the problem came before the action.

 

[JLB]

That chart is mistaken. I am not even going to get into the numbers. Do you know how unbelievably poisonous it is to believe we can be justified by anything we do? "Missed the grace period" "justified by works?" Being beheaded for the sake of the Gospel does not secure salvation. It secures your PLACE in the Kingdom of God. Salvation is dependent on the blood of Jesus and ONLY the blood of Jesus. It is a free gift, and can not be received any other way. Do not be deceived.

Believing you can be saved by what YOU do is the single most dangerous belief there is. That is the mark of every false religion. Every person who is not in Christ, even atheistic humanists, tries to be justified by what their wickedly deceitful heart tells them to do.

They profess to know God, but in works they deny Him, being abominable, disobedient, and disqualified for every good work. Titus 1:16

The abominable have their place in the lake of fire.


JLB

 

[Just a servant]

They profess to know God, but in works they deny Him, being abominable, disobedient, and disqualified for every good work. Titus 1:16

The abominable have their place in the lake of fire.


JLB

We are washed clean in the Blood of the Lamb. Good works are prepared for us by God, and our heart is only purified and made obedient by God. That is talking about those who intentionally blaspheme the Holy Spirit. Hard to imagine, I know, but there are more of them than you might think.

No more Scriptural origami please. Every heart is wickedly deceptive until God makes it clean.

 

[Just a servant]

When you used the word "Saved" and "Salvation" You refer to Eternal life with God or the actual meaning of the words?

The chart also seems to refer "Salvation" as Aionios Zoe and not soteria. I would not agree with that in the chart. It was a bad heart condition that would take the mark anyway, so the problem came before the action.

True wisdom has two sides. We choose between God and the world. In choosing the world (I am not talking about those who are struggling; I mean those who CHOOSE this world), many are already effectively choosing the mark even though it hasn't shown up yet. Many are already worshiping a TALKING IDOL.

Why do we choose God over the world? God chose us. Why did he choose us? We chose Him over the world. And round and round we go. It's true love.

 

[Eugene]

That is true, but you might not know how. Many people play Scriptural origami like that. The heart is wickedly deceitful and the Word must be considered as a whole.


Temptation of Christ.

But the Holy Spirit still uses this to teach us lessons.

I’m not quite sure what you’re attempting to say, but I reckon I can modify what I originally said by adding the word “Context” to the scripture quoted. E.g., I try to not include the judgment of the church of Rev Chapters 2-3 to the time of Jacob’s trouble, or second half of the seven years applying mainly to Israel. I tend to adhere to dispensations when applicable such as with the dispensation given to the Apostle Paul alone hidden from prior ages and generations we read of in Col 1:25-26.

 

[Just a servant]

I’m not quite sure what you’re attempting to say, but I reckon I can modify what I originally said by adding the word “Context” to the scripture quoted. E.g., I try to not include the judgment of the church of Rev Chapters 2-3 to the time of Jacob’s trouble, or second half of the seven years applying mainly to Israel. I tend to adhere to dispensations when applicable such as with the dispensation given to the Apostle Paul alone hidden from prior ages and generations we read of in Col 1:25-26.

The only dispensation given to the Apostle Paul was a ministry to proclaim the Hope and Truth in Christ and to teach in the Spirit (Paul didn't teach anyone). Unless you are talking about the part about the Gentiles? Which general order of things do you adhere to? Scriptural origami has become a professional sport these days.

The Word of God must be considered as whole, precept on precept. Even context doesn't do much for us in many cases. Sometimes you have to jump half way through the Bible to find the corresponding second side of the wisdom.

 

[Eugene]

Believing you can be saved by what YOU do is the single most dangerous belief there is. That is the mark of every false religion. Every person who is not in Christ, even atheistic humanists, tries to be justified by what their wickedly deceitful heart tells them to do.

Believing something wrongly can do harm to our spiritual growth, or state of our walk in Christ, but not to our standing. Once we believe on Christ, our standing remains as a child of God, but to pursue the will of God we are to grow in grace and truth of our Lord Jesus. 2 Pet 3:18.

An example of that would be in Rom 14:1-3.
14:1 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.
Rom 14:2 For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.
Rom 14:3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.

 

[Just a servant]

Believing something wrongly can do harm to our spiritual growth, or state of our walk in Christ, but not to our standing. Once we believe on Christ, our standing remains as a child of God, but to pursue the will of God we are to grow in grace and truth of our Lord Jesus. 2 Pet 3:18.

An example of that would be in Rom 14:1-3.
14:1 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.
Rom 14:2 For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.
Rom 14:3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.

