Raptures – Tribulation

[Edward]

rome has enough problems without being babylon... (but maybe it is).... the comparisons of the roayl family(lond.n/britin) with the identifications in the Scripture show that it is at least a problem (to put it most politely !). (reference /ships/merchants/etc and brit history)
old ladies (grey haired) at a disciples sunday class laughed at the thought, the truth was so foreign to them !
(they weren't used to testing things by Scripture,
as their church didn't teach them to)

If I remember right, this is the video that pointed me towards the consideration of Mecca as being Babylon the Great described in scripture. I do not lay this down as fact, but as something which should be looked at, and scripturally confirmed for ourselves and your own conclusion reached for yourself, through prayer and diligence of study. It does speak about NYC and stuff also. I'm going to rewatch this again myself also, since it has been awhile since I have. Poke holes in it all you want. We all seek the truth.

 

[JLB]

I finely get it follower the why of how come you are so negative. You do not see Jesus ruling.You do not see Him as King..

Can any show me another place in Scripture that enplanes so directly what His Kingdom is.. This is the one i see..

Rom_14:17 For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.
Is the Holy Ghost for a future time or is He for today?

Where is the Holy Ghost today?

Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own? 1 Corinthians 6:19


The Holy Spirit works through people.

It has been given to man to subdue the earth and have dominion.

The Lord Jesus is seated in Heaven and rules through His people.


The Day will come when He will return and Physically rule here on Earth.

He will Physically remove all the lawless and wicked, and cast them into hell.

When He comes He Himself will put down all the rulers and authorities that are ruling, and He Himself will Physically rule here on Earth.

24 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 1 Corinthians 15:24

He alone is the Righteous Judge and will decide who is cast into hell and who wil live and reign with Him, until then we will all grow together until the Harvest!


That Day were are looking forward to.

That's not negative, That's the Bible.

What Preterism does, is spiritualize the truth of the plain scriptures, so that all the wicked have already been cast into hell and all of the evil rulers and authorities have been removed.


JLB

 

[Willie T]

The kingdom is not the act of waiting to be transported to someplace else.... it is touching living people's lives, RIGHT HERE AND NOW, with love and the real picture of God, as Jesus showed that likeness to us.

 

[follower]

The kingdom is not the act of waiting to be transported to someplace else.... it is touching living people's lives, RIGHT HERE AND NOW, with love and the real picture of God, as Jesus showed that likeness to us.

yes, thanks be to Yhvh in the Grace of Yeshua HaMaschiach for His Faithfulness WORKING IN His people now, today, every day, on earth.
the one big obstacle to His Life in those who believe in the story fable of the rapture that has been promulgated since 1832 (vs the rapture that really occurs when Yeshua returns as it is written in Scripture),
that one big obstacle that they will have to answer for to the Judge, (not to us),
IF they have fallen into that trap, (others may be uncertain about the fabled rapture, but they may do what Yhvh says certainly about other things in life ) ,
that trap though, to whom Yeshua says >
is "I was hungry, and you didn't feed me; I was thirsty and you didn't give me a drink of water; I was homeless and you did not make a place for me in your home or find me shelter..... "

 

[reba]

Where is the Holy Ghost today?

Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own? 1 Corinthians 6:19


The Holy Spirit works through people.

It has been given to man to subdue the earth and have dominion.

The Lord Jesus is seated in Heaven and rules through His people.


The Day will come when He will return and Physically rule here on Earth.

He will Physically remove all the lawless and wicked, and cast them into hell.

When He comes He Himself will put down all the rulers and authorities that are ruling, and He Himself will Physically rule here on Earth.

24 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 1 Corinthians 15:24

He alone is the Righteous Judge and will decide who is cast into hell and who wil live and reign with Him, until then we will all grow together until the Harvest!


That Day were are looking forward to.

That's not negative, That's the Bible.

What Preterism does, is spiritualize the truth of the plain scriptures, so that all the wicked have already been cast into hell and all of the evil rulers and authorities have been removed.


JLB

How is it you consider it spiritualization to simply, literally believe:
Rom_14:17 For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.


JLB you have labeled me a preterest ,,,

What Preterism does, is spiritualize the truth of the plain scriptures, so that all the wicked have already been cast into hell and all of the evil rulers and authorities have been removed

. when have i ever posted something like this? Use the 'search' feature find my post that reads something like you have equated to me...

