The gift of tongues.

[Stan53]

I didn't guarantee. Not sure what you mean by "sounds pretty Cajun."

Really? What is that word you used in post 98? I'll quote it for you, "I can all but guarantee " You've never heard the old Cajun colloquialism, "I garahntee" ?

I have read the first couple of chapters so there is no need to be condescending. It begins with:

The feeling of condescension is ALL on you my friend.

Act 1:13 And when they had entered, they went up to the upper room, where they were staying, Peter and John and James and Andrew, Philip and Thomas, Bartholomew and Matthew, James the son of Alphaeus and Simon the Zealot and Judas the son of James.
Act 1:14 All these with one accord were devoting themselves to prayer, together with the women and Mary the mother of Jesus, and his brothers.
Act 1:15 In those days Peter stood up among the brothers (the company of persons was in all about 120) and said, (ESV)
First it speaks of the whole group of them and then of the leadership of that group and the choosing of Judas' replacement. Now in Acts 2:1 there are two key words: "they" and "all."
Act 2:1 When the day of Pentecost arrived, they were all together in one place, (ESV)

That's NOT how grammar works. You go back to the last identification of they, which would be the 12. Of course if you like to practice eisegesis, you would do the gymnastics necessary to get to your POV.

The addition of "all" can change things since it is entirely unnecessary if speaking only of the 12. Without "all" it would very likely be referring to only the 12. But there really is no reason to not take Acts 2:1 as going back to verses 14 and 15 and referring to the 120, having finished the discussion of the choosing of the new Apostle.

The obvious reason ALL is used is because Jesus promised it to them. It would also ne necessary to confirm that Jesus supported the choosing of Mathias as one of the 12 in that he as well received the Holy Spirit. Jesus promised the "comforter" to his Apostles and told THEM to wait. Not the 120.

In the end it really doesn't matter. The only issue I can think of that could come of it is if someone were to use the idea that only the Apostles received the Holy Spirit to argue that then only the Apostles could impart the gift of the Holy Spirit, and therefore such died out with the last of the Apostles, putting an end to the gifts of the Spirit, including tongues.

ALL God's word matters. 2 Tim 2:15 is NOT to be ignored. Making sure we "rightly" divide the Word of truth is paramount or Paul would not have instructed it. Plenty of people alread try to deny the Holy Spirit today and on these forums. I have faith that the TRUTH in and of God's word will ALWAYS win out.

 

[Free]

Really? What is that word you used in post 98? I'll quote it for you, "I can all but guarantee " You've never heard the old Cajun colloquialism, "I garahntee" ?

Context is everything. Notice the "all but" prior to "guarantee"? And, no, I have never heard that colloquialism.

The feeling of condescension is ALL on you my friend.

No, you were condescending.

That's NOT how grammar works. You go back to the last identification of they, which would be the 12. Of course if you like to practice eisegesis, you would do the gymnastics necessary to get to your POV.

It sure can work that way.

The obvious reason ALL is used is because Jesus promised it to them. It would also ne necessary to confirm that Jesus supported the choosing of Mathias as one of the 12 in that he as well received the Holy Spirit. Jesus promised the "comforter" to his Apostles and told THEM to wait. Not the 120.

Luk 24:33 And they rose that same hour and returned to Jerusalem. And they found the eleven and those who were with them gathered together,
...
Luk 24:49 And behold, I am sending the promise of my Father upon you. But stay in the city until you are clothed with power from on high." (ESV)

Not just the eleven Apostles. That's at least 15 people but most likely many more than that.

ALL God's word matters. 2 Tim 2:15 is NOT to be ignored. Making sure we "rightly" divide the Word of truth is paramount or Paul would not have instructed it. Plenty of people alread try to deny the Holy Spirit today and on these forums. I have faith that the TRUTH in and of God's word will ALWAYS win out.

Whether it's 12 or 120 is of little relevance to what occurs in that passage.

 

[Stan53]

Context is everything. Notice the "all but" prior to "guarantee"? And, no, I have never heard that colloquialism.

I apologise. you didn't say guarentee. I didn't take the "all but" into account.

No, you were condescending.

No sorry I wasn't, but you sure can be. Shall I point it out every time you are?