Withholding knowledge can be an act of mercy, and it is not our place to judge based on what we hear and see in this world. Check out the prophecy in Isaiah.

Our salvation is dependent on the blood of Christ, faith in Him (trust) - as opposed to trusting the world. If we trust what the rest of the entire world tells us, that we are justified by works, we have not trusted the blood of Christ.

Speaking of mysteries, the Greek mystics are interesting. Or should I say... physicalism atheists.

All world views trace to one of two places. God or Babylon.

 

[Eugene]

The only dispensation given to the Apostle Paul was a ministry to proclaim the Hope and Truth in Christ and to teach in the Spirit (Paul didn't teach anyone). Unless you are talking about the part about the Gentiles? Which general order of things do you adhere to? Scriptural origami has become a professional sport these days.

The Word of God must be considered as whole, precept on precept. Even context doesn't do much for us in many cases. Sometimes you have to jump half way through the Bible to find the corresponding second side of the wisdom.

I believe you to be wrong considering the revelation Paul was given (Gal 1:12) to fulfill the word of God according to Col 1:25. Are you speaking of examples given in the Old Testament written for our admonition? 1 Cor 10:11. If not please give scripture and examples of what you're attempting to say.

 

[n2thelight]

Will just put it plain and simple...CHrist shall not return until there is peace,(allbeit false)on this earth....That won't happen until the One World Government...

I Thessalonians 5:3 "For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape."

This "travail" is mentioned in Matthew 24, and Mark 13, as well as other places, and Jesus called it "Labor pains". Why? Because when it happens, the travail will be exactly as the contractions a woman has in labor. You will know ahead of time with plenty of warning, and as each prophetic event comes, those pains or events of the end times get closer and closer until the ones at the end are in rapid order, coming at the same time.
Jesus gave us the six sign to watch for, so that we would not be deceived. Yet most Christians today chose to not believe Jesus. These signs get closer and closer until the child is born. Only instead of the birth of a child; it will be the birth of a new age. That age is called, "Christ's Kingdom", or the millennium age.
When we know God's Word, we know He comes at the seventh trump, and the events, all events must come before then. It's in the Bible, so that we would not be deceived.

Matthew 24:6 "And ye shall hear of wars and rumors of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet."

There has never been a century of so many wars as there has been in the 1900s. Two of the wars included every nation on the earth, while there have been wars of nations, and peoples within nations. Wars of races, and wars of religions. We see that there are conflicts in Africa, and Europe, and as long as these conflicts are going on, you know that the end simply can not come; "but the end is not yet."

We are entering a different time, in this generation. We hear of wars, but for the first time in History, using the modern technology and the use of satellites, communication is as simple as lifting up a telephone to communicate around the world. When Prime minister Rabin of Israel was killed, and was laid to rest, people in every part of the world observed the events. These conflicts will keep going on in every part of the world, and it is a sign that the time of Christ's return is close, but not yet. There are other things and events [signs] that must come to pass also prior to the second advent.

Before the end comes there will be the cry of peace, and the entire world will go into a "New World Order", a new age government that will govern the affairs of all mankind as equals. This age started over forty years ago, and today has every nation in the world in it's charter as members. What is the opposite of wars and rumors of wars? It is peace, and rumors of peace. When the focus changes from war to peace, then that is the time to pay special attention.

When all these conflicts are settled with peace accords, then the one world order will be locked into it's final position. Peace accords have been settled in the far east between Chinas and England: In South Africa between blacks and whites: In Europe between Catholics and Protestants, and individual nations: Between the Communist and non-communist states, and the World at large is ripe for an end to conflict.

When this happens, the end is near. We will then see the political system, as we know it end, and from it will rise from the people of the world a new beast, a religious best, as spoken of in Revelation 13:3.

 

[Just a servant]

I believe you to be wrong considering the revelation Paul was given (Gal 1:12) to fulfill the word of God according to Col 1:25. Are you speaking of examples given in the Old Testament written for our admonition? 1 Cor 10:11. If not please give scripture and examples of what you're attempting to say.

Didn't you just say exactly what I just said?

 

[Just a servant]

Or are you talking about Acts 11:18? That was why I asked about the Gentiles.

 

[Eugene]

Or are you talking about Acts 11:18? That was why I asked about the Gentiles.

Just a servant, I was using the example I gave of the Apostle Paul having been given a dispensation none others ever heard. As for others, they believed Jesus was to start His reign at that very time and did not see the taking out of a people from the Gentiles at this present time, and thus the surprise when they too were filled with the Holy Spirit.

 

[Just a servant]

Eugene, read Acts. That mystery was only unheard of to those people. The Church already knew.