 

[Deborah13]

Where is the Holy Ghost today?

Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own? 1 Corinthians 6:19


The Holy Spirit works through people.

It has been given to man to subdue the earth and have dominion.

The Lord Jesus is seated in Heaven and rules through His people.


The Day will come when He will return and Physically rule here on Earth.

He will Physically remove all the lawless and wicked, and cast them into hell.

When He comes He Himself will put down all the rulers and authorities that are ruling, and He Himself will Physically rule here on Earth.

24 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 1 Corinthians 15:24

He alone is the Righteous Judge and will decide who is cast into hell and who wil live and reign with Him, until then we will all grow together until the Harvest!


That Day were are looking forward to.

That's not negative, That's the Bible.

What Preterism does, is spiritualize the truth of the plain scriptures, so that all the wicked have already been cast into hell and all of the evil rulers and authorities have been removed.


JLB

If you cannot defend your beliefs without making unjustified statements like this one.......
Just who in this thread has EVER said they believe what you posted here.
"so that all the wicked have already been cast into hell and all of the evil rulers and authorities have been removed."

This is the same type of statement made by politicians in ads to try to make people believe that is what their opponent believes.

 

[ezrider]

What Preterism does, is spiritualize the truth of the plain scriptures, so that all the wicked have already been cast into hell and all of the evil rulers and authorities have been removed.


JLB

A preterist, or partial preterist, or what ever term use use to stereotype those with a special Faith in the Lord do not spiritualize the truth about the plain scriptures, rather they understand the truth as the Spirit has taught them. But seeing that you see things according to the flesh, how should you understand that which is spiritual except the spirit of the Lord instruct you?

Have you not read the book of Revelation, including the last chapter? To me this scripture seems pretty plain and straight forward. No Spiritualizing is neccessary.

Rev 22: Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

Those who live by the Spirit are not appointed unto wrath, but unto salvation.

1 Thes 5:9-10 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

 

[Raelyn]

Awesome. I do like the Post trib view (Jesus only coming once for his folks AFTER tribulation) way more than some crazy stuff going around today. It mimics the Pre Trib View except for some timing issues.

As you said, you found 1st and 2nd events of Jesus coming. Once for the church, once to judge the World after the 7th seal and 7th angelic trumpet.

There are many, many, many reasons why you and I won't be here while God pours out his wrath on the rest of the World that rejected the gospel.

I'll list just one here. I don't want to get it into a long confusing mess.


Reason 1 out of many...................Creatures!!! OH MY.

During the time of the end, God uses an angel to appoint 144,000 to be sent out of Jewish folks.

Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads. And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.
(Rev 7:3-4)

One was given the seal of God and the others were given to Hurt the sea and the Earth. The command was not to touch anything until all the 144,000 were sealed on their foreheads. After that, I guess they could go and trash the place.

And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,
(Rev 7:1-2)

Now, If we are still here at this time, why would God not be concerned about the angels destroying stuff until His Body (Church) Was out of the way? We are told to love our spouse as Christ loves the Church and gave himself for it. The Most important thing and mission right now of the Lord is His body, His precious Church.

One would think if we were here, we would at least be mentioned........ Some think God should have said.......

GOD: "OH, and yea, almost forgot my Son's Church.. ya... Ummm. Go mark the 144,000, then give me a moment to figure out what I am going to do with that other 3.2 billion standing in the way."

During the tribulation the seals and trumpets are sounding together. The seals don't do much but set the environment for the Trumpets and vials. The trumpets are a destructive force from God, but the vials are much worse, destroying most of mankind.

5th Angelic Trumpet:

And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit. And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit. And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power. And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads. And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man. And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.
(Rev 9:1-6)

The fifth angel blows His trumpet. (Notice the scripture numbers angels, not the trumpets, Hence we don't number them at all concerning what Paul said about some last trump which is not one of these angelic trumpets) God calls his church up personally to meet the Lord in the air.

After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.
(Rev 4:1)

COMPARE:

For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
(1Th 4:16)

Back to creatures:

The 5th Angel blows the trumpet and a pit is opened with smoke. It is just like it says, nothing modern to compare. These locust with stingers come out of this pit that smokes so much it darkens the sun. These creatures are to torment everyone "WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE SEAL OF GOD ON THEIR FOREHEADS."