Luk 24:33 And they rose that same hour and returned to Jerusalem. And they found the eleven and those who were with them gathered together,
...
Luk 24:49 And behold, I am sending the promise of my Father upon you. But stay in the city until you are clothed with power from on high." (ESV)

Not just the eleven Apostles. That's at least 15 people but most likely many more than that.

You want to use Luke to interpret what Acts is saying? WOW! That is definitely way out in left field. Just exactly where in Luke is the 12th apostle chosen?

Whether it's 12 or 120 is of little relevance to what occurs in that passage.

You keep saying this and yet you keep arguing and not leaving it alone. Talk about straining at gnats.

 

[Free]

You want to use Luke to interpret what Acts is saying? WOW! That is definitely way out in left field. Just exactly where in Luke is the 12th apostle chosen?

Out in left field? That Luke doesn't contain the account of the twelfth Apostle being chosen is completely irrelevant.

Luk 24:48 You are witnesses of these things.
Luk 24:49 And behold, I am sending the promise of my Father upon you. But stay in the city until you are clothed with power from on high."
Luk 24:50 Then he led them out as far as Bethany, and lifting up his hands he blessed them.
Luk 24:51 While he blessed them, he parted from them and was carried up into heaven. (ESV)

Act 1:3 He presented himself alive to them after his suffering by many proofs, appearing to them during forty days and speaking about the kingdom of God.
Act 1:4 And while staying with them he ordered them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the promise of the Father, which, he said, "you heard from me;
Act 1:5 for John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now."
.....
Act 1:8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth."
Act 1:9 And when he had said these things, as they were looking on, he was lifted up, and a cloud took him out of their sight. (ESV)

Unless you want to start arguing for two ascensions, they are talking of the same occurrence. So my previous point stands.

You keep saying this and yet you keep arguing and not leaving it alone. Talk about straining at gnats.

Is this not what happens in a discussion? I have answered and made my point but you continue to take issue with it so I then respond. It is not I who is arguing.

 

[Stan53]

Out in left field? That Luke doesn't contain the account of the twelfth Apostle being chosen is completely irrelevant.

Luk 24:48 You are witnesses of these things.
Luk 24:49 And behold, I am sending the promise of my Father upon you. But stay in the city until you are clothed with power from on high."
Luk 24:50 Then he led them out as far as Bethany, and lifting up his hands he blessed them.
Luk 24:51 While he blessed them, he parted from them and was carried up into heaven. (ESV)

Act 1:3 He presented himself alive to them after his suffering by many proofs, appearing to them during forty days and speaking about the kingdom of God.
Act 1:4 And while staying with them he ordered them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the promise of the Father, which, he said, "you heard from me;
Act 1:5 for John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now."
.....
Act 1:8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth."
Act 1:9 And when he had said these things, as they were looking on, he was lifted up, and a cloud took him out of their sight. (ESV)

Unless you want to start arguing for two ascensions, they are talking of the same occurrence. So my previous point stands.


Is this not what happens in a discussion? I have answered and made my point but you continue to take issue with it so I then respond. It is not I who is arguing.

Edited by staff The fact is ONLY Acts 1 talks about the replacement apostle and it follows it with Acts 2 and the word 'they'. You can bring out all the synoptic passages you want but it is OUT of context. Luke was the author in both, and his dealing with the FACTS are chronologically consistant.

Edited by Staff

 

[Free]

Yes you like that word 'irrelevant', you can use it all the time you don't want to accept truth.

No, I only use it when it's relevant.

The fact is ONLY Acts 1 talks about the replacement apostle and it follows it with Acts 2 and the word 'they'. You can bring out all the synoptic passages you want but it is OUT of context. Luke was the author in both, and his dealing with the FACTS are chronologically consistant.

It will be clear to any reader that you first stated: 'Jesus promised the "comforter" to his Apostles and told THEM to wait. Not the 120.' To which I have shown that that was not the case. Jesus clearly promised more than the eleven Apostles the power of the Holy Spirit. That was the point I was addressing.

Since you think that Luke is out of context, although it isn't, then you have a contradiction to deal with being that there are two ascensions from your point of view.