Will all born-again Christians make it to heaven?

[Guest]

It seems like everyone is going to heaven, in your opinion...

So why bother worrying anymore. It's all done!

Be that as it may, I am going to go to Mass right now and offer myself to the Father with Christ.

Not everyone, just those who have accepted Jesus into their hearts. Church isn't a building, church is the body of Christ that lives inside of us. Blessings.

 

[Deborah13]

" No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day."

The Father draws and we come. We can not come unless He draws but we still have to come.
He stands at the door and knocks, we have to open the door.

That's how I read it, anyway.

 

[Guest]

He stands at the door and knocks, we have to open the door.

and visa versa..

 

[Deborah13]

and visa versa..

Hey, urk. What are you thinking?

 

[Guest]

and visa versa..

Hey, urk. What are you thinking?

Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: is speaking about the unbeliever that is asking, seeking and knocking. Who is giving the Holy Spirit to the unbeliever as a gift by them asking, who is the unbeliever finding by them seeking, and who is opening the door for the unbeliever by them knocking. Blessings.

 

[Deborah13]

who is opening the door for the unbeliever by them knocking. Blessings.

Oh yeah, I forgot about this one. Thanks

 

[Grappler]

I am not "blatantly denying Scriptures", I just don't agree with your INTERPRETATION of them.

Clearly, this is about whether Jesus would reject a sinner who comes to Him for forgiveness. It is not even on the topic we are speaking about - perseverance UNTIL THE END.

This expression does not refer to the doctrine of perseverance of the saints, but to the fact that Jesus will not reject or refuse any sinner who comes to him and be forgiven.

"Him who comes": Ps 102:17; Is 1:18; Is 55:7; Mt 11:28; Lk 23:42-43; 1 Tim 1:15,16; Rev 22:17
persevere until the end. What does that mean to YOU?

Your opinion....Lets try this scripture out shall we? " No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day." John 6:44 Now we see here that you or I couldn't even choose Jesus to begin with on our own much less our works having any meaning on whether we perservere or not. You really need to let go of your pride in your works and focus on what Jesus did for you and be thankful and celebrate....those who sit around worrying about losing their salvation probably don't have it to lose to begin with.

I don't know anyone "sitting around worried about losing their salvation". Dude...

Those who are in Christ crucify the desires of the flesh. I hope you are working on that and not thinking some little 15 minute emotional experience grants you eternal bliss in heaven!

I pray that God grants me the persevance to remain in Him until the end. You should, too.

Have to go, I am going to go to Mass right now and offer myself to the Father in union with Christ. With Christ, I will say "This is my body" and "This is my blood". "Take it and do what you will with it, Heavenly Father"

Regards

Actually i can see the fear of losing your salvation in your very posts....dude. Your own words betray the fact that you do fear "not making it to heaven" and i kind of feel sad for you. If you understood scripture and knew God as a loving Father then you wouldn't have those doubts.

 

[Grappler]

" No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day."

The Father draws and we come. We can not come unless He draws but we still have to come.
He stands at the door and knocks, we have to open the door.

That's how I read it, anyway.

Yes but don't you know that Jesus said "ALL that the Father has given me will come to me"? Do you understand that Jesus will not lose any that the Father has given him? So that makes your point moot.

 

[Guest]

" No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day."

The Father draws and we come. We can not come unless He draws but we still have to come.
He stands at the door and knocks, we have to open the door.

That's how I read it, anyway.

Yes but don't you know that Jesus said "ALL that the Father has given me will come to me"? Do you understand that Jesus will not lose any that the Father has given him? So that makes your point moot.

I understand that. God the Father draws us in with his grace, but at the same speed we are asking, seeking and knocking.

 

[Grappler]

" No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day."

The Father draws and we come. We can not come unless He draws but we still have to come.
He stands at the door and knocks, we have to open the door.

That's how I read it, anyway.

Yes but don't you know that Jesus said "ALL that the Father has given me will come to me"? Do you understand that Jesus will not lose any that the Father has given him? So that makes your point moot.

I understand that. God the Father draws us in with his grace, but at the same speed we are asking, seeking and knocking.

Show me the scripture that says that statement please.

 

[Guest]

Show me the scripture that says that statement please.

Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: is speaking about the unbeliever that is asking, seeking and knocking. Who is giving the Holy Spirit to the unbeliever as a gift by them asking, who is the unbeliever finding by them seeking, and who is opening the door for the unbeliever by them knocking. Blessings.

 

[Grappler]

Show me the scripture that says that statement please.

Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: is speaking about the unbeliever that is asking, seeking and knocking. Who is giving the Holy Spirit to the unbeliever as a gift by them asking, who is the unbeliever finding by them seeking, and who is opening the door for the unbeliever by them knocking. Blessings.