We have the seal of the Holy Spirit, and not on our foreheads. The 144,000 had the seal on their foreheads and the only ones protected from these creatures. Nobody else is protected unless they were sealed on the forehead with the 144,000

Unless God lied and we have to suffer His wrath, we are not here.

God don't lie though...

1 reason out of many there is a pre-Trib rapture.

Hope I kept it simple enough.

Blessings.

I think we are going to see a few things happen before like NOW more fighting who knows.

After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpettalking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.(After what?)

(Rev 4:1) When he told him to come up here I believe thats when the rapture takes place and because after that there are praises and singing and so on . no church mentioned after that.
(Jesus told us to watch for the signs not for the antichrist. I think we will be gone.)
compared
(1Th 4:16)
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: (Only the dead in Christ then the live in Christ not the others just yet. (not till the end)
The imminent appearing is still a good stand. Everything else is numbered 31/2 and 3 1/2 years and in days.
This is the Trump of God not of Angels.


When Jesus starts opening the seals the man on the white horse is the antichrist with a bow, the bow is like the one that God put in the clouds after the flood, as covenant bow saying he would not flood the earth again. according to Strongs.
And I saw, and behold, a white horse, and he that sate on him had a bow, and a crown was given unto him, and he went forth conquering, and to conquer. (The crown he has is different than the ones Jesus wears)
Jesus is the 5th horseman YEY!!!

Daniels prophecy
numbered 31/2 and 3 1/2 years and in days
and when the man of sin enforces a covenant for 7 years and breaks it in the middle(2nd half). 70th week one week of years
People will know who he is when he does this.
I think we will be up up and way just before he is revealed,
9v27
And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease(2 half), and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

2nd half
2 Thess 2 v4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Then run when you see this abomination standing in the Holy Place. (The Temple)
He will set himself up as God


Thess 2
Jesus can separate events like when Jesus read Isaiah. he didn't finish, and the day of vengeance
Luke 4 18The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, ?
19To preach the acceptable year of the Lord. 20And he closed the book,

Isaiah The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;
To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD, and the day of vengeance of our God;(?) to comfort all that mourn;

He didn't finish the scripture why not? It has not happened yet.
Attempting to explain a view is hard so this was what I can remember but not all of it.

He said we will be saved from the time of the tribulation not in the tribulation and when we see these signs beginning to come to pass then look up. I believe many will be saved after it happens too. Tribulation saints and Israel 144,000 will be the remnant sealed.

Im trying.
You have to admit its a view.

As far as timing I have that nailed down in my life.
Either way I know I will see him in my lifetime because I will either die or get raptured Now THAT is a for sure.. So either way it will be in my life time.
I DO NOT WANT to see those ugly creatures either NO NOT! UCK!

Does this make sense to you?

 

[Brother Mike]

I think we are going to see a few things happen before like NOW more fighting who knows.

Jesus said there will be Wars, and rumor of Wars. So just by scripture it will happen.

He also said.......... The end is not yet.

There are so many believers trying to match wars and trouble with scriptures to sound the dooms day gong. We are not looking for those things.

Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
(2Pe 3:3-4)

Through each decade it seems believers have been matching wars and proclaiming the end. Y2K was one of them where many books on the end came out, and not a thing happened.

After we have more major events, many will wonder where is the promise of his coming? Nothing is going down like everyone said and we are like on our 100th Blood moon and yet nothing. (Just saying, that would be a few years down the road)

Jesus said when the Gospel is preached all over the World, then the end comes. Once we reach the World then we have to factor in grace. (Time God allows for everyone to hear and hear and hopefully get it)

The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
(2Pe 3:9-10)

The end is based on man hearing and coming to repentance. It's not based on temples, blood moons or anything else we can walk by sight and see. Something to keep in mind.

Blessings.

 

[follower]

I think we are going to see a few things happen before like NOW more fighting who knows.
.......
When Jesus starts opening the seals the man on the white horse is the antichrist with a bow, the bow is like
.......
2 Thess 2 v4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Then run when you see this abomination standing in the Holy Place. (The Temple)
He will set himself up as God
.......

well, it's(more fighting?) here....... perhaps ...... >> (stumbled upon a recent web announcement) (UNKNOWN SOURCE)
"The set-up for World War Three is complete, the Pope
even announced on Sept 13, 2014 that World War Three has already started."