 

[Just a servant]

I should add that it was STRONGLY alluded to in the Gospels as well.

 

[Eugene]

Eugene, read Acts. That mystery was only unheard of to those people. The Church already knew.

Just a servant, was Peter and the other apostles part of the church? They didn't know.

 

[n2thelight]

One of the most talked about subjects today is the end times and all the events that surround those times. There is no reason that we be anxious of these times, for Jesus told us to wait patiently on Him. In Mark 13 Jesus is going to give His disciples, and to us the seven seals, and these seals are also recorded in the Book of Revelation. They are the seals that mark the end of this earth age of the flesh. The very word "Revelation" means "to reveal", to make known.

Christ would not His elect in the dark concerning the simplicity of His teaching, so Jesus is asked by three of His apostles here, as they are coming out of the Temple, when is the end of the world going to be. We know from Matthew 24:3, this is the actual wording of the question put to Jesus.


Matthew 24:3
"And as He sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto Him privately, saying, "Tell us, when shall these things be and what shall be the sign of "Thy coming, and the end of the world."

It is important that we understand the word "world" as used in the Greek manuscripts, is "aion", and "age, or an age of time". In the Hebrew, " `olam", which denotes a limited, or even an extended period of time, such as the context of each occurrence may demand. So as such, this is talking about the end of our present world age which is characterized by a special form of Divine administration or dispensation.
Jesus is giving us in this chapter the seven events that must come to pass to bring to an end to this age, and the return of Christ. There are many church traditions that have complicate the simplicity the Jesus is teaching here. This is why we should have our ear tuned to the Lord Jesus Christ, and not to man's traditions. So the subject to this entire chapter is, "When is the end of this world age, and what are the events that mark that coming."

Remember that the closing thought to the last chapter was the little widow that had enough faith to give all over her livelihood to God and put here trust in God for provision. So don't forget that the famine in the end times is not for the bread that you eat, but for the knowledge and truth of God's Word.


Amos 8:11
"Behold, the days come, saith the Lord God, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the Lord:"

There will be a famine coming very shortly for the knowledge, and for the hearing of the Word of God.

The rest can be read from the below link..........

http://www.theseason.org/mark/mark13.htm

 

[Just a servant]

Just a servant, I was using the example I gave of the Apostle Paul having been given a dispensation none others ever heard. As for others, they believed Jesus was to start His reign at that very time and did not see the taking out of a people from the Gentiles at this present time, and thus the surprise when they too were filled with the Holy Spirit.

Just a servant, was Peter and the other apostles part of the church? They didn't know.

Eugene

This comes down to a matter of perspective (and dating, which is linked to time, which is linked to matter). With God controlling time, perceived reality, and knowledge throughout the whole Bible (that beggar was encountered on the way in AND on the way out) I personally find it useful to focus on precepts instead.

Faith of the Canaanite woman

I often find that God makes me forget certain things just to remind me of them later at the moment he wants me to remember.

What is your real belief on this issue? You seem to have presented both sides.

 

[Just a servant]

Remember that the closing thought to the last chapter was the little widow that had enough faith to give all over her livelihood to God and put here trust in God for provision. So don't forget that the famine in the end times is not for the bread that you eat, but for the knowledge and truth of God's Word.

Why would the Truth be so lacking in a world where information is plentiful?

Why do most people want knowledge?

Anyways, both food and Truth are lacking. 22,000 children will testify to that tomorrow. And the next day. And the next day.

80% of the world lives on less than 10.00 per day and 50% (BILLIONS) of the world lives on less than 2.50 per day.

But hey....pretty colors in the sky on the 4th of July

True wisdom has 2 sides...

 

[Eugene]

Eugene

This comes down to a matter of perspective (and dating, which is linked to time, which is linked to matter). With God controlling time, perceived reality, and knowledge throughout the whole Bible (that beggar was encountered on the way in AND on the way out) I personally find it useful to focus on precepts instead.

Faith of the Canaanite woman

I often find that God makes me forget certain things just to remind me of them later at the moment he wants me to remember.

What is your real belief on this issue? You seem to have presented both sides.

Dear Just a servant, without scripture backing what you're attempting to say, I have a real problem following what you're even asking. When Jesus was presented with such ideas He replied with "It is written," and that sufficed to dispel Satan. We have the whole armor of God which is the word completely outside man's perspective, and in it lies the truth God wants us to have concerning His perfect will for us. I see a separation in them of the church, the word given us for this present time, and the resolute judgment of not preparing to have God's best.
If possible just ask a direct question using scripture if there is scripture suggesting what you would like to know. Thanks.