Un no urk....the Holy Spirit is not given to unbelievers....it is given to believers. Do you actually believe that unbelievers have the Holy Spirit?

 

[Guest]

Show me the scripture that says that statement please.

Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: is speaking about the unbeliever that is asking, seeking and knocking. Who is giving the Holy Spirit to the unbeliever as a gift by them asking, who is the unbeliever finding by them seeking, and who is opening the door for the unbeliever by them knocking. Blessings.

Un no urk....the Holy Spirit is not given to unbelievers....it is given to believers. Do you actually believe that unbelievers have the Holy Spirit?

No, you misunderstood. When a person is asking, seeking and knocking they are still an unbeliever. Scripture is simply telling you what to do in order to become a believer. Yes, the Holy Spirit is given only to believers, but what did that person have to do to become a believer.

 

[Grappler]

Show me the scripture that says that statement please.

Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: is speaking about the unbeliever that is asking, seeking and knocking. Who is giving the Holy Spirit to the unbeliever as a gift by them asking, who is the unbeliever finding by them seeking, and who is opening the door for the unbeliever by them knocking. Blessings.

Un no urk....the Holy Spirit is not given to unbelievers....it is given to believers. Do you actually believe that unbelievers have the Holy Spirit?

No, you misunderstood. When a person is asking, seeking and knocking they are still an unbeliever. Scripture is simply telling you what to do in order to become a believer. Yes, the Holy Spirit is given only to believers, but what did that person have to do to become a believer.

No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day. John 6:44 And once again urk you are confused and using improper biblical hermaneutics. First of all you are making the assumption that Jesus is only telling unbelievers to ask and knock and seek. Second of all you blatantly deny scripture when it plainly says that only those whom the Father draws to Jesus will be saved. I guess that hurts your ego or something because you think that you chose God but if you are a true child of God ....he chooses you. You don't believe me? Then maybe you will believe scripture...check out Ephesians chapter 1.

 

[Deborah13]

"ALL that the Father has given me will come to me"?

Which scripture are you quoting, I can't find it. Thanks

 

[Guest]

No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day. John 6:44 And once again urk you are confused and using improper biblical hermaneutics. First of all you are making the assumption that Jesus is only telling unbelievers to ask and knock and seek. Second of all you blatantly deny scripture when it plainly says that only those whom the Father draws to Jesus will be saved.

You misunderstood again. Yes God the Father draws you in by his grace, but at the same time you're asking seeking and knocking at the same speed. You can't just sum up salvation with one scripture. Are you also forgetting Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For example, why would God draw an atheist into his salvation if God is the last thing on the atheist mind. No, the atheist has to ask, seek and knock. Notice the word seek. The atheist is starting to seek his own heart for answers.

 

[Guest]

@Grappler Let me correct myself. Matthew 7:7 is speaking about how a believer should pray. I may have gotten this confused with Romans 10:9. Good look on that man. ty. For so many years I thought Matthew 7:7 spoke of unbelievers, wow. But what about Romans 10:9, without the unbeliever confessing and believing there is no salvation. God the Father can draw them in, but they can also deny salvation, no?

 

[Guest]

The reason why I didn't understand that Matthew 7:7 was about prayer was because prayer is my weak spot with God. My theory was always, why pray when God already knows what you want and why go to church when the church already lives inside your body. @Grappler you are the man, you brought me to a revelation.

 

[Grappler]

"ALL that the Father has given me will come to me"?

Which scripture are you quoting, I can't find it. Thanks

John 6:37

 

[Grappler]

No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day. John 6:44 And once again urk you are confused and using improper biblical hermaneutics. First of all you are making the assumption that Jesus is only telling unbelievers to ask and knock and seek. Second of all you blatantly deny scripture when it plainly says that only those whom the Father draws to Jesus will be saved.

You misunderstood again. Yes God the Father draws you in by his grace, but at the same time you're asking seeking and knocking at the same speed. You can't just sum up salvation with one scripture. Are you also forgetting Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For example, why would God draw an atheist into his salvation if God is the last thing on the atheist mind. No, the atheist has to ask, seek and knock. Notice the word seek. The atheist is starting to seek his own heart for answers.

So according to you God draws us in simultaneously as we are asking?? So according to you it is kind of like the old question of which came first the chicken or the egg?? Wow...what an illogical stance...and unscriptural. Let me post this again. " No one came come to the Father unless he draws him to me.....I don't see Jesus mentioning anything about "asking" at the same time that God draws us in. You asked another illogical question about an atheist. I have some news for you urk there are many many people who used to be atheist that God did indeed "draw" into his family. I love Romans 10:9 only those to whom the Father draws will confess Jesus with their mouth and believe in their heart. Unless you think that Jesus was lying. Now urk this has nothing to do with the topic of this thread....a topic that we actually agreed on i thought...maybe you should start another thread if you would like to continue this discussion.totopic