 

[ezrider]

Jesus said there will be Wars, and rumor of Wars. So just by scripture it will happen.

He also said.......... The end is not yet.

There are so many believers trying to match wars and trouble with scriptures to sound the dooms day gong. We are not looking for those things.

When ever I hear the phrase there shall be wars and rumors of war, and earthquakes in divers places. I can not help but think back to the vision that the Lord gave to Elijah on Mount Horeb. Where the Lord showed him a strong wind, but the Lord was not in that. And then and earthquake and a fire, but the Lord was not in them; then after the still small voice.

1 Kings 9:11-13 And he said, Go forth, and stand upon the mount before the Lord. And, behold, the Lord passed by, and a great and strong wind rent the mountains, and brake in pieces the rocks before the Lord; but the Lord was not in the wind:and after the wind an earthquake; but the Lord was not in the earthquake: And after the earthquake a fire; but the Lord was not in the fire:and after the fire a still small voice. And it was so, when Elijah heard it, that he wrapped his face in his mantle, and went out, and stood in the entering in of the cave. And, behold, there came a voice unto him, and said, What doest thou here, Elijah?

 

[jasonc]

I see your point. What is more important? A piece of land or a person? Jesus died for people. I can see what your saying about it being a mind set to just think Israel is where the Jews are suppose to be, and everyone else, Jewish or not is not really as Jewish as that precious land Israel. It makes sense. Seems to be a big push to "PRAY" for Israel, Help Israel, America is doomed if they turn their back on Israel. What about the folks living here through? I understand.

Blessings.

what I find ironic that isreal does the exact same thing America is warned about ie gay rights, civil unions and abortion and socialism. ben gurion thought highly of lenin at first.

 

[Edward]

The kingdom is not the act of waiting to be transported to someplace else.... it is touching living people's lives, RIGHT HERE AND NOW, with love and the real picture of God, as Jesus showed that likeness to us.

That's the reality of it right there. The Kingdom is within us, around us, and everywhere.
It's a parallel dimension that we can not normally see but we can feel at times
and some see it. This is why they say the Kingdom of heaven is at hand, because it is.
It's not up there or out there, it right here. We are within it, and it within us. What a great thought and reality, though I can't wait to leave this flesh dimension behind, lol

 

[Brother Mike]

what I find ironic that isreal does the exact same thing America is warned about ie gay rights, civil unions and abortion and socialism. ben gurion thought highly of lenin at first.

yea, lets hope God is looking at the Body, and not the government when it comes time to hand out what is deserved to all nations. We certainly just need to focus on the Word, pray for Government, and not get wrapped up in all that. Scripture says if we do good, then those minister of flames won't get us.

When ever I hear the phrase there shall be wars and rumors of war, and earthquakes in divers places. I can not help but think back to the vision that the Lord gave to Elijah on Mount Horeb. Where the Lord showed him a strong wind, but the Lord was not in that. And then and earthquake and a fire, but the Lord was not in them; then after the still small voice.

1 Kings 9:11-13 And he said, Go forth, and stand upon the mount before the Lord. And, behold, the Lord passed by, and a great and strong wind rent the mountains, and brake in pieces the rocks before the Lord; but the Lord was not in the wind:and after the wind an earthquake; but the Lord was not in the earthquake: And after the earthquake a fire; but the Lord was not in the fire:and after the fire a still small voice. And it was so, when Elijah heard it, that he wrapped his face in his mantle, and went out, and stood in the entering in of the cave. And, behold, there came a voice unto him, and said, What doest thou here, Elijah?

Interesting enough, divers (topos) means not more of them, but more of them that targets populated places. Most Earthquakes total are out in the ocean where they don't effect much. CNN posted something a couple years ago saying that Scientist were baffled that there was less out to sea and more hitting inland and populated places. Sort of like Earthquakes were targeting populated places.

Mat 13:8
divers places

Kata Topos.

Kata:
Thayer/Strongs
According to, Toward, concerning, pertaining to.

Topos
Thayer Definition:
1) place, any portion or space marked off, as it were from surrounding space
1a) an inhabited place, as a city, village, district

I don't really like digging into Greek to get meaning, but it was a bit interesting.

 

[jocor]

I fail to miss your point.

I guess that means you got my point.

Do you read Hebrew and Greek?

I read enough to know the word "rapture" is not Hebrew or Greek.

If not are you inspired words?

The English in this sentence makes no sense.

 

[jocor]

The Greek word is Harpazo. Which I posted with it's Greek definition.

The word that evolved into 'rapture' was 'rapiemur'. That's the first person plural, passsive, of the verb 'rapio, rapere', which is translated as 'we....shall....be caught up...'

The parts of the verb are rapio, rapere, rapui, raptus. Its meanings are 'drag off, snatch, destroy, seize, carry off'. The future participle (English does not have an equivalent) is 'rapturus', one form of which is 'raptura'. The future participle translates roughly as 'about to carry off'. From 'raptura' it's a short jump to English 'rapture'.

That's probably more about Latin than you really wanted to know. BTW, the word 'rape' came to English from the same verb. SO if you read the 1 Thess 4:17 passage, you can see what it means and different translations use different words to transliterate it to so it is readable in your language. My point was not yes or no about whether the rapture will occur or when, but that the word rapture does occur in the bible in the Latin translation. Because people seem to want to keep saying that the word rapture isn't in the bible. That's all brother. I'm not here to argue about the rapture, take it for what you will. I just posted information, you should read and come to your own conclusions for yourself. But the word Harpazo is transliterated into the word rapture in at least one translation. No translation is the inspired word of God. Neither is your translation, whichever it may be...??, but what does Harpazo mean to you, in Greek.

Blessings brother.

I agree with Strong's definition of "harpazo".

It is not "transliterated into the word rapture in at least one translation". Harpazo is translated into "rapiemur" which was then semi-transliterated into "rapture". The rapture has come to be associated with living saints being caught up shortly after the dead saints in Messiah are resurrected. I reject that idea as unscriptural.

 

[Deborah13]

I guess that means you got my point.

I read enough to know the word "rapture" is not Hebrew or Greek.

The English in this sentence makes no sense.

Yike! Where was I when I wrote that post!!

Restated:
I fail to get or understand your point about the Latin not being inspired because.....
Unless one is fluid in the original Hebrew and Greek texts......
All other languages are translations including English, Latin, German, French, etc...
Besides that even the copies we have in the original languages are just that, copies.

You said,
"The Vulgate is just a translation. If it is not in the Greek or Hebrew, then "rapture" is not an inspired word."

I don't think that Greek is anymore inspired than any other language. It was what was 'said' by the writers that was inspired. Paul could have said those words in Greek or German it wouldn't have mattered as far being inspired goes.

Maybe I miss understood your point?

 

[Brother Mike]

I agree with Strong's definition of "harpazo".

It is not "transliterated into the word rapture in at least one translation". Harpazo is translated into "rapiemur" which was then semi-transliterated into "rapture". The rapture has come to be associated with living saints being caught up shortly after the dead saints in Messiah are resurrected. I reject that idea as unscriptural.

The word is in the bible. The rapiemur is where the english word Rapture came from, which has a different meaning of ecstasy or something like that. It means snatched suddenly.

It's really nit picking though. I like the Latin Vulgate, despite not knowing a bit of Latin.

what are your reasons for not buying into some Rapture? or should I ask if you lean toward pretreizm? Post tribbers I can talk to. Same thing, just different time slots. Preterist though means digging through whole levels of stuff.

Blessings.

 

[reba]

Most orthodox preterist i know are post trib

 

[JLB]

The word is in the bible. The rapiemur is where the english word Rapture came from, which has a different meaning of ecstasy or something like that. It means snatched suddenly.

It's really nit picking though. I like the Latin Vulgate, despite not knowing a bit of Latin.

what are your reasons for not buying into some Rapture? or should I ask if you lean toward pretreizm? Post tribbers I can talk to. Same thing, just different time slots. Preterist though means digging through whole levels of stuff.

Blessings.

The Rapture and Resurrection are one event Brother.

One Event!

The Gathering!

All of those who are Christ's will be Gathered together.

The Resurrected Ones and The Raptured ones are Gather together, at His Coming.

Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:17

All the saints, at His Coming.

There is no 7 year gap here, between the rapture and the Resurrection, it's One Event.


Now please explain to me how you think the resurrection of the dead will happen before the tribulation?

Please list the scriptures that show the Resurrection of the dead in Christ wil happen before the tribulation.


JLB